Omg They Did It!

Pen; For me also the fact that there were no kiddies in SL was a great appeal to me also. I am also concerned about these kiddies crossing over on their 18th birthday, 18 does not an adult make. I admit this rubs me the wrong way. I am not against it, but I have some serious concerns about this.

Cat

Indeed! Some of them would be gods on that world. Why would they stay here and be average.

13 to 18?
WTF?
I wouldnt be able to play in that grid for another 8 years!!

Err..

wait..











j/k

By admitting that they are a teen and trying to move to that grid would then violate the TOS would it not? That is one way to get the kiddies out.

Cat

If land in TeenSL will be cheaper than in the real SL, then doesn't that amount to us subsidizing the TeenSL version?

Does TeenSL have different pricing for uploading textures? What advantages will they have?

What concerns you about this Catherine? It may be something I'm not thinking about. Because my thinking is, well, anyone aged 18 can already come into SL. So the age issue should not be a factor. And I think someone coming into our world at that age already established would bring an influx of PG content into our world from that creator, that we may not already have here. Plus they would not have to take up as much time with mentors and such because they would already know the ropes of the "game".

Wow, that brings back some memories... Berg's Day of the Barney, a three part novella of terror. Hahaha.

Pen; A few things realy.
1) adults crossing over into the pg sim and taking advantage of the teens, via money, land and sexual pedators.
2) Teens like to break the rules I think it might become "cool" to say you were in the non pg area for bragging rights ( and us adults will have to deal with that fallout)
3) When a teen turns 18 it does not automaticaly make them an adult. Going from a very sheltered area to say a very mature area should be interesting to say the least.
4) The lindens are already strained trying to keep up with the bugs and player issues on the main grid adding another grid will only lead to taking longer to clear up the issues/bugs on the main grid.
5) The one thing that realy drew me to SL what the fact that there were no kids. Letting them in even on a limited basis may be the first step in getting us used to the idea... um no thanks.

Those are my initial concerns.

Cat

I have another feeling that a newly eighteen SL'er coming in from TeenSL would be ostracized by us older SL'ers. This could create more disturbance in the community as a result, especially as more eighteen year olds are launched in the full SL when they are used to TeenSL and how things are done over there.

Would they get the same welcoming treatment that newbies get now? Would they be avoided? Would they buy guns and shoot us all?

Catherine and I don't agree often.
This time we have the exact same concerns.

Thanks Schwanson

Before I respond, I have to say, I keep getting this wild conspiracy feeling that the Lindens are not really doing this, they are just saying they are because we all said no and they want us to focus on the "what if we have no choice" than just saying no. haha.. Probably not true, but I do hope they are listening to some of these ideas.



Ok. For this concern, the rule is already in place that no one over 17 could go into this grid. Will some try? Perhaps. The same that would try in the other under 18 worlds only that already exist out there. So I"m sure LL has studied how those online environments have handled this aspect and continue to remain successful.



We deal with this already to an extent. And personally, I don't care how much I may like a person, if they admit to me in world they are under 18, I report them. Some will let it slide. To me that just tells others that you can get away with it. So I think it will be up to us to be more adament about reporting those under 18 that manage to slip in and slip up.



True, but again we already deal with this. As some come here from other teen only environments that are sheltered. I can see where this would be no more a concern than it already is.




This concern, I agree with 100%. And was my initial concern all along. I would personally love to hear from the Lindens that they are hiring a staff that will deal with this new grid, and that the current staff will continue to focus and move forward on our current one. Something, anything we need to hear from them that will re-assure us that they are not overwhelming themselves more than they *ALREADY* have.



I agree here as well. And yes, I will fight tooth and nail to keep this grid 18+. I'm sure most would as well. As long as this SL never allows under 18 in, I will be fine with this venture (save for the one concern I agreed with you on above).


Anyway, those are my thoughts on your concerns Catherine.

Pen;

Thanks for the response, I hear ya I would however like to see LL stand on their own two feet and deal with some of these concerns on their own merits instead of assuming that they are taking their cues from another on line game. They have always been good about coming up with their own ways of doing things. I hope they continue to be innovative. The town hall meeting should be an eye opener.

Cat

<TINFOILHAT>
Ok, now for a different point of view. Completely excluding the fact for now that these are teenagers, and all the memes that come with that, let's examine these facts:

1. LL is making a new, separate grid.
   
2. The inhabitants will have to be uniquely monitored, vigorously, for violations of TOS.
   
3. The only way to do this is monitoring chat, IM, any interaction, at all times.
   
4. As our government\libraries\schools have found, doing this manually is VERY time consuming and some say a privacy concern.
   
5. LL will have to develop a set of tools (unless they have already?) that will scan all communications for "keywords" and focus on those for proactive prevention. (How else will they prevent cybersex and/or predators?)
   
