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SL5B - No Kid Avatars, please!

Ordinal Malaprop
really very ordinary
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,607
06-14-2008 15:29
From: Ceera Murakami
kids together with animals (a furry child riding a Shetland pony in SL, or playing fetch with a puppy)

Sick, sick, sick. Imagine if Sky News saw that. Delete yourself immediately.
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Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
06-14-2008 16:32
From: Ceera Murakami
Well, I have now been told, by a VERY sympathetic and apologetic volunteer SL5B staff member, that the following G-Rated image is not allowed for display as-is at SL5B. Specifically, it is not allowed because E------ L----- says you can't have ANY image that has an adult and a child avatar in the same image on display at SL5B, regardless of context, no exceptions...



A mother and child, in full-dress Kimonos, clothed from toes to wrist and neck, not touching or even looking at each other...

So... Here is how it will be in my display... They are not "displayed in the same image". And they are separated by fireworks...



I guess SL5B is rated E... for "As censored by E------".

I wonder how they will manage to show the history of SL Birthday celebrations exhibit. Most of the historical images of past SL birthday celebrations will surely have both adult avatars and kid avatars in the same scenes.
What s shame. Although I do think your solution is brilliant. It's a great picture. and could hardly be more innocent. I guess they figure it's easier to make a blanket rule that to pass judgment on each one.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
06-14-2008 21:55
I don't see an Adult or a Child in that picture. I see a big Furry and a Little Furry. But I have been drinking tonight.
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Sansarya Caligari
BLEH!
Join date: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 1,206
06-14-2008 22:34
From: Ordinal Malaprop
Sick, sick, sick. Imagine if Sky News saw that. Delete yourself immediately.


:D You are always worth reading
Sansarya Caligari
BLEH!
Join date: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 1,206
06-14-2008 22:37
Oh, and maybe this new Linden rule is why beds are disappearing all over the grid tonight ;)

(don't take me seriously, I just spent hours reading about DMCA's, SexGen™ and sculptie babies poofing)
sacha Magne
Bratty Kitsune Boy
Join date: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 81
06-15-2008 02:33
We still have some booth availible in our sims (kids5b) availible.

We will be pleased to welcome any of you as long as your booth represents kids and adults :)

Contact me or Rai Fargis or Marie for more details.

Sacha
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I didn't do it ! Honest !
Sling Trebuchet
Deleted User
Join date: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 4,548
06-15-2008 04:03
LL are okay with the idea of the sensationalist media visiting SL5B and displaying images of adult and child avatars together on their screens, capturing those screens and making video records thereof for rebroadcast in their sensationalist reports.

However if there should happen be an image in the background showing much the same thing as the full-screen image..... the sky falls in.

What if the image in the background were a real-time video or time-lapsed shots of the SL5B build? That would be banned under the rule.


I would be fascinated, totally fascinated in a sick voyeuristic way, to observe the muppet who dreamt up this sort of rule going about his daily business. It would be like watching an alien from a far distant galaxy, or watching an earthly insect. "WTF is it doing??"
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Maggie: We give our residents a lot of tools, to build, create, and manage their lands and objects. That flexibility also requires people to exercise judgment about when things should be used.
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Solomon Devoix
Used Register
Join date: 22 Aug 2006
Posts: 496
06-15-2008 12:48
Well, now the well-known and respected Desmond Shang is a sort-of victim in this, too:

http://razorblade-cookies.blogspot.com/2008/06/hes-cold-hearted-snake-look-into-his.html

A painting of him standing next to a short -- not child, just short -- avatar has been banned from the celebration.

This is just insane.
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From: Jake Black
I dont know what the actual answer is.. I just know LLs response was at best...flaccid.
From: Solomon Devoix
That's a very good way to put it, and now I know why we still haven't seen the promised blog entry...

