Gay Themed Sim!

Wow. What?

What Im hearind from those who oppose is ::: fit in, be like us, dont as dont tell, its ok so long as you dont bring it up ::

What Im hearing from those defending the idea is :: let them be themselves and do their thing, it isnt hurting anyone, its not about sex, let them be in peace ::

If ANYONE is having one sided ideas of freedoms it those in opposition of this idea. Its a big world. I can be in SL and never visit a particular sim and I'd never miss it. If this idea were to happen, anyone could choose to visit and anyone could choose to bypass it.

Part of the reason that people of a like culture gather is to be around people like themselves and feel more comfortable to BE themselves. What those in opposition are saying is "we dont want to see it so dont be you, pretend to be like us so we arent uncomfortable".

Sorry, thats BS.

Thai has a place in Rose, so does Baltus. I havent met Baltus in world yet but I propose anyone who supports this idea and the right for it to be or anyone out there that is gay, head to rose and homestead. Word will get out and it will eventually become your "little castro".

BUT DUDE ROSE IS WHERE I LIVE AND I DON'T WANT ANY PERVERTS IN MY SIM BECAUSE I AM AN EVIL STRAIGHT WHITE MA--

sorry

well, stay and support it. Im sure they wont bite!

I just built a lab there this week and I dont plan on moving anywhere.

Gay people and straight people live side by side in the Castro and in WeHo. Im sure they do in other "gay" neighborhoods too. Why not in SL?

I'm sorry misnomer but you are reading your own insights into what you've seen at least from me.

Nowhere do I say they can't bring it up, I say running around screaming i'm gay hurts their cause more than it helps. I don't tell them to fit in or be like us, they can do what they want.

What I do see is that anyone that has doubts about if this sim is needed in SL is painted as prejudiced (don't worry Kathy not talking about your post), close-minded, and painted as well evil.

Yeah you let me express my opinion freely but then you freely claim i'm prejudiced and against homosexuals, which isn't true at all. I just have a different opinion on what is good for them and good for community.

Your post is so full of, i'm gonna read what you are saying with my ideological and social tints that i can't really listen to what you are saying, that I don't even want to respond to it anymore.

I appreciate Kathy's levelheadedness and realizing that I have my right to my opinion and that just because I don't think its a good idea that doesn't mean i'm against it coming in and that i'm against homosexuals.

Keep singing the party line... if someone is against gay's screaming their gay, your prejudice, if someone is against Affirmative Action, your racist.... I am so sick of hearing those direct attacks to taint someones arguements and make it so noone can listen to them without being painted the same way.

JV

Thanks for your support Misnomer... but I'm really hoping when a new sim opens up to - well - move in there Rose is a really nice community and I enjoy the people there and the last thing I would want to do is intrude on that tranquility there. Merely, my idea is for when new sims open up to see if anyone is willing to start a community there instead of invading into sims with communities already.

Before th Stonewall riots I think more gay people believed that what you say was true. After years of repression the lid just blew. Nothing has been the same since. Shouting does get results. Shouting can take many forms. The parades show numbers that politicians pay attention to. Indicating your correct information in demographic polls speaks to advertisers. Speaking the truth to your neighbor opens minds.

I appreciate your opionion and yes you are welcome to it but what really is it that you know about gay history and culture that makes your opionion correct on whats best for them?

Do you think sitting quietly in California brought the Domestic Partnership legistation? Do you have any idea what gays REALLY want with gay marrage? Its not what you think.

I know that you are painting me with the same brush you did Kathy until she made her statement and you are free to feel what you will. I'm not one to spout off on something I dont know much about but I am educated in these matters.

I have no issues with folks expressing their views even if I disagree with them. Dialog, no matter how uncomfortable, is how things get done. All Im saying is DIALOG gets things done. Dont ask them to be quiet.

Baltus,
You're right. I retract. It may be some time until a new sim is opened. There are a few that are nearly empty. I was just thinking mostly about Thai. She has had to move several times recently.

I don't think you'll ever get what i'm saying... I never tell people to be quiet, but forcing politicians to listen does get results your right, but it also alienates many people. It is my humble opinion that getting the people on your side first and then going after the politicians is much more effective and it is also my belief that the parades and forcing certain initiatives through you just turn away people you could make supporters.

I'm not the one painting anyone with a brush, you claimed i told people to be quiet and fit it and be like us.. I never said those things.

