Extending the "No Access" barrier over your land

lawl Banking i hear Ya.....


my partner and i were just discussing this, and we both agree: there is no way that you can please everyone. someone will find a flaw in anything. privacy in sl is technically impossible, yet we continue to debate who has the right to do what on someone else's property.

one solution? how about those who wish to have unrestricted fly space pay a fee to the sim owner(s) for just that. this way you are contributing to thier tier fees and you can fly unhindered. other than that, you have no right what so ever to complain, unless they are being jackamoles. no matter how you try to justify why your rights should supercedes another's, the bottom line is still the same: thier property, thier tier fees, thier rules.

I might have been I don't remember - I think I just fell off the island as it were.

By the way, I am a Jew and have chosen a Jewish name here in SL so I get those comments too sometimes...I try to let it roll off my back.

Best,
G

The sooner LLABS changes the privacy format on ones land well have these types of issues.



Ummmmmmmmmmmm No....... problem is many that abuse air space are griefters......those that know and like flying don`t bother land owners spaces...They repect people sence of a person bubble.

I tried to get on SL - but it appears to have crashed - just thought I'd let you all know

the land owner can set thier parcel to "no object entry" which will take care of those who fly just to grief. i only offered a solution to what seems to be a well gnawed bone, if those who wish to have unrestricted fly space truly want it, then they have to be willing to work with sim and parcel owners/renters.

well that is right......but they still get their air ships at times stuck inthe no fly to entry areas.....I had this one person awhile back ( boy was she dum ) I IM her told her to remove her air ship ( she said call a linden ) well IF this person had any sence she would have flied to the closest land to her air ship and remove it.........Gesh.....Nothing is worse the a air griefter that TRIES to insult you. AFter they flying over protected landed land of someone.

I do understand your point.........

Usagi

Well, I am sorry life was/is hard on you, but believe me, you are not alone. Many people have to carry a weight in their lives. One a bit heavier then another. I have my share of things as well.

Your remark about the wall I had up for 2 or 3 hours? Yes, you are right. Why did you think I removed it again? But I too can get annoyed when I am confronted all the time with something I see as plain ugly.

I life on the country-side. As is common around here, the back door during daytime is always open when someone is home. People walk in all the time. And no, they will not run up into the bedrooms. They will enter the second kitchen and if no one is there they will raise a "folk?" and if no response, they will leave. It very common that way here (and no, don't think the country-side of "Twente" or the "Achterhoek" are small communities).
Sure, we have crime here too... but it is low compared to the big cities around here.

We have 3 dogs here, they are pets... nothing more nothing less. I am sorry to say, but I dislike guarddogs because 99% of them show very disturb behaviour.

Honestly I don't see how ban-lines can protect you from being called something you hate (or beyound that). Unless you never leave your SL land and mute everyone you don't know or distrub that comes close.

And I have completely no need to watch you or your partner.

Anyway, I have clear different views on things then you have. And I think I have the right to that. I never told you not to have ban-lines or what. I only stated clearly I dislike them very much... which is my right... as it is yours to like them and put them up.

Morwen.

Where does the information on what LL require of security orbs come from?
It's not in the TOS or the CS as far as I can see. No mention of 6 seconds, 8 seconds or even warning that the user is about to be ejected/TPd.

It's a matter of being a good neighbor. When I used to live on the mainland, there was a neighboring plot with a security device that would toss you across the sim if you even stepped on their land for a second- an incredible pain to be jerked across the sim just because you happened to stand back for a minute to get a look at something you're building.

I'd prefer folks didn't use orbs at land level at all, but if they do, they damn well better give innocent passersby a few seconds to get out of the way.

i do know on some mainland parcels they are not allowed. but in regards to privately owned ones, if ample warning is given, they are allowed. perhaps one more knowledgable in regards to this can be more helpful.

the seconds which the person that trips ( as teh say ) the Orb you have of time to which they are removed off your land. And some better orb makers tell you that LLABS says 8 second id what LLABS recommends.