6. Having said that, just like recent events in US government, should LL be expected not to use those spiffy new awesome tools on regular SL?
   
7. If they do, will it be weird to know if you say certain things, you will draw more scrutiny upon yourself, even if it was in a different context? (Keyword searching, while one of the more "effective" methods, has horrible results as far as fairness and context in the "hits"
   

Is LL going to take a proactive, or reactive stance to violations of Teen TOS? I guess my point is, if LL makes a separate client/architecture for the kids (unlikely), then they will have two code branches to work on, putting a serious drain on development resources. If they simply grandfather in "dormant" features, such as advanced spying and reporting, how do we know it won't be used on us with the same intensity? If the technology is there, why not use it?

It is perfectly within LL's rights to make such technology, and maybe it already exists. But with kids coming in, this kind of thing will be mandatory development, unless LL wants to be legally liable for crazy stuff going on.
</TINFOILHAT>

Should we even be worrying about this? Is my fatigued mind playing tricks on me in a vulnerable state? It's been a long day, so please regard the <TINFOILHAT> tags. I'm sure there are other things that will indirectly effect Regular SL by virtue of the fact KidSL clients will have to be streamlined in various ways. What kinds of things (good or bad) can come from modifying the client\architecture to be kid-friendly? When this does happen, will our core experience be altered in any way simply due to new kid-friendly software features? Now, I'm not even really talking about the mature stuff; it's not really for me, and I don't care about that; I mean in general.

I'm really tired, but this thought popped into my head, so I submit it in hope that something useful can come out of it .

Um... i understand that people are worried about innocent kids being exploided, but dont you think some teens are in SL now? Or any chat for that matter, they are all being exposed to seedy internet stuff all the time, i think kids are alot more internet savy then you'd think. As for teenagers bringing sexual content to SL, i find that a bit ridiculous when most of the users are bondage fetish and furry people who use love beds. They wouldnt bring anything in that hasnt been made already! Im not even sure if this teenager land would make much a diffrence anyway, because honestly if a 13 year old that has access to a credit card, wants to get into SL, they will reguardless of age restrictions. If anything this would be good for the current teens in SL to find others around their age, rather then the usual 30+ user.

i endorse this idea/feature/product.

-

as long as LL can keep acceptable tabs on the spepration of SL and SL Jr., then i don't see much of a significant problem.

as a matter of fact, this is incredibly god. imagine having had this tool available to you as a teen-ager!! i would have been ecstatic! not to mention, these teens will one day be old enough to join SL proper, which will be after they've cut their teeth in SL Jr., which in turn means we'll be seeing an influx of honed creativity steadily flowing into SL.

in case anyone is wondering, i'm 31.. so, it poses no advantage to me. i'm just thinking about the good of SL as a whole. think of SL Jr. as a training ground and SL as "the real deal". it's exciting to speculate on what new creativities will be unleashed on SL due to the availablity of SL Jr.!

As the mother of a teen Right now my opinion is; No I wont let him/her play SL even in a teen only area.

Cat

why so?

I am just thinking you are worrying tooi much, some 16-17 teens are way kinkyer than some of the oldest of us

A new grid that protects the teens?

We all know teens aren't that stupid to sign up as a minor if they know their game will be limited.
They'll just all sign up as adults to get access to all area's.

I'm ok with teens , if they behave and don't turn SL into a big pvp battle field and trashtalk to the older people. (like they mostly seem to do in other games such as the other game that i play Ultima Online)

There are well-behaved teens and then there are little rotten terrors.

*opens huge can of worms (or whoopass what ever the case may be here lol)

So will the kiddies be able to have AV Sex on their grid?

Heh, I was wondering the same thing Catherine. If it will be all PG content will they even be able to get down to Ken and Barbie pixels??

I'd love to see some commentary from the kiddie grid. It'd be kinda fun hearing all the new 'firsts' again.

First scripted penis:

First photorealistic female body skins:

First giant bong build:

First shareable narcotics:

First escort service:

I vote LL give them a history wiki!

Lindens could offer them Amnesty - it's worth a shot.

I ..play this .. i will never ever let my 15 year old in here they already have enought problems whith real life pressure ... what to say they wont come on here and then want to act them out in real life .. some wont know the difference......i think is is a very bad idea .. As read some of you left TSO cuz of it ....Ileft THERE to be here i loved it soom much cuz i could be my self and not have to cover my mought every time a spoke .... I think ive they do this they caoulod come up with a whole different program for them .. and let them have there own set of rules .... As was said ... call the new program SecondChildhood ... i saying to separate grind for them i mean separte all together .... this is what i think ... And all that say your teacher ... you know exactly what kids face today why add more problems to them ... dont they have eonught alreay .. think about it ...they already have pressures of sex/drug ect .... this will only added to there own troulbes as some dont know how to deal with things like this .... most arent mature enough for the game .... just make a whole new program for them