I really am done here, this is not an issue i like to discuss because I feel bad offending anyone with my views so i don't like to touch on this issue much. It all started because I am sick of Thai jumping down peoples throats everytime someone may have a negative reaction to a gay themed idea. From there i've had to reply and reply and reply so that my intentions weren't twisted and in the end they were anyways as usual. Man I need to live in the "no spin zone" . So i'm done, don't expect a further reply, if you want to take last pot shots thats fine, i can't be goaded into replying again, i can be very stubborn

JV

First, let’s be clear. When I meet people on the street, I don’t say Hi I’m Karen and I’m gay. Not their biz. I also don’t identify myself as a Scott a Texan an Alcoholic or any of the hundreds of other ways I could identify myself.
My last post had nothing to do with calling anyone prejudiced. It had to do with the reason I am out in the first place.
Others are out to fight for our rights. I in the past that was my reason it is not now. I was young and fierce then. Now that I am older, I am out in the hope to serve as a guidepost.
There are people out there in trouble and lost. I am not talking about recruiting here. I am talking about people who know they are gay and have condemned themselves for it.
Jonathan once again I need to clarify for you. I have never had a conversation with you so I don’t think you can generally brand me a (lefty). I also am not posting to fight with you sir. I am posting so that I can clarify my position.
You might find it interesting that I actually like the right side of the isle. See you say that marching and protesting turns people off. I say that extremist on both side of the fence make it easier and more necessary for moderates to talk.
You might also find it interesting that I voted republican in two national elections. I have some very conservative tendency, but that does not make me a conservative anymore than being gay makes me liberal.
I never said you should not be able to voice your opinion. The freedom of speech is one of the keystones of our country. You however seem to think that once your opinion is issued it should be hands off. That is not the case. Another great attribute of the freedom of speech is debate. It is how great societies work out their differences.
I feel I need to clarify for you one more time so that you understand. When the post about SL marriage came up, I added my comment as a joke. I am sorry it was not taken in that light. Truth be known I do not support gay marriage. I support civil unions. The reason I don’t support it is because that would be forcing my views upon the church, and I don’t want to do that. Also even though I am a Scott I would love to march in the St Patties day parade, but the organizers of that event don’t want a gay group marching. I support them. I have no right to force them to let me march.
I hope that clears a few things up.
Now Jonathan if you are offended in anyway by what is said in this post I am sorry you were hurt. It is actually being said so that you understand this is not about a fight between you and me. It is about a people trying to gain freedom.

Don't worry about it Thai,

You and I just have very different beliefs on the issue and its not a big deal.

I saw in a few thread you jumping up and in my opinion getting heated over nothing, my mistake if that was not your intention. SL I want to be free from the petty arguements of SL.

I'm gonna go and chill in Americana and I though I don't support a Gay Themed sim, if it comes to fruition I promise I will come and stop by and say hi and vote for any great builds i see.

cya all in world

btw i don't consider my last reply a reply to the issue i was telling Thai we are cool

like I said i'm done with this thread

hehe

JV

I'm all about you guys showing your pride in Gay History and fully support a Gay themed Sim. Bravo! Not only would it show diversity in Second Life culture but would also be a great warm welcome for people who are more comfortable being open with other like minded individuals. I think it could be used for many purposes, including gatherings for Gays, lesbians and their friends (Like me!) as well as provide an inadvertant avenue of education while pursuing TOLERANCE in Second life.

The addition of such a thing will really show how all inclusive we are. It doesn't have to be a mature Sim either- lets not have that argument, I think it's already been stated that the term 'gay' has no affiliation with sex, so stop making it an explicitve.

I'm behind you all the way!

Here's to diversity!

What is the point?

I mean overall its not a large issue wether or not it happens but i dont see point to this.

I see this doing more harm then good.

What about a hetero only sim would you want that?

Or waht about a straight man only sim?

Maybe sims only for people of a specific race?

Why purposefully segregate?

Having a gay themed sim opens up the idea that it is ok for a specific group,race,sex to have an area dedicated to them alone.

If you want to make a building or buildnigs dedicated to gay pride or history thats great,you can go ahead and do that,that is what secondlife is all about.

I dont think however that whole sims should be allowed to be dedicated to special interest groups.

Themed communities are about people being able to build in a specific style and know that those around them will do the same to achieve a themed community look,such as we already have.

Heavens no!

Did you even read the thread? Or did you just read the first post and respond? Or are you just trolling? I'm not trying to shut you up, but this thread goes on for 6 pages and every one of your questions has been brought up and debated ad-nauseum.

I'm going to brand you as a troll because of the inflamatory and inaccurate nature of your questions (as no one is suggesting that this is a segragated area where gays _must_ go, nor are they suggesting that it would be an area where _only_ those with a homosexual agenda go, just an area to celebrate an existing culture). And I hope that no one else is as foolish as I am and replies.

Well the thread is 6 pages long ofcourse I didnt read it all.

If what I've mentioned has been addressed and the issues I mentioned are not going to be a problem then hey go for it I dont care in the slightest.

I was just stating my concerns over it setting a bad example thats all.

I'll simply ignore your flaming THIS time so as not to ruin the discussion because you couldnt respond without the uneeded flaming.

Thanks for the props, CrowCatcher Valen and Rick Crossing. For many people this is a difficult type of topic to consider, and Western culture doesn't make it very easy to talk about without stirring up a hornets' nest of connotations. Moreover, many people seem driven to have an opinion about everything before they've had a chance to develop one. It's generally considered better to have a poorly informed but firmly held opinion than to be seen as unsure about an issue. If people stopped having opinions for long enough to remind themselves, "Hey, maybe I /don't/ know everything there is to know about this topic. Maybe I should sit back and /listen/," then we might get a bit farther in our considerations.

