Anyone Attending the Protest!!!!
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Green Panther
Registered User
Join date: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 64
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07-27-2007 11:23
From: Archer Braun They day casino owners and/or their patrons provide SL with a place like Svarga...maybe...just *maybe*...I'll give a dry popcorn f*rt about them losing their toys.
What you should be asking yourself is who is going to be left to speak up for you when LL decide to ruin your business under pressure from some jackbooted feds.
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Green Panther
Registered User
Join date: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 64
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Strange logic
07-27-2007 11:29
From: Jarred Tammas I was listening to a talk show and they were talking about the web and the gambiling issue here on SL. A few that called in said they were the casinos beign 86ed and one for keeping them. Another that called in that was against them was an Intel employee and he mentioned his company recently "bought" the "Intel" last name for use of their employees when they hold meetings in SL. He mentioned in addition to the government's rules on net gambling, SL may also be wanting to steer away from allowing casins to attact more business to put their $$ into SL like Intel did. Some companies might be hesitant about coming into SL if there's gambiling. That's what the fella on the talk show mentioned. Right now, one of the few viable industries in SL is gambling. Gambling operators make up a very significant % of those actually making money. Gambling and adult services are the backbone of the SL economy, like it or not. Intel might be a big noise in the real world, but they mean absolutely jack in SL and likely always will. Every big corporation that has come into SL has done so as a cheap publicity stunt, none have stayed and developed anything resembling a commercial stream of revenue. All they wanted to do was jump on the bandwagon of cheap publicity SL is getting.
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Chris Norse
Loud Arrogant Redneck
Join date: 1 Oct 2006
Posts: 5,735
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07-27-2007 11:47
From: Green Panther What you should be asking yourself is who is going to be left to speak up for you when LL decide to ruin your business under pressure from some jackbooted feds. Like I said earlier, "Lets you and him fight." You are wanting the Lindens to face fines and jail time. If you are standing up for principle, fine, I applaud that. If you are wanting someone else to stand up for your principles and face punishment while you cheer from the sidelines.........bullshit.
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I'm going to pick a fight William Wallace, Braveheart
“Rules are mostly made to be broken and are too often for the lazy to hide behind” Douglas MacArthur
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Brenda Connolly
Un United Avatar
Join date: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 25,000
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07-27-2007 11:53
From: Green Panther What you should be asking yourself is who is going to be left to speak up for you when LL decide to ruin your business under pressure from some jackbooted feds. Most Feds I've known wear Oxfords. Maybe tassled loafers, or wingtips if they are edgy.
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Don't you ever try to look behind my eyes. You don't want to know what they have seen.
http://brenda-connolly.blogspot.com
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Coyote Momiji
Pintsized Plutonium
Join date: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 715
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07-27-2007 12:04
From: Green Panther What you should be asking yourself is who is going to be left to speak up for you when LL decide to ruin your business under pressure from some jackbooted feds. Yes. So many of the casino folks stood up for kinky people when that whole "broadly offensive" mess came out. Really. At least one of the people yelling loudest about casinos being banned was revelling when sexual ageplay got banned. So, please do forgive me if I find the whole thing rather deeply amusing.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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07-27-2007 12:07
From: Nina Stepford bite me. i may be rude, but im not pretentious. And the hilarious part is that you think that one is better than the other.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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07-27-2007 12:11
From: Green Panther Second Life is an international service and it isn't against the law to gamble in many countries that didn't elect a retard for a president. However, the servers are in America, the company is American, and all key employees are in America. Thus, American law holds sway. SL really isn't an "international service", so much as it is an American service that a ton of international people use.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Har Fairweather
Registered User
Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
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07-27-2007 12:12
From: Reitsuki Kojima And the hilarious part is that you think that one is better than the other. Nah, I agree with Nina on that point. Some people deserve rude treatment, and I'll cheer in those cases. But someone who's pretentious? Then it's time to break out the handshake buzzers and the seltzer bottles. Very different.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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07-27-2007 12:15
From: Har Fairweather Nah, I agree with Nina on that point. Some people deserve rude treatment, and I'll cheer in those cases. But someone who's pretentious? Then it's time to break out the handshake buzzers and the seltzer bottles. Very different. To my mind, if you think being rude is acceptable, you have little room to complain about most other social no-nos.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Green Panther
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Join date: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 64
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Faulty logic
07-27-2007 12:25
From: Reitsuki Kojima However, the servers are in America, the company is American, and all key employees are in America. Thus, American law holds sway.
SL really isn't an "international service", so much as it is an American service that a ton of international people use. The basic architecture of the internet is located in America, and run by Americans. International internet users do not bow to American law.
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
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07-27-2007 12:26
they dont call him 'witchhunter' for nothing.
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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07-27-2007 12:27
From: Green Panther The basic architecture of the internet is located in America, and run by Americans. International internet users do not bow to American law. Nope - But Linden Labs has to.
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Coyote Momiji
Pintsized Plutonium
Join date: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 715
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07-27-2007 12:28
From: Green Panther The basic architecture of the internet is located in America, and run by Americans. International internet users do not bow to American law. Are you using a service based in America that has to bow to American law?
