does anyone know the LL position on depictions of sexual violence?

I have a feeling sexualoligists(sp?) will disagree.

Just because it is objectual to practice it (just plainly wrong and iligal) does not make it less valid, luckely the fast majorety are able to controll themselfs and find harmless outlets. And no sexual ageplay is not one of those outlets (before that confusion pops back up again) because all parties involved know all are adult.

The realisation that it is all roleplay is what is lacking in most people that objet to violent or abnormal play in SL, they somehow think that what they see is what is realy happening, nomatter if it a furry hunting down a mate or a gangbang in an abandoned warehouse or whatever else you can come across in SL.

To some people it is just pixels and r/p to some it's more real in some way, we hear assertions from both sides. So at least we should grant both as valid.

I agree that consenting and stable adults have the ability to delve into pretty much anything and keep it on a decent level.

What concerns me, is the people that can't.

All this sexuality stuff is unproven and pretty much unprovable and never is it one size fits all.

I think the answer to this is really very simple. Rape, by its very nature, isn't consensual. Therefore, domination fantasies aren't rape and shouldn't be referred to as such. Doing so is frankly insulting and potentially traumatizing to real survivors of sexual abuse. LL could easily ban glorification of rape without preventing people from engaging in consensual activities.

The only search results "rape" should yield should be awareness groups and support groups for survivors.

Yay, thought control! "Are you thinking the right words?"

You will provide links to the first?

Yes, those pesky jurors, believing the man over the woman, maybe we should jail them for not returning the "correct" verdict.

It isn't kept under control very well, all of politics and government is based on violence, lust and envy.

Yep! And "who" makes the laws that say this stuff is bad for us?

I agree about the consensual part and get what your saying about the weakening of the word's meaning with other uses. Rape fantasies, like them or hate them are sexual tastes and people will use the word there.

But I don't think stuff like "I'll rape that hamburger" instead of "I'll eat it" are funny at all.

It's worth also criticizing misuse by attitudes that while claiming to support rape victims actually just bring more stress and alienate them and the issue more.

I wonder if the OP will support one known way to lower the number of actual rapes, namely allowing women easy access to and the right to carry firearms? Like it or not, on average, men are stronger than women. Allowing a woman to have the means to defend herself is the best way to lower the number of rapes, not thought control. When concealed carry laws are passed, the rate of rapes in that area drop.

I agree with you in more ways than you know or probably understand. (=_=)

Children... REAL children are easily influenced. Up to a certain age, everything is accepted as truth and fact, even if they argue and deny it. Bet it the easter bunny, Santa, the tooth fairy, and even "it's okay for Uncle Lumpylap to touch you there." It's dangerous ground that adults should never tread upon since it can lead to many forms of psychological suffering as time passes. (=_=)

But, what I talked about had nothing to do with sex with children. Children are NOT involved with what I do, RL and SL. What I do is play the victim in a fantasy/role play environment. The victim I prefer to play is one of a malleable mind, still exploring new ideas, often making mistakes and having to be corrected by my partner. In RL, if I could still be a child, I would be perpetually. I have been behaving the way I am now since I was about 7. I'll spare you the details as of why. But, it is ~MY~ comfort zone. I can't dominate. I can't lead. I can't be the "adult" in the situation. I feel out of place when I have to be.

So, yes, I have a kink. It has nothing to do with sex with children. But it does involve child-like behaviour on my part. And, as I said, I operate within the TOS/CS so there ARE things that I won't involve myself in even though I'm aware of them.

I'm not the one creeping you out. Your own closed-minded hypocrisy is.

http://www.canlaw.com/rights/thumbrul.htm

From the opening paragraph:

She often reads my posts. (^_^)

I knew it was false, I just wanted to see her evidence.

I've had some offer me links and it was all circular... one site referencing another and another in the equivalent of a chain letter spam based evidence.

I've noticed many of those that claim to be working for the common good as feminsts laugh off any hint that a male might have the same problem.

I know two guys who quit working at one location because the female manager was sexually harassing them almost to the point of molesting. But the complaints they filed were ignored because guys don't get sexually harassed

It's like the comment above on the percentage of guys that get breast cancer, they still get it... to shrug it off because it's a lower risk is an insult against those battling it.