...the Lindens are still waiting for their shipment of Lie-agra to come in to firm up their flaccid reasoning.
hope Antonelli
Registered User
Join date: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 155
06-15-2008 13:06
As far as I'm concerned, any incentive to attend any part of this contrived PR event has been killed completely. Even if they were to let slip that the 'big announcement' is a free month's tier for eveyone that shows up I wouldnt be there. I've been in SL for 2+ years now and have seen it go from something magical to a heavily censored, bigoted 'game' where LL holds all the cards over our heads. I'm just waiting for the next axe to fall. I'm a strange combination of conservative Republican who owns a Gorean sim and considers herself to be very open-minded in case anyone gets ideas of the ultra-liberals being offended again. "Our world our imgaination?" maybe a year ago...those days are long gone...we've been sold out to big business who can't afford to have anything even remotely controversial associated with their brand.
Ordinal Malaprop
really very ordinary
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,607
06-15-2008 13:12
From: Solomon Devoix
Well, now the well-known and respected Desmond Shang is a sort-of victim in this, too:

http://razorblade-cookies.blogspot.com/2008/06/hes-cold-hearted-snake-look-into-his.html

A painting of him standing next to a short -- not child, just short -- avatar has been banned from the celebration.

This is just insane.

The _fiend_. I always knew that there was something distinctly untoward about him and now this - _standing next to a short avatar_. The next thing you know, he will be associating with tinies; it is a slippery slope.
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sacha Magne
Bratty Kitsune Boy
Join date: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 81
*** Asylum ***
06-15-2008 13:33
As Kid5B sim owner,

I offer spaces for anyone who want to show his/her arts that contain a kid.

This is madness.


Sacha
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I didn't do it ! Honest !
Sling Trebuchet
Deleted User
Join date: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 4,548
06-15-2008 13:39
From: Solomon Devoix
Well, now the well-known and respected Desmond Shang is a sort-of victim in this, too:

http://razorblade-cookies.blogspot.com/2008/06/hes-cold-hearted-snake-look-into-his.html

A painting of him standing next to a short -- not child, just short -- avatar has been banned from the celebration.

This is just insane.



It seems clear to me that LL management has totally panicked and has handed decision making over to the lawyers.
Say goodbye to any hope of common sense or anything remotely close to what most people would consider as sanity.

I wouldn't be surprised to see a sort of sledgehammer MLP-type decision.

How about:
No avatar under x metres in height can be rendered.
Edit: An avatar can not be sized or modified to be less that x metres in height
Yes, that means you too R2D2

Linden Lab - Helping People to Grow






Is there a repository of actual quotes from LL on this topic?
A sort of TAOughts of Linden?
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Maggie: We give our residents a lot of tools, to build, create, and manage their lands and objects. That flexibility also requires people to exercise judgment about when things should be used.
http://www.ace-exchange.com/home/story/BDVR/589
Ordinal Malaprop
really very ordinary
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,607
06-15-2008 13:44
I doubt that lawyers are making these decisions - at least ones who are at all competent - given that there is no legal issue. This smells of sheer irrational panic.
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http://ordinalmalaprop.com/engine/ - An Engine Fit For My Proceeding, my Aethernet Journal

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Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
06-15-2008 14:05
Perhaps U.S. Representative Mark Kirk is making the decisions. After all it won't help his fear and loathing political appeal to have innocent images of child avatars bandied about.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Har Fairweather
Registered User
Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
06-15-2008 14:24
From: Ordinal Malaprop
I doubt that lawyers are making these decisions - at least ones who are at all competent - given that there is no legal issue. This smells of sheer irrational panic.


Actually, this smells more of a repressed pedophile making decisions about this in LL.

Maybe this insanity will acquire a bad enough smell to out the bugger.
Sling Trebuchet
Deleted User
Join date: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 4,548
06-15-2008 14:29
I'm still totally gobsmacked by the logic of SL5B image rules.

An image of something that is allowed is not allowed if it appears as a separate image within an image that is allowed.

BUT:
What if the embedded image of the something allowed contained within itself yet another image of something allowed?
Would that extra level of embedding cancel out the problem?

In other words, would it be allowed to embed an image of something that is allowed within an image that would have been allowed had it not contained in turn an image of something that is allowed?

Add for clarification:
The image of the allowed would in this case be embedded in the image of the allowed that was already embedded in the image that was allowed but that had caused the image in which it was embedded to be disallowed because it was embedded in the allowed. This is entirely different to simply embedding the image of the allowed within the image of the allowed other than within the embedded image of the allowed.
_____________________
Maggie: We give our residents a lot of tools, to build, create, and manage their lands and objects. That flexibility also requires people to exercise judgment about when things should be used.
http://www.ace-exchange.com/home/story/BDVR/589
Toy LaFollette
I eat paintchips
Join date: 11 Feb 2004
Posts: 2,359
06-15-2008 14:42
Actually Mark Kirk doesnt care as long as he gets votes
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Kaimi Kyomoon
Kah-EE-mee
Join date: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 5,664
06-15-2008 14:56
From: Toy LaFollette
Actually Mark Kirk doesnt care as long as he gets votes
Yeah I'm pretty sure that's his only concern. He seems to think he can increase the number of votes he gets by making SL seem like a den of child molesting sin that he can crusade against. Innocent SL pictures could impede that strategy.
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Kaimi's Normal Wear

