Stolen business name?

Floyd, I think he means "Live Chat", the support option with Linden Lab, not "live chat" with you.

That is when i aquired the rest of the sim, yes, the other half was mine earlier than that, but i don't see any relevancy in that

I don't know what the position is in the USA, but certainly in the UK we have companies called "National Tires," "Budget Car Rental" and suchlike.

My bad

Here's a pretty "lay" interpretation of US Trademark restrictions (surprisingly, from a UK website):

http://www.adslogans.co.uk/ww/prvwis10.html

All right, from my experience with forums in general, if a thread is not clear after 10 pages, it will never be. So I will make my final statement here.

As stated in first place, I don't plan to change the name.

If Phil wants to challenge that, he is free to do that with LL or through a lawyer in real life, i am ready to dispute the legality of my actions.

In fact, I just had a very meaningful conversation with somebody that has a business law degree, even though she doesn't practice it. The degree is from the States, so it might be different in other places, but generally speaking at least it's a benchmark.
PrimSavers and Prim Savers are two different things. Period.

If Phil is a serious and honest business owner, it will be very easy for him to prove in a court of law that he paid taxes for last 2 and half years on income from Prim Savers. Of course, I would ask for such proof in court of law if he chooses to go that way. After he proves that, and shows a trademark of the name in UK, he will be the uncontested legal owner of the rights for "Prim Savers" entity in UK.

Talking this in a forum is childish and unprofessional.

Of course he will know more people than me here after being active in this forum for 2.5 years, and its' not hard to produce few people that would sing his praise.

The "mine is bigger than yours" tactic will not work with me, I'm sorry.

If I had any inclination towards maybe changing the name, after these 11 pages I decided not to. What is the right thing to do is a subjective matter and you could think one way, while I can think differently. What is the legal way, the Phil way (from what I understand) it's on my side.

Please feel free to challenge this with LL and with any court of law you might choose.

This is my final statement.

Sling - give it up....2 years chasing someone around Resident Answers Forum is more than enough.!! I would even call it harassment now! Every single post in so many different threads.....it's like a full on campaign to discredit someone (not only you...but you & Kitty are by far and away the worst offenders!)


Let me tell you something about those Traffic bots.....at the height of those debates before it became against the LL TOS.....i went into LL "Live Chat" and asked whether i could a place a number of Bots on my land for the sole purpose of bumping up my Traffic count in order to compete In Places Search rankings".....you want to know what the LL reply was? The Linden basically told me i could do exactly that providing it did not break any of the TOS conditions....such as hogging SIM resources or used for Harassment..otherwise it was ok to use them in that way and thereby artificially inflating my Traffic Score.
For the record like Marcel, i never ever used Traffic Bots nor did i like them.....but it goes to show that at that particular time in SL regardless of ethics , fairplay or morality.....gaming traffic with Bots had LL's blessing!......hence the 20k or 30k Traffic bots around the Grid.

So a fast food restaurant could call themselves "Mc Donalds" (with a space) and there would be no issue? How about a soft drink company called "CocaCola" (no space, with the hyphen missing)? Always wanted to sell stuffed mice and call the company "WaltDisney"... now I know nothing will happen to me.

Oh well. I can't say that it wasn't expected. I believe that you were never open to the discussion and never even considered the possibility of changing your business name and doing the right thing, but I did hope.

For what it's worth, I haven't invited anyone into this thread, or even told anyone that it's happening. I don't consider it childish to ask people for their opinions. That's what forums are for. The concensus of the people in the thread is that it is wrong to carry on using PrimSavers but the concensus can't change anything. There is no concensus on the legalities though because we are not all experts. I know that it's wrong, and I am absolutely certain that it's legally wrong - as Starfire so ably demonstrated.

Rene: give it up

Sling knows all about LL being asked about traffic bots more than once, and she knows the answers that they gave. She's not interested in truth. She's only interested in pushing her own personal agenda, which is shared by a small number of very vocal people here. And you know as well as I do that she makes things up to further her agenda.

LL has NEVER endorsed the use of traffic gaming tactics. The citing of ONE low-level Linden saying otherwise to a specific use doesn't make it so, either.

