Gay Themed Sim!

I would love to see a gay themed sim. A lot of my friends in SL are gay, bi or lesbian. Its not something that I chose, it just happened. I think its because there's a higher percentage of intelligent people among the homosexual crowd... my best friend at college is gay as well.

This thread is so old, it started in beta when i was a noob. I thought it was a horrible idea at first, since i saw it as some kind of voluntary segregation. But you know what, a sim where quite possibly most of the people I like in SL would hang out together and have fun, sounds like a great idea. And heck, it might even help get the message out there to all the overly religious/conservative freaks that gay people are perfectly normal human beings that deserve all the rights and respect a heterosexual enjoys.

If you want to try and set this up, start small with some largish group-owned plot instead of a private island. I'll even donate some land allocation to the group.

Eggy - How dare you refer to us as "normal." That is the most homophobic form of condescension I have ever heard. Shame! Shame!

Hehe, of COURSE the above was said in pure jest!! You are tops with me, E! Come hang out with us, sometime. (sum bitsin time zones...grumble)

I have been in a gay sim before i think.... i was trying to fly somewhere... and landed on a lot with gay pride flags and rainbows and flowers everywhere... i think it was already done. But like what every1 is saying... it basically would look like any other sim. I think having a gay sim would be a bit stereotypish...

Old Timer there is no heritage to gays,,, they have the same heritage as everyone else. I live in San Fransisco which some say is the Mecca of homosexuality.. they celibrate the same holidays i do. There is nothing special about gays they are the same as you and I. My uncle is Gay he doesnt have any special Days or times of year where its all about gays. When you go to his house it looks like my apartment but he has nicer furniture, Course thats a matter of taste. Gay sim would look like any other sim, unless you where gonna shoot for the purely sexual content and have posters plastered everywhere of men on men woman on woman sex an all the other bull crap people stereo type about gays.. lol gay theme what ever. If I were gay that would be a borderline insult

Does this mean that everyone would have to be wearing comfortable shoes in an all gay sim?

I would beg to differ on the heritage issue. That just goes to show that you do not know the gay history. Sure we celebrate the straight worlds holidays and whatnot...we have been assimilated to do so.
One very important *day* for the gay community is coming up real soon....Oct 10th. Its called coming out day. June is another important month for us. That is when you will generally see your local community celebrating pride in themselves because we have to overcome the shame that was imposed on us by the larger more dominant culture.
We have many people we look up to who have been an example of courage and strength. I would say that these things qualify as heritage.

Sulumor is one of the most generous, talented and involved members of Second Life.

If she wants a gay-themed sim, I'll bet all of my SL dollars it's because she wants the sense of community that would come along with it.

My two cents.

Maggie

I don't even know what to call my sexuality. More of a bon vivant, really...

All I know is that my sexuality is about sex (and love and romance and relationships and all that good stuff that sexual energy is wrapped up in)...

What amuses me the most about this thread - and it is amusing - is that all these people got so tripped off on either side of the issue without ever doing more than passing a cursory glance at the fact that this IS about sex. What the hell is a sexual-orientation if it's not about sex?! The fact is, MOST things in life are about sex... and Second Life reflects this rather well.

For goddsakes, you can buy penises that cum all over the floor when clicked, have virtual sex with someone who may or may-not be the gender their avatar displays, attend bondage parties, buy an escort, wear lingerie whilst building massive phalluses to block out the sun...

So, my opinion on this is...

If you're gay and you want to hang out with gay people because then you'll know that you can be around people who sexually enjoy others the same way you do... sure, okay. Straight people do that all the time... it's called Mature parties, flirting, foreplay... it's about sex and similar interests and that's okay!

And if you're straight and you don't dig on the whole gay thing, then great... don't teleport there! If you happen to be flying over a gay sim and smack into a gay prim (*lol*...sorry...)... keep on flying!

I guess I'm obtuse, but I will never understand why people spend so much time belaboring heavy-handed points of rights and history and politics and (*snort*) morality, obfuscating and complicating something that's supposed to be as fun and pleasurable as sex.

Yours,

M.