I'm not saying it's a good idea to use them with 1 second timing, just wondering how it could be against TOS without it actually being in the TOS.
Besides, right click -> eject has no warning

So it's not actually direct from LL themselves?
If it was posted somewhere, I'd be inclined to believe it. As it is, they give us the tools to eject and ban without warning.

Was just curious as to where the info came from anyway, we shall now return to the regularly scheduled broadcast

As I recall it was told to the orb makers ( 8 seconds was tos friendly )

Yes it is your land but no one owns the sky. If you wish to own the sky then LL should sell land by the cubic meter. If you think you own 500 meters into the air. Then pay for it.

Rox

I find this debate and all the many versions of it that have gone on before interesting.

I'm not a landowner (because with my machine, and the, uh, issues with SL, it's not worth it for me right now to start paying for something that, 9 times out of 10, crashes within moments of my arriving) so I don't have experience from that point of view. But I did have my first experience with a security orb the other day.

Here's how it went: I TP'd to a location I've been to many times. Lag was so superific that when I got up to fly over to a spot, at first I didn't move. Then, oh, thirty seconds or so later, I started zooming and couldn't stop until I was way the hell over on another parcel. I had no idea where I was, just up in the sky somewhere, and then frozen. The mini map was blank, and all I had to go was the new name up on the header of the viewer. Then I was frozen for a while, then suddenly I was home. ONLY THEN did I get the warning that I didn't have access to the land I was on and had ten seconds to move.

I find it funny that people assume that someone loitering over their land has ill intent. For me, some of the time it's because I'm trying to get oriented, most of the time it's because there's such brutal lag I can't move anyway. Ban lines and fearing that I'm going to get bounced all over the place by orbs greatly diminishes my experience of SL.

nods true, however many forget that that "sky" that is so precious, is over someones sim. and like it or not, in a way they do own it. metaphorically speaking. so if your sole intention is to just fly, then fly. however if you stop over someone's land, to check out the scenery, and they have an orb working, then thats your bad(unless as the previous poster stated,lag can be a pain). if they have banlines up for whatever the reason go around. no matter how you justify it, the song is the same. and until LL revises it, deal.

Privacy is a wonderful thing but there is a old saying "The right to swing your arm ends at my nose"
I have been spammed and harassed by secruity orbs on my own land. Forced to deal wtih ban lines for nothing more than wanting to visit a friend two plots over.
We won't even talk about the things I have lost forever thanks to security orbs.
The question is where is my rights?

I think the ones who push the hardest for secruity orbs and ban lines have a over inlfated sense of self importance. I have a clue for you kiddies. 99% of the people don't care about you or land. They are going from point A to point B. I have spent alot of time watching people pass by on my land. They zip by and don't even notice.

The other part of this is that it has turned Second Life in to a unfriendly place.
I remember back in the day when you had nothing better to do. Go for a walk. Admire the builds, talk to your neighbors. Now it's "Don't come near, don't talk to me" Which makes me wonder, when did we let the lunatic fringe element in. Judging from some of the posts on this subject, it looks like they don't need a security orb, they need shrink.

The privacy people have won. My airplanes, cars and boats sit in my inventory unused and unloved. If want to visit a friend my mine who's house I can see from my land. I use TP. Navigating the hodge podge of sercurity orbs and ban lines to go even a short distance is not worth it.

Long before I came to Second LIfe, I played a MMORPG that did not have land like we do here. You were given a room. It had windows and you could see the pretty country side but you could not walk out of the room. To visit anyone invovled a drawn out process of seeing if they were online, sending them a IM and then if they wanted to see you. They would tp you to their place. The closest thing to a virtual jail cell I ever saw. But by god no one flew over or walked by. Maybe this is what SL is going to turn into. When that happens LL can rename the game to Second Hell.

I wish you all well in your bunkers but this is turning SL into something I don't recongize any more.

