The Lord of the Flies - Child AVs and the Nursery Syndrome

I was an only child... The neighbor kids were my sisters and brothers. (T_T)

Looking on the bright side... Any potential issue with incest never came up. =^-^=

But this sounds like more your, and Jig's problems than anyone elses.

Why should your inability to live and let live effect my ability to do as I please in SL?

And couldn't the exact same arguments be used against Dragon AVs or Furry AVs? They make me uncomfortable so they should be segregated?

Its a silly argument. Its your problem, you should deal with it as best you see fit without infringing upon anyone elses ability to enjoy SL their way.

Handy

I know several child avs who are parents. If it were safe to name names here I would tell you so you could go talk to them about your assumptions.

Handy

OMG Argent, you make me want to get a Ferret now!

Handy

Well, I was certainly "fraught" when I was a teen in real. So was my Mum - which is why I was born. The image presented by many slers of teen as a time of innocence and virgin growth went out with the ice age. Nowadays (and my age group included in this) we are more aware, but I can't speak for USA teens and people who may be a different social class or education level. But that doesnt answer the teen who rebels like my Mum does it? Then again, she had support around her and healthy lifestyle and positive attitude when she needed it.
But, to those who may be older than myself - our sex education classes were a little "biological" at times but really helped us.

No, you misunderstand. I myself had a delightful childhood. And there was certainly no sexual abuse.

I simply think that the story of the street kid who lives among the dregs of society, and yet maintains his or her basic integrity, is good theater.

Once again...when you say that you see a child av standing next to a whorehouse and your gorge rises...the problem is not with the child av. The problem is with YOU. You are attributing motivations and intentions to that person that may very well not exist.

(I am not denying that they MAY exist, either. If they do...IF they do...then you have a basis for saying "stop that".)

When I meet anyone, in RL or SL, I *try* to not have preconceptions based on their appearance. It's not always easy and of course I don't always succeed. But I have had some very satisfying experiences, like when I saw a huge, scary biker's face break into a relieved smile because SOMEBODY finally said hello. (That was RL, btw.)

It's always astonishing and [sorry for the word, but] it's wonderful when people are nothing like what you expect.

At one of my jobs we had to go through sensitivity training. One man who was fairly provincial was trying to convey his discomfort to another man who was openly gay. He said, "The thing is, I don't know how your type want to be treated."

The other man said, "How about like people?"

I don't meet child avatars very often, but when I do I try to treat them as if they didn't roll off an assembly line. I don't assume that they all have the same motivations and goals or that I know what they're going to do or say. Because I don't.

I talk to pretty much everybody I meet in SL, even if - and sometimes especially when - their appearance puts me off.

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Oh yeah about this line:


If you read the guidelines you'd be aware that Zindra has more lax limitations with what one can do with and on their land, but this still does not mean running around on anyone else's property or on Linden locations in the same manner unless it's clear you may.

The Internet and virtual communities such as Second Life celebrate diversity. If someone feels that it's okay to explore something different but no one else can, then they're not being very rebellious, openminded or visionary in the least.

It sounds to me that such a separatist view may be best suited for a private estate and not the Mainland. There you can be as controlling over your view as you'd like, as well as how much libido anyone can exercise anywhere within those borders.

Well, its pretty obvious playing the child here is really "Peter Pan Syndrome". And, as Hal points out (I think) it satisfies teh "Mothering Urge" for some women (NOT me!) and the need to be mothered for others (if Mummy is rich and generous with allowance start mothering me!)

But, speaking as a woman who has had a happy childhood, been raised in a liberal and "switched on" home, with all mod. cons. etc and tons of in-family discussions of sex and stuff that we all need to know - and growing up fast in our society, well ... I dont wanna be a kid again and I dont ever wanna be a Mummy and I mix with kids coz so FEW of my friends have them. I don't need the "bellybump" to know I''m attractive and on the right wavelength. I just think it's healthy that way.

I think parents should have licenses before they are allowed to have kids.

I just want to say that this has been a very interesting read for me.

Some very well thought out arguments and positions by some very intelligent and well spoken individuals. Very thought provoking indeed.

