Gay Themed Sim!

sodomy

n : anal intercourse committed by a man with a man or woman


Who said anything about sex acts in this theme proposal?

Culture! I think I mentioned this already. There IS a gay culture




so you are worried how it will look? Literally or figuratively?

I suppose I see this the same way I see "Black History Month".

While I understand the reasoning and the fact those of a minority would want this to make them more visual, push themselves into the face of the world, try to force acceptance, I do not see that as the result of this.

Instead, what you will get is the opposite. You will prolong the segregation of the two, and in fact, nurture it. If this is your goal, then so be it. I would simply warn you of the recourse it will have.

You will, in the public eye, forever be creating a definitive separation of the two. This will spawn an animosity in those who dislike having ideas "pushed in their face" so to speak, many of whom are probably on the lesser extent of any bias presently.

There are a great number of reasons for not taking out a big sign which says "I'm gay!" or "I'm hispanic!" or "I'm disabled!". The result you get is not what you want, it does not help people accept it, it makes people wonder why you're creating a stir.

Acceptance and dissemenation of culture comes from blending in with that culture. When I say this, I do not mean hiding yourself inside it, but becoming part of it from within. You neither want to hide the fact, nor do you want to blatantly draw attention to the fact. Neither are productive in that goal.

Oh, bother. Looks like I need to take my own advice on post length

Si,

thank you,

you said my thoughts exactly in a way in which I couldn't verbalize.

They mean well trying to be "loud and proud" but all that does is in the long term make things worse.

I agree at first it may be needed to bring issues to the forefront but once people realize we need to be sensitive to your issues its time to come inside the system and live with us not apart from us.... I swear not all straight people bite.

By standing out you make people think .... that persons gay... they are different.

If you just keep it to yourself (this does not mean hide or lie about it) you can meet people show them you are a great person then if it comes up tell the truth, it is a far more effective way of spreading the truth about your cause than running around screaming I'm gay deal with it.

The former will spread tolerance the latter will spread separationg and fear.

JV

Argh, why did I get in to this thread?



WTF?! The question is "hey, who want's to form a group to maybe make a [x] themed sim" and your answer is "not me, and I don't think anyone else should either"?

Not to put too fine a point on it, but who cares what you are for or against if you are not part of this proposed community? I put this not just to Schwartz, but to everyone. If you don't want to play, just go do your own thing, but don't bug those that do.

This seems like basic common sense to me people, "...but I defend to the death your right so say it" stuff.

I thought we were for the most part a community of tolerant, creative reasonably urbane people, but you say the g-word and suddenly eveyone's all "I think I have the right to complain about things people do in SL that don't affect me at all".

Actually I can care less what people do as long as a few things are followed.

1. Don't force your views on me.

2. Try to be considerate, anti-gay wording can be considered offendsive, if you want people to treat you right you must understand that to some people homosexuality offends what they believe in.

3. Follow the sim guidelines (not saying that all gay stuff is sexual but it is a sexuality based sim, so i think the warning does need to be there).

As to why the discussion got so large at least in my replies, I saw a few people that thought this may be a bad idea and then someone (wonder who) screamed and yelled as usual about how they are persecuted and we are all prejudiced bastards (my wording). So I thought I should defend my views and perhaps express my opinions on the general idea of seperation by sexuality. I think it is wrong not because I believe homosexuality is wrong (i'll reserve my opinions in that realm to myself) but because it is actually worse for those "persecuted".

That being said let them have their gay sim, it is just the type of liberal, lets shove our views out there who cares if we offend as long as we don't offend others.

I have no issues with gay people and oh wait here it comes, i have gay friends (when did that become a oh well your still a prejudiced bastard line? I've seen it sneered at... I'm sorry I'm not gay but I think by having gay friends it does make me fairly sensitive to the issues even though my personal beliefs may be different)

anyways, have fun, good luck and i wish all the best.

JV

Did he say "liberal"?!?

Hey! I know gay people who are republican! liberal smiberal.

I'm from the Mid-West. MOST of my gay friends are Republican!

Of course, most of my Republican friends are not gay.





(Not that there's anything wrong with that. Republicanism is a personal lifestyle choice, and they're welcome to it, as long as they don't try to force their way of life on me!

Ummm. Maybe I better shut up before I get in trouble

I would be strongly opposed to a Republican-themed sim.

we already had one

Well, it might not be so bad, as long as they avoid being too exclusive

I'd prefer not to have that kind of activity pushed in my face, but I can handle it without feeling too separated from them. Of course, it would be better if they simply learned to blend into the normal culture, but what the hey - I can understand why they'd want to be with their own kind


Live and let live, I say ;-D

lol Kathy

Join the Dark Side, we will not hurt you I promise

GOP forever....

just so you know so you don't think i'm a typical GOP follower.

I am a 20 yr. old college student at a liberal school, my parents are fairly moderate, my friends are all liberals, i am an ex drug and alcohol addict, I live in New England... not quite the stereo typical Republican. I looked at both sides and I found way too much hypocrisy on the left and I truly believe in the ideals of the right, not perhaps what politicians may corrupt as its ideals but the true ideals of it.