Rox

i am truly sorry. however to lump those who seek some private moments with friends, partners, creating or building to "lunatic fringe" is a bit much. some of what You say i agree with. Sl is never gonna be they same again. thats what happens when a great idea is acted upon, it evolves. the SL you knew is probably not the same SL i knew a year ago. i've accepted it. and until the ones who think it's just jolly good to run around and show you thier giant penises, or orbit you, or have sex in your "home", or drop garbage prims, over sized prims, or replicating prims, are gone, get use to this stage in evolution of SL.

take heart, next year, or next week, it will evolve again.


p.s. you'd think with the ban line being dropped another 100 meters would end threads like this.

That is the very valid other side of the argument. Where can there be a happy medium? For me it would be just the abilty to to have privacy in my house somewhat similar to RL. If the doors are locked and windows are shaded, no one can see inside, using the camera or floating prims. I'll never use a ban line on my property, or use any wholesale banning, for I too like to wander around the world. I respect other peoples privacy, I never go into a home uninvited or use the camera tricks to look inside.

Linden Labs gives residents the ability to limit access up to 768m above their land so, for all intents and purposes, they do own that portion of the sky.



As do the ones who think they should have the right to dictate what other people do, based on what's convenient for them.



Well, there's a nice friendly attitude..."You don't think the same things I do, therefore there's something psychologically wrong with you."

The majority of the guidelines for security orb use originally came as a response by Lee Linden to a post I made in the now defunct "Ask a Linden" Forum. That would have been about 2 years ago when I was have problems with a neighbor pissed because my security was 1m above my house litterally 14m high.

In it he laid out some very specific guidelines BUT he also made it clear they were guidelines not requirements.

As far as I know nothing official has ever been said about it.

because some have loved ones who work or live in different parts of the US and or world. i saw a post where a couple due to, ones job, and the travling they do, use sl as a way to stay in touch. others use SL as a way to let creative juices flow without the disturbance of RL issues for that moment. still others have children who at any moment can run up behind mom or dad to see what they are doing. so yeah privacy IS a right.

its a priviledge to be invited onto another's space, wether its SL or RL.

No it is a matter of perspective. Second Life for all intents and purproses is a video game.
No one can burn your house down you have a cartoon character for a body so there is really nothing to see. If your doing the virtual nasty, it's cartoons screwing.
With those factors to consider to hear someone say I am going to boot any one in 2 nanoseconds who dares to fly by. Is kooky talk.

Now if this was the real world and my neighbor could zoom in seeing me taking a shower from his house. By god I would be leading the charge on this issue.

But we return to this a video game.
The world is make believe.
Unless LL does something to drastlcly change way this is presented it remains make believe.

Last but not least. No one cares about your land or what you are doing on it.
If you think they do, then you do have a over inflated sense of self importance.
Most people won't even know you exist until they hit the orb. Perhaps the orb is not to keep people out but a way of saying "Hey Look At Me"

I honestly wish you all well. Like I said this is turning SL into someting I don't know any more. I once heard Second Life referred to as a "Social MMORPG" it looks me it's turning into a Anti Social MMORPG

Rox

I pretty much keep to myself in SL. I tend to be a little shy. Most of the time I won't speak to someone unless the speak me first. Unless i know them of course.
One of the simple pleasures in SL was flying. I used to fly in the real world and for personal reasons I won't bore you with I can not fly right now.

Firing up my little seaplane and going for a cruise was a treat, Gave me a feeling of being back in the air. Not anymore. If isn't a orb giving me dire warnings I will sent to hell and my plane gone to who knows where. Sometimes to never to return or bouncing off a ban line.
This has ceased to be fun. Now I just tp about or sit in my house.

So because of someones sense of paranoia or inflated ego. They have taken away something that is fun for me and never impacted thier quality of life.

I hope they have fun hidding in thier bunkers and cursing the sky.

Rox