Developer's Incentive = Disincentive ?

Lordfly,
The premise of your argument is basically that the basic account holders are essentially worthless. LL has determined that by offering a one time $9.99 account, they get mass market appeal, and will convert those people all together into premium members. I rarely visit any of the places on the DI list. I doubt most older players do....but I was a casino/club regular when I started. Offering new playes an "entry level" experience is just as important as offering advanced content for more "advanced" players. These people are our future.

Sorry, *you* don't get it.

Content is not an event of "come see my new animation" -- and please don't say you haven't done that because the event is in the calendar.

Again, I'm NOT saying, and I repeat now for the third time, please read -- do not stop the dwelloper awards -- continue rewarding those who offer up their sims and locations for entertainment -- what I am saying is this.

In a simplistic form so you can understand it.

Award others who also offer variety here in SL. While you sweat pumping out the events, there are others here who sweat for hours pumping out just the right texture for the terrain and/or for the buildings. There are others here who sweat daily using LSL to it's utmost, finding workarounds, just to give individuals something *new* to do, something *new* to own, something that can only be done in SL because in real life it's not capable of being done.

Content is not the person who holds the most events weekly. Search these forums for the previous discussions of what constitutes content for an answer.

I will say it again. IF you were doing all your daily events for the good of the community out of your heart -- you would have had your sim in group land and removed yourself from the dwelloper awards. You're doing *your* fair share of announcing new and exciting products on SL. Good for you. But there are hundreds of others out there who work just as hard if not harder than you do, for far less recognition on their builds and scripting who also deserve a "community" award other than a pat on the back.

Very few people I talk to stay in Second Life because they can go to a club or a hot lingerie contest at any hour of the day or night. They don't tier up and buy land so they can go party at a hotspot. They stay, and they tier up, and they buy land to build on (which makes LL money) because they've seen the possibilities of what they can do here, by innovative builders, scripters, texturers, animators and designers (and yes, even club owners and event holders) who have created before them.

I do understand what makes LL money, and they obviously do as well since they've started rewarding people other than dwellopers.

The newbies are our future... teach them well and...

well... you get the rest lol

*whew* I'm back, now Phobos is noteably prim-free.

I hope someone buys that land for a mall or something, what was there before had no dwell-potential at all. It was a big shiny waste, essentially. Glad I finally saw the light.

Now to focus on the main aspect of SL that gets promoted by the system, making things for sale and GOM-ing at any opportunity. And I'm *not* being sarcastic, I'm totally converted.

Thanks everyone!

Maxx is going to make me cry.

Lynn first of all I DO do it for the good community, for you to judge me and attempt to insult me is sadly pathetic, but whatever it takes to get your point across right? I pay out more to players that come to my events more than LL has ever AWARDED me! And for your information. Group owned land can now qualify to get this award, so what will be your next accusation hmm? I do not put my land to group, because a group does not help me pay for that land, a group did not purchase that land, a group does not build dwell on that land... but those that DO help with events and what not ARE compensated, and I paid out so far at least 80k to builders, so all your false accusations towards ME are ridiculous.

BTW didn't I offer you an entire island for YOUR project? Surely you arent implying that LL would have paid for that? Nor are you making accusations of greed towards me? I surely hope not..

Really Jon? They buy up land ONLY to build? and that what keeps em in SL? Wow I am amazed... if that were the case why not play The SIMS? That would be so much cheaper, and you wouldnt have to worry about lag of clubs, malls, casinos etc.

Welcome Maxx! About time you saw the light. Somebody get Maxx a roast beef sandwich.

I'd be fine with that, Lynn. I don't think we should be looking to LL to tell us what's worthy of our attention, time, and L$. We have our own brains to do that. Personally I think that people look at the current dwell based incentive program in entirely the wrong way. Consider it corporate welfare for large expensive to operate builds. I have no problem with that, personally, since many of the places that are earning the incentives are expensive to operate, and obviously people enjoy them or they wouldn't be generating the dwell they do. I feel that considering them some kind of seal of approval and worthiness by LL that somehow diminishes the worth of anything else in SL because they don't qualify to receive them is a bit silly.

Oh, no, Sensual. I would never *ever* make an accusation against you. Lord knows that everyone else on the forums does. Lame excuse trying to place the blame on me for pointing out simple facts.

I simply stated the facts. The facts were that you *could have* turned your land to group land and bypassed the dwelloper awards if you had chosen to do so. So please don't hide behind the "big heart" attempt, it fails badly.

And yes, I have offered up sims for use of the community.

Several times, in fact.

All volunteer work, no profit for us.



Keep on doing the community work out of the goodness of your black heart.

Matches your group sex dwelloper events.

And yes, Sensual, you did offer me a sim for one of my "projects" -- but it was in the line of being an event coordinator for your sim. Unfortunately, my projects require at least two to four sims for events.

LMAO
you are amusing...

let me break it down for you...
I will use last month for example
$195 USD towards island tier
L$ 15,000 or more to people that help in Le Cadre (equal to $75 USD)
L$ 22,000 given away in cash prizes out of pocket

$58.60 USD awarded to me by LL for the dev award.