As some of you know I used to play a Child AV. For a long while it was the most wonderful thing I've done in SL. I looked forward to logging in as my 12 year old Handy and exploring and playing with my friends through the eyes of a child-like avatar.

However, as my time went on I began to realize and understand the feelings of some toward child avs, the dangers around every corner, I began to feel fear.

I have a lot of money invested in my avatar, and even more emotion. The mere thought that while shopping (my favorites SL activity) I could be AR'd and lose all of that was unbearable to me.

I will buck the system in RL from time to time, if I feel passionately enough about it.

However in this instance I chose to "grow-up" instead of risk losing everything.

It was very sad for me, and some of my friends still miss the little Handy. But my fear is gone and I'm able to enjoy SL a little more now.

Its a sad compromise but in the end the right choice for ME at the time.

I hope one day it will be safe to be a child in SL again and I can resurrect little Handy.

Till then I'll enjoy my sl as 109 year old elf

Handy

I'll answer you specifically, because the others who have commented have not really understood my point either and the thread (not ME) is getting muddled up.

I made a single very simple point. You said that accurate teen rp would not involve sexuality; I disagreed and said it would.

I posted the teen pregnancy article summary to point out the prevalence of teen sex in the USA as an immediately relevant example - remember that pregnancy is only the tip of the iceberg, and some of the figures cited amazed me.

Pep (I suppose I just wanted to highlight that it is impossible to rp being a teenager accurately in sl because LL's rules prevent it.)

Teen pregnancy rates are shockingly high and is really one of my "things" that is one of my "causes" - we must get girls to realize that a baby is NOT doll - sl doesnt help in that way - we reinforce dolls by being children - it's symptomatic

I have pointed out before that my comments did not suggest that there were no exceptions to my general observation.

Pep (One swallow doesn't make a summer. )

True, but absent any real information, your generalization is just a theory, no? (Theory is sometimes a polite way of saying "guess"

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Hey, Jig, I don't see how these two dots got connected.

First off, we are supposedly adults here on the grid. Secondly, in real life, many of my ex-girlfriends (25 and older!!) played with dolls. A couple of them had no desire to have children neither.

Anyway, I would guess that most teens get preggers cause they horny, not cause they want a babydoll.

It is similarly impossible to rp being a dragon, an elf, a Gorean master, or even (*gasp*) a ferret in SL accurately.

Your point?

You must be jokng of course. Do you know how many young women want something to hold and cuddle and cherish? You know how hard it is for people like myself to change "the system from within" this? -I REALLY do try and be a role model and provide some inspiration in a real situation even if I come off here as an airhead. But the desire for children even when economically ill-advided and downright dangerous to education and health is ingrained in teens.

MEN are no better - the abandonment of young girls by their over-sexed and stupid mates is shocking. Young men need bromide pills or have their lollies plugged till their 30.

Must go - now I must suffer for my art and be gymed.

I wasn't joking in the least.



It would be an exercise in futility to try to change something so fundamental and necessary in our species as the desire to reproduce.



Opportunity for education and advancement for women is something I think we both agree on.



Sigh It doesn't make it any easier for males to evolve when women insist on promoting these kind of stereotypes, hmmm?

My point was that someone else said it WAS possible to rp a teen accurately without sexual elements intervening. I disagreed.

Pep (And of course since there are no rl parallels to the examples you quote, there is no way to judge the "accuracy" of rp regarding them. )

Actually -- (*surprised!*) -- I agree.

If women start treating men like "grown ups," then they are more likely to start behaving that way. And yes, I have been guilty of not doing this as well.

There are no RL ferrets????

I take your point then. All RP is by definition a compromise, a sort of "polite fiction." And I suspect that sex is culturally important enough that it is going to have to be a big part of RPing just about anything. Even dragons, elves, and . . . ferrets.

Perhaps I should point out that Pep is not actually short for Pserendipity . . .

Pep ( . . . but Peter Pan. )

None that can type.

Pep (nor repeat the same jokes persistently.)

Ahem. Which was, surely, my point . . . ?

I think it was actually *my* point . . .

Pep ( . . . and don't call me Shirley! )