I also read tons of political writings from both sides, whatever i have time to read, so don't claim i'm just brainwashed by listening to Rush....

Did anyone catch the show today great discussion about genetic food.

JV

Because even though this idea may not be something I'm interested in, it affects all of SL in one way or another, and I'm a part of SL, aren't I?

Open discussion is healthy in a large community; I'd rather have my idea torn apart savagely in a five-page thread than go uncontested and end up failing.

I just dont understand. I do not feel affected by Americana or Dark Woods in my SL. (I pick those only because Im not a member ot them). How would you be affected?

After reviewing what I consider some disturbing reactions, I feel mildly compelled to just cancel my account here. What am I paying $14 a month for honestly? If a group of people WOULD like to form a gay themed sim they have every reason to without having to go through any "aesthetic" or whatever community standard bs.

FYI There was no "agenda" behind my suggestion. I'm not using the term "homosexual agenda" because it wasn't used, but rather, implied.


I just feel really... I don't really feel compelled to log in anytime soon because I'm a little nauseauted with some of the responses.

I'm rambling. But whatever. I'm just really bothered with some of the responses this has gathered - and you have every right to vocalize them - I just don't have to agree with them or accept them either.

Baltus,

I have a house just a stone's throw from Thai's club. The folks in Clara didn't build spite fences and ugly insulting towers next to it. Her club is a nice addition to the neighborhood, unlike the stray prims and stuff that litter that part of Clara.

Contrary to what was said and implied in this thread, a gay themed sim will probably not bring out villagers with pitchforks and torches.

With a few exceptions, most of us here are of the Live and Let Live type. If there is enough popular support for a gay themed sim, it will happen. If not, then maybe it will be just a small themed subset. Either way, the same goal is met.

The following is a list of famouse gay people throughout history. We do have a culture. It is rich in Art, and science and biusiness. We have martyrs as well their names make up the second list below.



Clive Barker Film Maker
Bernstein, Leonard (composer)
Blass, Bill (fashion designer)
Capote, Truman (writer)
Clift, Montgomery (stage and fim actor)
Coward, Noël (actor, playwright, composer)
Dali, Salvador (artist)
Edward II (monarch)
Epstein, Brian (pop group manager)
Everett, Rupert (actor, writer)
Ginsberg, Allen (poet, activist)
Hamer, Dean (geneticist, researcher)
Hudson, Rock (film actor)
Johnson, Corey (American football player)
Leonardo da Vinci (artist, musician, scientist, engineer)
Proust, Marcel (novelist)
Ritts, Herb (photographer)
Sappho (poet)
Schubert, Franz (composer)
Springfield, Dusty (pop singer)
Stein, Gertrude (author)
Tchaikovsky, Pyotr Ilyich (composer)
Valentino, Rudolph (film actor)
Whitman, Walt (poet)
Wilde, Oscar (playwright, poet)


1631, May 14 -- Mervyn Touchet - Earl of Castlehaven, 12th Lord of Audley, brother-in-law to Francis Bacon, beheaded.
1730 ---------- Lt. Hans von Katte - beheaded, lover of Prince Frederick the Great of Prussia.
1907 ---------- Jiu Jin "Qinxiong" - lesbian poet beheaded in China. Wore men’s clothes. Qinxiong means "compete with men"
1942 ---------- Henny Schermann - lesbian, gassed at Bernburg psychiatric hospital
1977, July 24 - Cynthia Coffman - Nashville, Tennessee, shot
1977, July 24 - Felicia Coffman - Nashville, Tennessee, shot
1978, Nov. 27 - Harvey Milk - San Francisco City Official, assasinated
1984, July 7 -- Charlie Howard - thrown over a bridge in Bangor, ME
1992, June ---- 5 men - taken from a bar and shot with submachine guns near Medellin, Colombia
1993, Jan. 3 -- Eric Moore - 22, shot at point-blank range, body hung from a hook in DC
1993, Dec. 31 - Brandon Teena - executed by gun in Nebraska
1995, Aug. 8 -- Tyra Hunter- Washington, D.C., was refussed medical treatment after an auto accident
1997 ---------- Marcus Wayman - Minersville, PA, committed suicide after police told him they would inform his family of homosexuality.
1998, Oct. 12 - Matthew Wayne Shepard - Laramie, Wyoming, beaten
2001, Sept 11 - Eugene Clark - WTC, 103rd Floor
2001, Sept 11 - David Charlebois - co-pilot of Flight 77
2001, Sept 11 - Mark Bingham - passenger on Flight 93
2001, Sept 11 - Jeff Collman - 31, passenger on Flight 11