Mephistophelina,

Well, I enjoy the company of gay people, but I'm about as straight as you can get. If I visited a gay sim it would be to find congenial company, not sex.

Let me expand a bit on this. One of the reasons I like being in the company of gay males is that it's far more relaxing than being with heterosexuals. The undercurrent of macho aggression which you find in straight men is completely lacking, and I find that very pleasant. With lesbians you can enjoy their company without any suspicion on their part about your motives or any other sexual complications.

In practice things aren't quite as simple as that, but that is the basis of why I might wish to visit a gay sim from time to time.

Excellent response, Seladador. The only other point I would make relates to environment. The idea is not for this to become one big orgy sim. Sexual activities are bound to happen, sure, but this is really more about having a place where gay folk can let their guard down, a bit. Breathe a little easier. Granted, gayness is most fundamentally related to sexuality, but to leave it at that is a gross over-simplification.

Wow this is an interesting topic. A gay themed sim woulden't be different than a normal sim, the only difference would be how far the owner is into the "Gay pride" thing.

SuLuMor, being gay is a sexual preference and that's it. Some gay people tend to make everyone think that all homosexuals like pink tanktops and rainbows because it's what they do, and they happen to be homosexual. There is no heritage for gay people, homosexuals are just like any other person, they live the same lives as any other person.

Now, if there was a "Gay Pride" sim, THEN it would be different. Much different. But understand that not all homosexual people (such as myself) are into pink flags and pretty flowers. ;p

Hiijoro,

I am astonished that a homosexual should think that gay culture is only about 'pink flags and pretty flowers'. Even I know better than that.

Maybe I'm atypical, but I'm not into the Gay pride thing at all. They are just a bit too desperate and aggressive about justifying certain activities, like promiscuity, wearing rather tasteless arrangements of leather, unseemly public displays and political activism that turn off more mainstream homosexuals. Then there are the divisions. Most gay men never have anything at all to do with either lesbians or transexuals. They miss out on a lot. That is just the way it is. Even so, all of us have a common experience, a dialect, a subculture just as much as do Latinos or Jews or Native Americans, and it isn't nearly so much about sex as it is about oppression, both real and perceived, and just the everyday things we all of us experience.

Wow, very well stated, David. BTW - Where's my ring???
lol

I tend to agree with David's initial assessment. In RL, I am the type that few would suspect of being gay. I dress for comfort, not for style (OK, most of the time). I don't talk with a lisp. I don't own a single article of clothing that is tinted pink. My partner and I are very private about our affections. I am by no means a gay activist (at least in RL). I gravitate toward moderate politics. And, surprisingly enough, there seems to be a hidden mass of gay folk who also fit into a similar demographic.

Regarding David's latter point, I believe that he has hit the nail on the head (obvious puns not intended). Think of this gay sim idea as a "no fly zone" of sorts; a place of respite. Those real or imagined feelings of oppression do, in a very real sense, color the daily existence of the gay person. What is so inherently wrong, then, with creating a space where, to whatever degree possible, those feelings of angst can be set aside?

Whether or not the rest of the SL community condones this idea is somewhat of a moot point. Time will tell if this idea is a stroke of genius or an ill-conceived notion.

Paolo--for one, you remind me of me in my FL, at least in that description. My partner and I both, even.

With that in mind, I see "pride" as the downfall of mankind. Not because of Christian ethics or anything, because I'm no Christian by any means, but simply because something always goes wrong with a community when it gets too proud. Being proud of oneself either needs to be -private- or it needs to be -ousted-. Pride should be saved for accomplishments, not coming to terms with one's sexual behavior. Rallying gay people together is one of the most stupid things I've ever heard of in my 20 years of existence. A gay culture of that type is one that perpetuates exclusion, and worse, it encourages people to explain one's identity through sexuality. We are not big horny penises, people. There's more to life than what we do in bed. And until we can convince congress of that, we're never going to "get our way" with Civil Unions and the like. So don't perpetuate this "I'M PROUD I'M SEXUAL I'M OUT THERE" in mass groups because it does nothing for the actual revolution at hand and instead just pushes you further, and further, and further away from the true goals in mind.