It NEVER had LL's "blessing" any more than Microparcel extortion had LL's blessing, yet there were Lindens quoted by the parasites left and right that they "weren't doing anything against the ToS".

Not everything "legal" (or not declared illegal yet) is moral or ethical.

I can't say that I blame him not dealing with you, personally.



Are you nuts? You invited EVERYONE into this thread, simply by posting it.

It isn't childish to ask a question, but you didn't do it just to ask a question, you also did it to pander to sympathy (with arguably dubious results).

Get .. a .. lawyer.

There's a UK company called Easy Jet. They also have Easy Hotels. People have tried to start businesses using "Easy", such as Easy This and Easy That. They always take legal action against those businesses for using the word "Easy", if they don't change their names, and they always win. The reason being that "Easy [This]" gives the impression of being associated with the Easy Jet company. Exact name copies are not the only trademark infringements. I am absolutely certain that PrimSavers would lose a legal action here, and I have no doubt that the same would be true in the U.S.

I just had this Brilliant idea.

I am going to start a company: IBM - It's Briana's Machines! And i will produce personal computers and sell them!

How original!

With each new post from Floyd...the picture is becoming clearer as are his intentions! Enuff said!


.

How much will you be selling them for? I might be interested in buying one.

/me waits for Phil to start a magazine publishing business called It's Phil's Company!

LL will probably say they won't get involved.

What about Xsite or SexJen?

They aren't legally obligated to until they get a court order.

Hm??? You are not quoting my post... I finished posting...

Yes it did....i'll take the word of a Linden employee over a Forum know-it-all any day of the week. How do you know he was low level or not.....you don't even know which Linden I spoke to. Are you saying every LL employee that works in support are low-level? LL blessed or tolerated Traffic Bots until they thought otherwise.

The proof is in the pudding...you want to see how many Traffic Bots are still left on the Grid still gaming Traffic.....look at Places Search results or map the Grid....it sure doesn't look like a matter of urgency 10 mths on!

If LL were really that concerned about Gaming traffic, they could have blitzed the Grid over a period of a few weeks...problem solved!

This doesn't pass the smell test.

Note that NOTHING in my post refered to legality or illegality. None of my argument was dependent upon "a legal standpoint".

Using "ZhuZhu Hamster" after claiming that no Search turned it up; using "i Phone" or "i Pod" after claiming that no Search turned up those names; using "GeneralElectric" for appliances or "CitiGroup" for financial products or "PrimSavers" for SL virtual furniture---no, the users of said names are NOT behaving ethically. They did NOT do genuine due diligence.

The fame or lack of fame of the name in question is irrelevant. Even if the business isn't as well known as Coca Cola or Hewlett-Packard, someone looking for a name for their own business is NOT excused--ethically*--from checking variations. If I name my hypothetical pizza-delivery business "HotNFast Pizza", and there is an established business in my city called "Hot N Fast Pizza"---even if it's NOT 'famous'---then I can't claim I've performed due diligence in finding that name.

And if Hot N Fast askes me to change my business name, and I refuse on the grounds that "HotNFast Pizza and Hot N Fast Pizza are two different things. Period"----then I'm being an unethical jerk.

Period.




*and possibly 'legally' as well. But that's not the argument I'm making here.

I wonder if Wrigley would see the humor in that.

While Second Life microbusinesses may not have the financial means to pursue trademark infringement, Wrigley probably does.

Since I personally know Floyd and therefor I get to put my two cents in woohoo. Ok first off if you had spoken to Floyd like and adult and not be so hostile then you would have gotten a better response from him. Second would you like some cheese with that whine?!? I have been in sl over 3 years and guess what there is over 100's of thousands different shops so people don't always find every shop when they search. So chance of him actually coming across your is very slim. Because you search the words prim savers see what you get haha. I'm going to be mean here and blunt your made because his creations are better quality then yours so people are giving him more traffic then you. That's not his fault your creations suck. Sorry just being honest. You should look into updating your creation instead of trying to start crap. Ok that is pretty much all I have to say for now.