From: 3Ring Binder
i think people are afraid of me or something.
Virrginia Tombola
Equestrienne
Join date: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 938
06-15-2008 15:11
From: Solomon Devoix
Well, now the well-known and respected Desmond Shang is a sort-of victim in this, too:

http://razorblade-cookies.blogspot.com/2008/06/hes-cold-hearted-snake-look-into-his.html

A painting of him standing next to a short -- not child, just short -- avatar has been banned from the celebration.

This is just insane.



THIS painting?

http://bp1.blogger.com/_nIrhbal9Zl4/SE_GM_Z1JTI/AAAAAAAAAAY/dvaoEFxs_FU/s1600-h/Strandcover.jpg

Good lord, what sort of strange person could see anything other than whimsy there?
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Horses, Carriages, Modern and Historical Riding apparel. Ride a demo horse, play whist, or just loiter. I'm fair used to loiterers.

http://slurl.com/secondlife/Caledon%20Eyre/48%20/183/23/
Sling Trebuchet
Deleted User
Join date: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 4,548
06-15-2008 15:35
From: Virrginia Tombola
THIS painting?

http://bp1.blogger.com/_nIrhbal9Zl4/SE_GM_Z1JTI/AAAAAAAAAAY/dvaoEFxs_FU/s1600-h/Strandcover.jpg

Good lord, what sort of strange person could see anything other than whimsy there?


Somebody's loins must have been stirred.




The strange thing is:
The group of avatars or nar copies of them could go to the SL5B event and stage that grouping.
This apparently would not be a problem.
_____________________
Maggie: We give our residents a lot of tools, to build, create, and manage their lands and objects. That flexibility also requires people to exercise judgment about when things should be used.
http://www.ace-exchange.com/home/story/BDVR/589
Tristin Mikazuki
Sarah Palin ROCKS!
Join date: 9 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,012
06-15-2008 15:45
Everyone should replace the pics in thier profiles with them standing next to a BUNCH of kids :D

Ya if this is true gawd its PAST dumb... maybe the BBC would love to do a storey about LL's panic lol
I'd bet the reporters would drop over laughing thier butts off lol
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Marianne McCann
Feted Inner Child
Join date: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 7,145
06-15-2008 16:04


That's the one
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"There's nothing objectionable nor illegal in having a child-like avatar in itself and we must assume innocence until proof of the contrary." - Lewis PR Linden
"If you find children offensive, you're gonna have trouble in this world :)" - Prospero Linden
Tristin Mikazuki
Sarah Palin ROCKS!
Join date: 9 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,012
06-15-2008 16:07
As insane as this is getting I'm really starting to think they are on the way of getting rid of kid av's...
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Amity Slade
Registered User
Join date: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 2,183
06-15-2008 16:13
Are you sure the picture was excluded because it had a child in it?

I think there is a more likely, very clear violation of the policy on SL5B presentations.

The robot in that picture is obviously male, and is shirtless.

Two of those bolts on the robot's torso look suspiciously like man-nipples.
Virrginia Tombola
Equestrienne
Join date: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 938
06-15-2008 16:34
Well, just for the record, the "little girl" in the painting is Miss Cornelia Rothschild, who portrays a clockwork girl, not a child. As she puts it more bluntly on her blog, she has a slender woman's shape, not a child's, thank you very much.

Not that it would matter in the slightest if she DID choose to portray a child in a Victorian world. Are we going to ban Alice in Wonderland and the Wizard of Oz next?

While we're on the subject, in RL, "Gryffin Hax" has done children's book illustrations professionally. I don't think having a painting removed from an exhibition because someone feels it is inappropriately sexual is necessarily something he will appreciate.

I am more than a touch irritable about this.
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Horses, Carriages, Modern and Historical Riding apparel. Ride a demo horse, play whist, or just loiter. I'm fair used to loiterers.

http://slurl.com/secondlife/Caledon%20Eyre/48%20/183/23/
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