I am not trying to fight with anyone here so please do not take this as an attack but an explanation. The question keeps being asked why. I can only give my reason and it is highly personal. The names not listed here are the names of the thousand no millions of young people who committed suicide because they were gay. These people grew up in a world that does not have to celebrate being straight. You see for a long time now the world has considered heterosexuality as the norm. I am not arguing if it is or is not. All I am trying to say is that being gay is not dirty wrong or sick. It is what it is. I am out all the time everywhere because there are still young people out there who need positive role models.
When I came out role models were few and far between, most of the community was still brainwashed to the belief that we needed to stay in our Gay Ghettos and Bars (out of site).
I want to be able to show both young and older people who fear the difference in them selves that there is a place where they can be safe. There is a place where they can feel empowered to be whatever they choose.
If you doubt our history or our struggle it does exist. Many people know of the Red Ribbon or Pink Triangle. Very few however know the history of the Black Triangle. Lesbians in Nazi Germany were forced to wear it. It did not however mean they were lesbian. It meant they were viewed as sexual deviants. Very few people also know that when the camps were liberated at the end of the war there were two groups of people who were not freed. Those people wearing the Pink or Black Triangle were kept in the camps, some as long as a year more.
I don’t write these posts to fight. I don’t have a gay club to force my views on anyone. I am not in support of this project because I have some hidden agenda. I do what I do simply because I have to. Silence equals death. A voice however equals freedom.

Okay, I'll retract my statements here if it'll make people feel all soft and warm and cuddly inside.

In hindsight, I was opposed to the Star Wars themed sim, too, but no one felt like I was making personal attacks when I argued against that one ...

Sorry but I won't retract my statements.

I am sick of every time you disagree with an idea or opinion that has to do with homosexuality and all of a sudden that must mean i'm an evil oppressor and a bigot. I'm allowed to have my own opinions on the matter without agreeing to everything you want.

I don't think this is a bad idea because I'm against having it here, or that I think you'll be harrassed, or that I think you'll have wild sodomy in PG sims. I'm against it because for one I don't think you can complain about being offended by anything if you do things that may offend others, also because if you truly cared about the cause you may take your head out someday and realize that by marching forever you just turn some people off from ever accepting you.

my 2,000,000,000 cents

JV

Xavier - Should I really begin listing every heterosexual serial killer? I'm afraid the list would be too long.

Baltus,

Just remember, you're only getting a small selection of SL members. And it it's significant that none of these folks - myself included - have anything to do with deciding to form this group.

This might be a better slogan for Second Life than Nike: Just do it. Whatever happens after that canNOT be as bad as trying to solve all the problems of prejudice here in the forums first.



Xav,

I get it now. Your point is that gay people are evil lawbreakers who are as likely to eat you as look at you.

Thanks for adding to the discussion. We get it now - no need to make the point again.

Thanks for caring enough to share.

Drive through.

Kathy,

besides Xaviers rather inconsiderate posts, who is prejudiced?

I think that has been the theme of all my posts, it is wrong for you to label everyone that has a different opinion on the homesexual topic as prejudiced.

In todays society it has become normal to label anyone who disagrees on minority or sexuality policies as prejudiced. Its the quickest way to kill what they are saying and their reputation. I know you are an intelligent woman please be more original than that.

I am allowed to have my opinion on ANY themed sim in SL, and I am allowed to state my opinion. It is up to Baltus if he/she (never met baltus don't want to get it wrong) wants to listen to me or anyone else.

Gonna get generalistic here in this next part for simplicity sake but I know this doesn't apply to all of you.

I find it very funny that Liberals are all about open discussion, free speech, freedom of ideas, as long as those ideas are not conservative or the opposite of their ideas.

One sided freedoms and hypocrisy, exactly what turned me away from the left.

JV

You may not know me well, yet. Whatever folks feel about what I write, I think they'd support my claim that I usually choose my words carefully. Here is a good example of someone reading things in my words that I did not put there.

I said it would be better to go ahead with the project instead of "trying to solve all the problems of prejudice here in the forums first."

I didn't say, "trying to solve all the problems of THE prejudice here in the forums first. "

I also didn't say, "trying to solve the obvious prejudices of all those who are against the project. "

And I didn't even say, "ignore how prejudiced these posters are. "

I just recommended he not try to deal with prejudice - ANYone's prejudice - as a precondition to starting his group. He should just go ahead and start it.

I never even IMPLIED that you - in particular - were prejudice - though I WILL now imply that you are a bit touchy.

And, BTW, I ALSO never said that Conservatives are all about being "compassionate" except when they're being reactionary and thick-headed.

And as someone who tries to be CONSISTENT to a universal ethic, I don't think I'm likely to sat that either - even if you use a brush just as wide to paint liberals as hypocrits.

It would be good to get to know me before you simply toss me into a pile with all your other hypocritical "liberal friends".



Ok, I guess I'm touchy too.

We are both touchy Kathy, but I respect you greatly. You are a very level headed lefty and I appreciate that.

you are correct about the prejudice remark, I just get very touchy when people try to say i'm prejudice just because I don't buy what they are selling. So I read more into your post than you may have meant.

You mentioned my broad brush, I did put the disclaimer that I was just being general for simplicity sake and that I know not all liberals fall under that brush stroke, though a lot of the ones in the public light do in my opinion.

I look forward to your continued postings and if I ever misread your posts again make sure to blast me

JV