I will admit that as much as I've been exposed to these ideas, sometimes I have to stop and reconsider my beliefs. Still, I am pretty sure I will continue to believe that exclusion by sexual preference is inane. However, to form a community based on mutual respect for autonomy is entirely sensible. If there were a group of people sharing that belief and holding the vision of building a place where personal freedoms were especially valued, I would very much like to get involved. If someone starts a group with the perspective that 'Straights have had their way for too long. We'll solve the problem by becoming territorial,' I will discount them as frightened loons. And if someone starts a community that allows a type of expression to one group but denies it to another, I will protest that injustice.

It seems to me the best way to get this community off the ground really is to /just do it/, but to focus on citizenship before territory. A community does not necessitate a geographic location as long as communication is in place. A large group of people with a similar set of beliefs will want to spend time together. Once that happens, it's only natural that they'll create a place in which to gather. But to create a place with the hope that it'll suddenly attract a healthy, balanced community is a little naive. My single bit of advice here is to gather voices behind the need for such a community, and the rest will follow as a matter of course.

Gays like to have sex.

So I guess in that respect, they're normal.

Not all gays like to have sex. In fact, some are as asexual as are many puritanical straight people. Simply because you take two people and describe them by a difference in one characteristic does not mean that that characteristic is important to those individuals. To be fair, there are a lot of gay people AND straight people for whom sexuality is a central trait. But there are also many people who self-identify with a sexuality without making it central.

It's dangerous to use terms like 'normal' to describe a group without understanding what is precisely communicated through the term. As psychologists and sociologists have learned over time, the term 'normal' is only accurate in a statistical sense and only relative to a set of traits. There is no such thing as a 'normal person' if we go beyond even a few traits. Humans are naturally diverse, and culturally normalcy is a CONSTRUCTED quality and results from an artificial focus and oversimplification of traits.

...or it could it be like some suggested a celebration of gay history in a PG format? Like those who have fought for rights, icons and events?

As a short-term second-lifer and long-term fag, I wouldn't bother setting up a gay sim. If you can ever be out comfortably, a sim's the place, and Second Life is ideal for it. After all what's the worst that can happen?

1. Negative rating? Pfft. Easily countered by being fabulous.
   
2. Gay bashing? I may be nelly, but I ain't jessie.
   
3. Hate speech? Explicitly prohibited, and easily mutable.
   
4. Feeling uncomfortable? Unpopular as it may be with my brethren and sistren, IMO comfort's all about how you feel about yourself, and very little about your environment (unless you're in <insert nasty RL place to sneer at here>.
   
   

I figure if you approach SL with the assumption that it's no biggie if you're gay, and no one else thinks it's a big deal, then it won't be. Then again, it works fo me in RL, so why not in SL, where the self-selecting community is so much less likely to have persistent griefers and hatemongers.

Anyway, as soon as these templates finish downloading, I'm starting work on my queer / fetish boutique... ballgags and clonewear ahoy!

P.S. For the record, I hate vegematarians, eat ponies, and I have a few constructive suggestions for Log Cabin Republicans, mostly to do with relocating their logs.

Ant I wish that was the case. For the most part it is. But when I opened the Open Flame all hell broke loose. I had to move the thing twice before we got any peace. If you read this entire thread you might get a view of what has gone on. Anyway I think the idea is not to have a sim that we can be out in. It is to have a sim that celebrates our history and culture.

HAHahahah 'fabulous'
I love it. This line really made me laugh, here at work.

Thats all I had to say, other than I can't believe this thread is still going on. I guess I can actually, sigh.

Yah. I read about it - it was one of the things that attracted me to SL. I wont trumpet my activist credentials - I have some, honest - but I reckon there comes a time to just get on with it and be an integrated part of a society. It's quite possible to do so without losing 'our' history (whatever the hell that is - I'm pretty sure the intellectually and culturally fascinating phenomenon of 17th century Molly Houses, for example, has bugger all to do with Leonardo or Sappho and is about as relevant to modern gay rights arguments as smoked haddock).

IMneverHO, A Museum of the Fabulous would be better than an entire sim - likely to be denser and more interesting... possibly even edumacationananal, too.

Now, enough chatter, I must return to texturing some tees to stretch across my buff new avatar's bulging pecs. Amazing how art imitates life, really.

Just for fun, I'd totally get behind a Museum of the Fabulous! Give it a Priscilla Queen of the Desert feel Have drag shows and everything! It's not like we don't have the makeup sliders and ABBA music to make it realistic... just need a way to prance...

'Everybody, put your hands together for the ravishing Anna Rexic!'

Someone does need to make some Pink Panther t-shirts like on Jeffery though Maybe doing a whole gay sim is a bit much to start. A museum would be fine to start with... and once the community has been built up enough to FILL a sim, I think it'd be a simple matter of arranging a sim to meet the demand.

Just wait 'til my 'Helen Earth' avatar is revealed.