It's like thinking a guy doesn't get raped, it happens... rarely does a woman that does it get convicted because the jurors are like "he's a guy, he enjoyed it".

The only times a woman gets convicted it makes national headlines....

The numbers are hard to come by, but some sources believe that if you count prison rapes, males are raped more than women each year.

True, by both men and women (like many I hear don't believe a woman can rape a man or other woman...).

But it's been degraded to the point they don't come forth... a woman has a support network in place should she come forward. But good luck finding people to help a guy get over being taken advantage of by a woman... hell one of my buddies is paying child support to the woman that put viagra and roofies in a drink (both showed up in the toxicology test) but the law still makes him pay her for the child (a single male here can't get custody... the mother's mom keeps the kid, and he only sees her once a month... the mom is usually out running the streets now that her 1 year, yes 1 year probation is over... okay back on topic, rant over)

The feminist movement now a days is like the affirmative action stuff... it does more harm than good. There is still problems, but they mainly stir up trouble and controversy vs actually trying to fix things... Because it's more power to them if they don't get it all fixed, once thigns are fixed... there is no need for them and the power they have is ziltch.

I guess still a little sore... turned down because I was a white male at a couple jobs... because they needed a female to balance out the gender ratio or a minority for the racial balance... go social change! >.<

As a matter of fact, I think that is quite a funny variation on "I could murder a hamburger". True, it's ridiculous hyperbole but the Portnoy-style image that sprang to mind made me chuckle.

I have to ask why it is that few would bat an eyelid at the metaphor of homicide but substituting it with rape is somehow distasteful?

Yeh interesting question, why not? Also what Chris and Shane are on about too.

Well your first and last sentences were not so friendly. First of all - please do not presume to know what I understand. *I* understand a lot more in your post than you might think as well.



Lol. Call me 'hypocrite' if you wish - NAMBLA calls people who are against rape or sex with children, "sex fascists." Shrugs.

First of all I don't recall saying "creeping out" - sex with children even as roleplay speaks to very deep issues and it's well past 'creeping me out'. Concern is the first reaction actually. And I get a sense you are working through some things. But I have to say, also, wanting to be a child forever isn't functional - the world used to think it was cute when Michael Jackson made "Neverland," too. And it was so sweet how he wanted to be a perpetual child. Thing is, he wasn't.

"Childlike behavior" is one thing - wanting to function as a child in a sexual context is quite another. And it *is* different because 'adult rape play' is about submission really - but between two adults. What is child rape play about?? Sex with children. Period. How is that ever a psychologically healthy, functional goal?

Again I understand you are working some things out - as it sounds from the subtext in your post - but I'd really question it further or on a sustained basis. Your body didn't 'betray' you by getting taller - it did what it was supposed to do. You are stuck in your 'comfort zone' and likely repeating abuse that happened to you - but beyond the purely personal here, which I didn't want to dwell on - virtual sex with children enacts a pure taboo, and it is taboo for a good reason.

Again, 'rape fantasy' is about being wanted THAT BADLY and about 'submission' and also a way for some to suspend responsibility for their own feelings of lust and primal nature. But what is 'sex with children' fantasy about?? Can anyone REALLY justify it as a practise?

because if it's in the NY Times it *has* to be true:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/25/magazine/25desire-t.html?_r=2&pagewanted=7

And btw - I agree w/the guys upthread - prison rapes are a major, major problem worldwide (male and female victims both). Only Amnesty International seems to be doing anything about it. Males (in or out of jails) ARE raped quite often as well and support should exist more. But then hey, support isn't great for women either. Crisis lines offer minimal 'training' for their phone 'volunteers' - and as far as it's come, social awareness is still in the dark ages imo. And then there are individual reactions. People have a distancing reaction usually, and it results in victims keeping it hidden.

I remember once taking a straw poll and every single woman at the table had been raped (including stranger abduction) or sexually abused at some point in her life. The stats say 1 in 5 males and 3 in 5 females but I wonder if the real stats are much higher. At any rate I agree the OP's post is gyno-centric. But perhaps to be fair, she was speaking of Second Life, not real life so much, originally; and there does seem to be a lot more roleplay aimed at women than at men. What she might not be considering is a lot of those female avs are RL men anyway.