A gay sim would perpetuate exclusion and promote overzealous, frothing at the mouth from pride mind sets. And, it would attempt to remove a faction of SL off of the main grid and onto a private island, creating a self-created separatist state.

The gay ghetto argument. I understand your points, many of which have already been expressed in earlier posts. I don't agree, though, with your dire predictions.

At my club, for instance, anyone/everyone is welcome to attend our events. We actually have a small group of straight patrons who just like to hang out with us. Some of the ladies have mentioned that they like to be able to dance or socialize without the constant pick-up lines they experience elsewhere. Others just find us to be very endearing . Some of the straight male patrons say they like hanging out with guys who aren't as deeeply mired in the undertones of male competitiveness. And you know what? There are a lot of gay folks in SL who want nothing to do with a club like mine, preferring instead to mingle with the masses. I think that will remain true, regardless of whether or not a gay-themed sim exists.

The difference, at a place like mine, is that the "rules of engagement" are tilted slightly more in our favor. It is one small piece of virtual real estate where gay folk can truly just "be."

Again, I'll refer you to the final statement in my last post. Time will tell.

[/B]

I understand your concerns Daemioth. I, for one, like the idea of "gay places" amidst everyone; not separated from the rest of the world. In the game TSO, we had hoods titled Sim Francisco, Rainbow Pride Beach etc and I liked the feeling of community about them, but I can see how others may view it as being separatist. There is an increasing number of bisexuals among young folk today, which I find refreshing. Their dual sexual orientation makes me think more of the rightness of being integrated.

My in-game companion and I have far greater impact on folk's tolerance and acceptance levels being seen AMONGST heteros rather than apart.

As far as Gay Pride I understand so well why so many folks participate in those events because of all the oppression we endure growing up. Granted, things are sooooo much better now than in my day, but still, it's nice to reinforce the fact we should be proud of our sexuality and not give in to those who want to make us feel sinful or bad about it.

Off soapbox, you are all released hehe

"Vanity... my favorite sin."

I think you make an excellent point here. Pride in an individualistic sense is, I think, good, bad or moot dependent upon the individual. But in a group sense, it almost always takes a turn toward the absurd and/or menacing.



Allah, Elohim and the Good Lord be praised. The younger generation is washing away the sins of the elders.

You see, I understand perfectly why the Old Guard Gay crowd can still be a bit punchy. But there comes a time when one has to realize that it isn't about forgiving or forgetting... it's about life being too effing short to spend it angry at people whose idea of adventure in bed is leaving the light on.

I used to date this lesbian for awhile, and she was a biscuit, but being as how she was older and remembered the bad old days, she was a little too on about The Cause for my tastes.

My idea of a fun date was dressing to the nine's, taking her to dinner at the best restaurant, getting soused on champagne then seeing some absurdist theatre. I didn't really see the fun in attending feminist meetings where a bunch of man-hating women in ugly T-shirts sit around talking about Yoni power.

A shame, really, because there's a whole world outside of the small segment of society that actively cares deeply and personally about your sex life.



Well, I think it all depends upon how it is done. But really, if a group of people want to get together and be angry and deluded (for any reason), then as I said before, it's their dime. I just don't understand it.

In my experience, there are a gamut of gay people:

* Those who are perfectly content to embrace their sex life as a pleasurable and reasonable part of their existence as non-breeding humans
* Those who are insecure about it and deny that sex has very much to do with fundamentally being gay (which to me is like a Jew saying that the Talmud is only mildly relevant to being Jewish)
* Those who are angry and insist that everyone pat them on the head for being brave enough to color outside the lines
* And then there's the "fabulous" crowd who I suspect are gay as a function of their personalities.

All very different people, though I think only the first and last category are really happily gay. The others (who, not co-incidentally are the ones you always see on the news) spend way too much time worrying about affirmation from other people.

Well, this is only my opinion, but that's a waste of the worst kind. No matter what you do in life, be it doggy-style or straight-no-chaser, some segment of people will think that Hell yawns before you for it.

And?

Yours,

M.

Er... okay.

Perhaps your ideas about sex differ from mine, but in my experience, sex is neither gross nor overly simple. It just doesn't ask nor deserve to be burdened with irrelevancies.