Yup pure greed and I am just milking in the dwell to fill up my pockets.

black heart?? You sure were not saying that when I offered you an island.

OMG that is again an amusing comment...

I offered you an entire island to yourself that I would pay for, because I felt bad for you because you are a great builder, and you kept getting outbid on the auctions... but now a good deed is turned around to benefit you...

Are you related to Ryen Jade? this sounds alot like him.

Lesson learned, don't offer help to people, because when you disagree with them, they will turn it around in a minute. Pfft!

Well now I think I see the crux of your argument, Lynn. To you the developer incentives are about ego stroking and your own subjective view of what's worthy and what's not, and LL should reflect your view more in doling them out. Is that about it?.

*pets Lynn's ego* there there... it's going to be okay.

Peace, all. This has gone beyond impassioned debate. And yet it's exactly the sort of subject we ought to be discussing in SL.

Deep breaths, and then rephrase.

Sorry Sensual, the offer was for the sim, me paying the monthly tier and hosting events on your property.

I didn't take it as an offer as pity, as I'm sure you didn't mean to offer your sim as such.

Let's just say this, there are others, yes others than you who have offered up their time, their money and their land for the good of the community.

But then, I stand corrected.

You are the perfect profile/mentor/pillar of the community in your angelic wings.

I salute you for your tireless and endless contributions to SL.

You deserve everything you receive here.

Woot Orgy tonight at 11, don't miss it

Sorry Chip.

I never took your comments personally, but that was rather low. I expected better from you.

Again, for the last time, it's time to award others here who build, script, texture and do good things for the community other than design clothing and skins, eh? Do something for those who add value to the community without taking a high commission for their work, eh?

Have another beer, dear friend.

All I asked was that the development awards be modified to include some of those who do outstanding work without profit.

Buy another round for yourself. It's on me.

OMG you are so right Lynn!


LINDEN LABS I WANT AWARDED FOR BEING AN ANINATOR!
YOU KNOW WHAT, SCREW THAT!

I JUST WANTED TO BE AWARDED FOR BEING ME!
IF YOU DONT AWARD ME, THEN END REWARDS ALL TOGETHER.

and for the record Lynn you are FOS, I never asked you to hold a damn event.. I was willing to fork up $1000 USD to you, and YES you cover the tier.. I am sooooo sorry that wasn't enough for you!
I sure hope that no one offers someone as ungrateful as you , anything again!

art serves to provoke and push the limits. if art appreciation was institutionalized it would no longer be art. it would lose it's subversive quality.

even for non artsitic developments, i do not welcome LL to be in the business of officiating what is good content creation. i am with chip on this. let the community decide what is good content. if the diffusion of ones work, sales incentives, and noteriety are not enough, create commitees and associations that give out awards.

You know I love ya Lynn, but that's precisely how I felt about your post to Sen. It was rather low.

I completely agree that it's high time that some of the truly creative and altruistic people in SL got some recognition. I just disagree that it needs to come from LL.

Because Chip for one simple reason. The posts went from a good and solid discussion of rewarding and nuturing *others* who do things here in SL to "me, look at me, me, me, me."

You even lost your original arguement of "stop whining".

We need to be able to nurture new and exciting things and development here in SL.

If not, SL won't grow.

What is wrong with wanting to nurture new creativity?

What is wrong with saying create a new award? No one, well one person did, complained about the animation awards. No one complained about the scripting awards.

All I'm asking is that LL and the community take a step back and look.

We now have the social areas, with new ones coming up each and every day.

But to make those areas, to make the new dance floors spectacular, you need people with texture skills, people with scripting skills, people with people skills.

Why not award the educator who teaches new people to wear and/or make their first set of clothing? Why not award the scriptor who made it all possible for the dance clubs and social areas so lag free with the new dance animations and dance machines?

Why not keep striving for the better things yet to come, and giving those individuals a small incentive to stay in SL?

It's not my ego, Chip. I'm looking for that newbie who comes along and blows everyone out of the water with their talent. And yes, dammit, I want them to be awarded for their work. There's nothing wrong with that.

Like I said, Sensual.

You are the community angel of SL.

Enjoy your sainthood.

Art is politics? Then doesn't Second Life need a government to subvert through art?

Art subverts culture? How do you subvert a landscape of sex clubs and garish capitalism? Prude art? Ah, good art?? But that requires....support? Money? By the very people the art tends to subvert?

Maybe not.

Perhaps an institution that will not "appreciate" art, but support it, recognizing the value of its subversive and often-unpopular qualities? The way it's done in over and over again in the real world.

(Teasing, Jauani. Halfway.)


ed: phrase

Lynn, I wasnt arguing that you shouldn't be awarded or any other designer/builder scripter.... but instead of understanding where Chip myself and others are coming from with our comments, you decided to take personal stabs at me instead. It's ok, it happens alot.
But why are builds and creators and such not being awarded by the community? (in your eyes)... because in my eyes they are... my animations and designs are awarded when people purchase them/use them/wear them... is that not being awarded?

and I wasnt meaning it to talk about -ME- but since I am not -YOU- , I use -ME- as an example..