Simple... (^_^)

>> It's just pixels. (^_^)y <<

Melita: can you justify sex for any purpose other than procreation?

Child is also a subjective term.

In the middle ages it wasn't uncommon for girls just after puberty being married off, and it is still common in some places of the world when a girl gets her first cycle to be offered up for marriage.

Times may have changed legally on what the age that is socially accepted for sex, but the laws don't affect mother nature in regards to when a person is physically ready for sex and likely will begin to experiment.

Humans are animals, with biological drives that kick into overdrive at puberty. So called social morality tries to say that certain things are wrong or should just not be done.

The question on underage boils down to two things in my mind: Is the participants physically ready, and mentally ready. Are they both consenting to it?

If the answer is yes to all of them, then stay the hell out of their lives with your beliefs



But onto the role play aspects, it's fantasy that doesn't involve the real thing. The little X or alt-F4 provides a saftey net that is ignored by so many... There is no forcing anything on someone in SL with the tools a person has available. It's the ultimate safe word in case someone doesn't get the message. Which makes exploring our darker or less socially acceptable desires in SL a much safer thing. It's a pressure valve for many, they can play and get it out of their systems. Much like a person that loads up a FPS to burn off some anger or frustration blowing stuff up.

Take away the pressure valves for those that really have problems and when it blows, real people suffer.

Think on that when you see some role-play that disturbs your sensabilites

Abigail, I did not say roleplay - I said "sex with children isn't a kink." And sorry I do not equate it with 'furries roleplay' - not with the real life statistics on missing and exploited children. Show me the same level of stats toward real life furries...see, such examples are leading into the ridiculous zone. Which I'm sure is why you chose that particular one. Let's keep the argument busy with the equivalent of mock turtles, and it will dissipate energy and focus. Except, not for me it doesn't. So first of all you misquoted me, and reacted to something I didn't actually say. And second of all you've introduced a nonexistent population into the line of metaphors.

The 'gangbang' sims and such, are another matter and I have tried to address that with the link to the NY Times article. That said, there may well be a small population of men involved in some of those sims who have an unhealthy degree of anger toward women, and/or are sexual offenders in real life. That's a bit troubling to say the least. I still, however, do not equate it with the likes of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN_jr6xjs90

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqB5_OyGiIo&feature=related

For one thing the 'grooming' part of it is something the perpetrators perfect over time - and SL would be perfect practise for it.

Of COURSE I can. Don't obfuscate.



Only for pedophiles.



So we're in the Middle Ages? Another tired excuse NAMBLA and their ilk has on copy-paste. And you want to copy tribal societies? Then go live in one, I guess, and be happy with your 12 year old bride.



Early sexual 'experimentation' is NOT the same thing as an adult grooming and using a child for sex. AT ALL. Also there is too much anecdotal and scientific/psychological evidence out there proving that having sexual experiences as a minor causes lifelong psychological and also physical damage (higher incidence of cervical cancer in women, for one).



Sex with children is a taboo in every single society unless you count certain cults which pimp out the children in it for money, or cultures so impoverished and starving the children are often sold into brothels (knowingly or unknowingly). The *existence* of such in a society does NOT mean it is healthy, for those children or for that society.



Children are NOT wanting sex with adults; that is a narcissistic wish carried by the perpetrator. They are NOT by nature or by design psychologically, emotionally or physically ready for the act or for the fallout later. Therefore they cannot give consent. Sex with a child is by definition, child rape.

And make this personal or 'about me' all you want but I did not write laws about this. I did not do the research on this. It isn't about 'me' - it is a worldwide consensus as to the above. And it always has been. In the 'middle ages' people generally lived to about 35, so yes people married often at 15. NOT RELEVANT TODAY.



Thankfully for all the kids worldwide this isn't about me or my beliefs. www.protect.org some pretty strong and powerful people behind laws protecting children and good on them.



I am speaking to the issues in a much larger way than that.

I was with you on your points on men, but this post of yours I so disagree with.


Times have changed. Your talking dark ages and it's leftover societies. We used to burn witches too. Does that mean we still can?



Are you saying you'd ok sex with a kid because she has her periods or he could crack an erection? If so, it's you that should stay out of peoples lives with this crap.


Maybe for some r/p is like this, for others it's not.


It's not sensibilities it is law.