Consistent Message: SL is/isn't a game

It's a game, bitch! So STFU yourself.

Fuckin' people. Sheesh.

Loser. So whens the wedding? Are you going to tell people you met someone ON A GAME *GASPZORZ*

Hey! It happens! And yeah. I just tell people I met this gobby but incredibly cute bitch on some game I play and we're getting married. Wedding is Saturday. You get your permanent ball gag fitted Monday.

OMG YES! Thank you Kritter! Finally some peace and quiet

*scrambles*

I'm Hurt

Yus. Leave mah wife alone. Only I'm allowed to be mean to her, Eggy.

Looks like we're gonna need another ball gag here

Can I gag on your balls? I tend to bite tho?

Actually Nolan's post was dead on and quite straightforward. I agree with it 100%.

I'm just wondering if this is yet another goodbye message. If so please get on with it. This thread makes my eyes bleed and my soul cry.

Not a game/it is a game.

Taking a tiny step back, let us consider the importance, not of the end result, but of the discussion that has gotten us here.

My mind is drawn to the work M. Bakhtin as it deals with language. Please consider the following statement:

"The normalization of linguistic forms (or monoglossia) is perceived as an important cause as language is. . . not simply a formal system of grammatical categories, but also the highly charged medium of verbal-ideological thought. The imposition of a standard form, thus, carries with it the strong ideological conventions of the dominant class. . . .

Language [is] not neutral, even when not explicitly charged with ideological meaning. The categories of language —especially semantics, but also the notions of appropriateness ingrained through the patterns of prosody, and the pragmatic conventions of conversation— articulate a particular world-view. A certain word, for example, can be marked as distinctive by the common usage of a given group; this is sometimes the explicit function of in-group jargon"

The game/not game dichotomy, for me, is not about which 'word' triumphs; it is about the discussion, itself.

Edit: This meta-dialog is brought to you by the letters 'S' and 'Z' and the number 4.

Who gives a rats ass if it is or isn't a game, That realy wasn't the point at all.

When you start alienating parts of the community, its a bad business move for the entire community.

Cat

ok

If you don't care about that distinction, why did you spend so many paragraphs bellyaching over how sad/shocked/disappointed/mad you were that your "game" got taken away from you?

* sigh * I am glad you find altering quotes amusing, it is rather juvenile.

Actually, though, I agree with you on some points, I just don't see LL's comments about what SL is to them as alienating anyone. Ultimately, it is a development platform - a completely unique one. It is also a game at its heart. It has elements of what has made other online games addictive in some ways, though it lacks the goal based gameplay of MMORPGs, or the pure recreational gameplay of There. It still allows you to play a game - running around, driving cars, flying, exploring, experiencing things.

It also has elements of what has made the web so ubiquitous - the ability for anyone to create what they want, and for others to experience that. Platform and game are not mutually exclusive. The bigger truth is that SL transcends both being a game and a platform, so calling it either is not completely accurate.

I am not sure why people get so bent out of shape about it being called a game. The hyper-overreaction to that has always struck me as arrogant and stupid. It almost has the pointless zealotry of arguing PC vs Mac (or Linux). We all have different views of what SL is - it is a fluid thing. I have always viewed it as an almost limitless game - the type that I have always dreamed of. It The fact that we have built virtual businesses and made money off of it doesn't change its nature.

No, SL is not Everquest - SL is peerless. However, SL is a game to many people, and there is nothing wrong with viewing it that way. I hope that there is more focus put onto making our day to day experiences in SL more fun and game-like. It still shows the rough edges from beta in many ways, which is sad after over 2 years. If SL is truly a platform, then it needs vast improvement as a gaming platform if it is to continue to be marketed to and appeal to online gamers.

ZOMG

I made it to Cristianos SIG!!!

*dances*

Back to your scheduled drrraaamaaaaa....

The Lindens don't grasp their own goal. Apparently they want all the perks of having a "game," but they also want to be able to be above it all.

coco

I do not get that impression from them at all.

When LL fires-up a new sim, there's only empty land there.
People (not players) come in, rent a piece of server and call it "their land"
People create 3d shapes, slap on some textures on them and call the result "house, car, plane, tringo hall, river, slot machine, AV, all manners of ideas given forms and appearances...
Not a game, not a business, not a real world...
But an extension of one's mind, where ideas can be given form and be shared.

Sure, you can quote me!

i skimmed some more of this wacky thread. i don't think it's such a big deal as some are painting that LL doesn't want to call sl a game. it's not alienating me from logging in. the "game" itself hasn't changed because of nomencalture.

actually it's totally cool for philip to pique interest about "the game that is not a game." as long as LL doesn't thump it like a cyberpunk mantra it shouldn't be a problem. i guess my initial reaction was a bit extreme. it's not like LL will put up warning signs - "this is not a game! do not enter if you are looking for a game."

I agree, Juani, it does perk interest, and I hadn't thought of that as such. And as long as, like you say, they don't get carried away with it. Or lecture residents patronizingly over it.

coco

Duck and cover!

*sighs*

Somehow, I doubt Linden not calling Second Life a game is going to turn off the gamer base. Want to know why? Most of the serious hard core gamers I know, the ones that are in it for the GAME, are turned off by Second Life. My roommate does not play online games to meet people or chat with people, he plays them for the GAME. He thinks Second Life is stupid and sees no point to it. He wouldn't "play" it, if I PAID him to. This is because Second Life, to a serious, hard core gamer, is NOT a game.

Coco--you keep referring to other games that are essentially the same as Second Life and marketed as games. Could you point out examples please? Because as far as I know, we have played some of the same things and I do not consider them to be anything like Second Life.

Second Life attracts different people for different reasons. Do you know how many people I run into in a day that never played any online games? Second Life is their first exposure to a 3d online world. They have chat experience for the most part, or roleplaying in chat room experience. I know people that come in determined to get some of the money that they hear can be made using Second Life. I know other people that come in because they have friends in it.

I seriously, seriously doubt that Second Life is doomed and the people that use it will dwindle to just the serious creators by Linden NOT CALLING IT A GAME. To say this and to go on about this is akin to Chicken Little saying the sky is falling. Time consuming and energy wasting.

AND, as is so often pointed out, only 10% of Second Life users read the forums. What are the other 90% doing?? Oh wait, they're in Second Life, building houses, shopping, clubbing, building, scripting, dancing, djing, working their Second Life jobs, chatting, finding a new Furry av, looking at Goth skin at Munch's, etc etc. They're doing this blissfully unconcerned that Linden is no longer calling it a game. Are they going to stop anytime soon? No. And if Linden made a systemwide Second Life announcement that Second Life was never to be referred to as a game again, I think a lot of people would do the whole finger or "fuck you" spam that you can see in club chat a lot. They would then go on living their Second Lifes.


I think the title of Second Life says it all. This is a second life, how you choose to live it, just like your First life, is totally up to you. I choose to have fun.

*goes back to trying to edit the 20 floating pieces of her nipple rings*

It is rather presumptuous to say the creators do not grasp their own goal. I imagine they present SL as not being a game so that it is not pigeonholed as such, and can live up to its true potential. You aren't going to have distance learning in World of Warcraft, for example. I think Linden Lab, and Philip in particular, have an incredible vision that they have been very true to. It seems that if you came here expecting SL to be TSO 2, then of course you are going to be disappointed.

I was wondering that myself.