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Har Fairweather
Registered User
Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
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07-27-2007 12:28
From: Reitsuki Kojima To my mind, if you think being rude is acceptable, you have little room to complain about most other social no-nos. Please don't misunderstand. Some people richly deserve to be treated rudely because they are so offensive themselves. In fact, sometimes it is necessary, because some people regard politeness as a contemptible weakness to be taken advantage of and there is no other way to communicate with them. No-one deserves pretentiousness; that is an oxymoron.
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Tybalt Brando
Catalyst
Join date: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 347
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07-27-2007 12:28
From: Green Panther The basic architecture of the internet is located in America, and run by Americans. International internet users do not bow to American law. Great, then talk to Linden Labs, offer them some money to move their entire operations overseas, and then you may have gambling again. Until then.. LL - American Company LL Servers - Located in US LL- Has to follow American Law.
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Incanus Merlin
Not User Serviceable
Join date: 12 Apr 2007
Posts: 583
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07-27-2007 12:31
From: Green Panther The basic architecture of the internet is located in America, and run by Americans. International internet users do not bow to American law. I am rather surprised you do not see the flaw in that logic, Green
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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07-27-2007 12:32
From: Green Panther The basic architecture of the internet is located in America, and run by Americans. International internet users do not bow to American law. No, it isn't. A select few servers used to direct traffic and such are in America. The servers that actually DO things are located in almost every country on earth. "The Internet" is not a business. Linden Lab is a business, an American one at that, and all of its servers are located here, in America.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Har Fairweather
Registered User
Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
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07-27-2007 12:32
From: Coyote Momiji Are you using a service based in America that has to bow to American law? Those who prefer something clearly "non-American" instead can always go to Entropia [almost blows eardrums out trying to restrain uncontrollable guffaws].
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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07-27-2007 12:34
From: Tybalt Brando Great, then talk to Linden Labs, offer them some money to move their entire operations overseas, and then you may have gambling again.
Until then..
LL - American Company LL Servers - Located in US LL- Has to follow American Law. or maybe not - American Credit card companies might still deny payment if SL was seen as a "Gambling Site" so wed need to move all the credit card companies too.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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07-27-2007 12:34
From: Har Fairweather Please don't misunderstand. Some people richly deserve to be treated rudely because they are so offensive themselves. In fact, sometimes it is necessary, because some people regard politeness as a contemptible weakness to be taken advantage of and there is no other way to communicate with them. No-one deserves pretentiousness; that is an oxymoron. No, I'd say I'm not misunderstanding. If you think treating people rudely is acceptable, you don't get to complain about people making other social blunders.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Coyote Momiji
Pintsized Plutonium
Join date: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 715
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07-27-2007 12:34
From: Har Fairweather Those who prefer something clearly "non-American" instead can always go to Entropia [almost blows eardrums out trying to restrain uncontrollable guffaws]. Dude, let it out. You'll hurt yourself otherwise.
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Har Fairweather
Registered User
Join date: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 2,320
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07-27-2007 12:35
On a more serious note, I expect the day will come when LL opens the grid and allows people to hook up their own servers, wherever they may be located. Then this sort of question will be moot. And gambling will be back, if that is what you want.
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Archer Braun
Registered User
Join date: 12 Nov 2006
Posts: 190
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07-27-2007 12:37
From: Green Panther What you should be asking yourself is who is going to be left to speak up for you when LL decide to ruin your business under pressure from some jackbooted feds. I speak up for furries, adult RP-ers, the creators of content I find meaningful, useful, or just plain funny. I speak up for all sorts of imaginitive, creative, salacious, and/or just plain *weird* people. THEY make life worth living. Dull clods out for a fast buck on the net, while they scar the land with monolithic lag-slinging blingtardiness? *shrugs* Sorry.
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Green Panther
Registered User
Join date: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 64
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Principles
07-27-2007 12:37
From: Chris Norse Like I said earlier, "Lets you and him fight." You are wanting the Lindens to face fines and jail time. If you are standing up for principle, fine, I applaud that. If you are wanting someone else to stand up for your principles and face punishment while you cheer from the sidelines.........bullshit. If you can think of a productive way to fight this ruling which would conceivably involve jail time, I'm all ears. I don't think there is one however. And I think you are vastly overstating the risks of allowing gambling to continue-web businesses where the core service is user-generated, eg youtube, regularly allow their users to play fast and loose with the law. I do like to think I wouldn't have folded quite so meekly and pathetically as the Lindens did in this case. Either way there is an additional problem: casinos have been a mainstay of SL for as long as any one can remember. They are a significant part of the economy. LL basically used those people to grow their business and now have dumped them when it was politically expedient to do so. Good luck attracting investors with that approach, LL. So, it is not just a question of principle, it is a question of loyalty and business confidence.
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Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
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07-27-2007 12:39
From: Har Fairweather Those who prefer something clearly "non-American" instead can always go to Entropia [almost blows eardrums out trying to restrain uncontrollable guffaws]. does anyone else find the name Entropia ironic? Its liek they are trying to name their venture to fail.
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