I like to wrap both hands around the idea of sex and not set it aside like a naughty child in a corner.

If being gay means something to you that is more profound than your sexuality, then that begs the question of what exactly it is you are talking about.

I mean, I love men and women, but I don't consider myself part of the "bi" subculture. I don't ask for that kind of camaraderie, limitation or responsibility to a cause any more noble than my own happiness. I want something more specific and personalized - a partner, love, romance, sexual pleasure, companionship, adventure...

What are you looking for? And more to the point... what is "being gay" that is somehow loftier than your own happiness as it is related to your sexual preferences?

I'm willing to accept that I might just be odd/selfish/eccentric enough that I will never quite grasp the idea of group mentality, but humor me, if you would, and explain why it is that you, personally, feel that gay people are better for having a separate culture that identifies and celebrates things they have in common other than sex. I've always been curious about this.

Yours,

M.

Yeesh ... we're all up at arms with each other over something so simple.

I believe what Paolo, myself and others are interested in is an inworld reflection of the real world. In most major cities there is almost certianly a gay section. Indeed, even Montreal, one of my favorite cities, has a section called the Gay Village. Going to Montreal one can see almost immediately that they don't hide their Gay Village -- in fact, it's indicated in every travel guide I've seen, and even on the Metro (subway) maps that are posted in stations and above ground (the Village is indicated with a rainbow flag). Montreal celebrates the fact that they have the highest ratio of homosexual/gay/queer/LGBTI to straight/heterosexual people in the world (within city limits). During gay pride EVERYONE comes out for it, not just the homos. I liken it to an agricultural fair. I'm not a farmer, but I enjoy going to their fairs. It's not the lifestyle for me (dirt under my fingernails? Nooo.), but I support their right to grow corn and own sheep.

Personally, I go to gay pride events. I love it. It's fun to get together with your brothers and sisters and be visible, buy rainbowy things you'll never use, watch drag shows in broad daylight and such. With that case in mind, it's important to be visible, which is really what gay pride events are all about. A lack of visibility causes people to forget. Case in point: I help organize a bike ride that raises money for AIDS vaccine research. Part of our charter is that raising awareness is just as -- if not more -- important as raising funds. We purposely plan the route to go through little towns where the probability is strong that there is a bad stigma toward HIV/AIDS, and sure enough, we run into people who think HIV/AIDS is over and done with, that we've wiped it out or found a cure. Do you know why?

It's not visible anymore.

When was the last time you saw anything about HIV/AIDS in the news? The media got bored and moved on. Every day, 40,000 people contract HIV, and there are over 4 MILLION people infected worldwide! Africa is hardest hit, where the average life expectancy has plummeted because of the exponential incidences of AIDS cases.

Er. Sorry. Little soapbox moment there

This isn't about AIDS though, but you see my point. Visibility keeps us in the news. It keeps our causes up front and in the minds of people. Personally, I want to get married to the man of my dreams someday. If some people have their way, that won't happen, ever.

Would you say that the African American community shouldn't have their Million Man March anymore? That can be considered separatist and prideful, but it's not about that as much as it is about visibility.

I think maybe we should change this thread's name and call to action. Integration is good for visibility, so why don't we try to get group land in the city sim or some other residentialish sim and create our own Dupont Circle, Castro, Wickeden Street, Church Street, Christopher Street, etc? It's still gathering in a group, but at the same time it's also integrating. Together, that equals visibility

Sorry for the length and/or rant

Well said, Taun. Again, I think your Montreal/Gay Village analogy was very helpful in clarifying what a gay sim might look like.

Let me say it again: Time will tell.

I don't think that Paolo or anyone said anything about gay people being "better" for having certain distinct subculture groupings. What isn't being reflected here in this discussion, of course, is that some of us are in our twenties - a period during which thoughts about sex are a hot wind that blows pretty much nonstop - and then some of us are a little older, perhaps, no longer quite so compelled to act like Viagra-ridden demented whores, and have moved on to enjoy some of life's other offerings, like raising families, owning nice homes and a good plastic surgery. Sex isn't so much a defining part of our life anymore.

Hehe... but plastic surgery is! And Abercrombie gear

Yum!