just ignore and let this one die

Have you seen the Amazon Kindle ad? Strangely, every time I see it, I think of you. Somehow it reminds me of you ^_^

Hey Brenda ... sounds like you're going through the same process that I am with looking for a new computer and it's confusing as hell! All these meaningless numbers and blah blah claims about this and that makes it really hard to figure out whether it will actually work well with SL, given that people have so many different set ups. I also really don't need a new computer so I don't wanna spend a fortune just for SL, so I know where you're at.

I'll run through my thinking since we're likely in the same boat. I have a 2 year old laptop with integrated graphics that I bought just before starting SL and it's great for all of my other needs but it sucks balls for SL so you don't wanna go there which I'm sure you know already. You'll want to go with a discrete graphics card, and apparently NVIDIA cards tend to play better than others with SL. The one you're thinking about seems pretty decent I think. Here are a couple of links I've been using as I've been comparing different models: http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/index.php I think yours ranks in the middle of the high end video card range and I think I've heard that card will work well with SL. I really wish LL would update this page that ranks graphics cards based on frames per second on the viewer but this is from 2007 https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2007/11/16/typical-frame-rate-performance-by-graphics-cardgpu Also I've heard that you should be looking at the 2nd number of NVIDIA cards and the higher that number is, the better it will be, but I've been using that videocard benchmarking website to compare. Personally I'm looking for something in the low to mid range of the high end range of gcards on those charts so it doesn't have to be top of the line. Frankly, anything I end up buying will be better than my current 10fps on a good day with no windlight or basic shaders while looking at a blank texture at 3000m.

With regards to RAM, your model comes with 4GB which I think should be fine for SL. They do say more is better if you're doing a lot of multi-tasking like having SL, firefox, Photoshop and iTunes running all at once. Your system is also using an older form of DDR2 RAM, but whether that would really impact your SL that much, I'm unclear. That system also has the capability of having up to 8GB of RAM installed since it comes with Windows 7 64bit. W7 32bit, you would be maxed out at 4GB so it is nice that you have the room to bump up your memory in the future since RAM is cheap and easy to put in yourself. Win7 64bit you may run into some compatibility issues but it should really be a non-issue if you're using standard stuff http://www.pcworld.com/article/181165/windows_7_64bit_users_living_in_a_32bit_world.html I've read 64bit is fine with SL as long as you have all the updated drivers.

The only other thing that stands out in the system you're thinking about is the Intel Dual Core processor. It's not the fastest one of the block but I'm not sure how that might impact your SL or how else you might be using your pc. http://www.cpubenchmark.net/ Don't quote me on this but I think I heard the viewer can't really utilize multiple cores all that well anyways so the point may be moot.

I'll throw out the one I'm thinking about for opinions as well which is the Dell Vostro 430 with Windows 7 Premium 64 bit, Intel i5 core, 4GB DDR3, 1GB NVIDIA GeForce GTS240 for $889Cdn: http://www1.ca.dell.com/content/products/featuresdetails.aspx/vostro-430?c=ca&l=en&s=bsd&cs=cabsdt1&~lt=popup

Confusing is an understatement. I've owned a total of 2 computers in my entire life. My first one was an EMachine that I pretty much picked up off the shelf at Circuit City because the price was what I had on me to spend. The one I am using now, a dell, I bought new off eBay, pretty much the same way, it came in at the price I decided I wanted to spend. I looked at your Dell, but since it is a laptop, it is of no interest to me.

SL will be the only intensive program I would be running on the new machine. I don't use iTunes, Photoshop, etc, or play any other games, nor do I watch TV or movies on my computer, I have a 46" TV for that. I'm also looking at this one as the high end of my price range.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=5466847&sku=SYX-1024-7

I'm not tinkerer or computer hobbyist, I really not interested upgrading every couple of years. Other than doubling the RAM, my Dell is the same as it was delivered to me in 2004. It is a bit funny factoring SL into a new computer when a part of me believes I will not be using SL in a year's time, based upon the direction the Lab has been going in recently,

That's a good machine. I buy all my stuff from Tiger. I <3 them. Personally I don't like integrated graphic cards. They never seem to be enough for the things I want to run(Even SL) I think you would be happy with the one you linked in my little geeky opinion. Though on my machine I did have the same graphic card and it was all wonky, I replaced it with a lesser model and things run much smoother now. Though I probably just got a faulty card.


/me pets thread

/me tacklehugs Brenda and anyone who wants one

Oh watch out Brenda, some of those systems at Tiger dont come with an OS,which is what makes them so cheap.(Or a monitor) So make sure you read the ads good.

I've been looking at crap for the last few days and I'm just as confused as when I first started. I've even resorted to IMing strangers who's blogs I've come across referencing their new computer and gcard I want to get for their opinions lol. Funny how you mention factoring in SL when you're considering your purchase because I'm questioning whether I'll even be using SL in a year as well. I don't play any other games either, nor do much heavy multi-tasking and my 2yr old laptop serves me well for everything except SL, so I'm really debating on whether I should be dropping close to a 1K on something I really don't need. I'm always telling people not to buy something way more powerful than they really need and I think I might need to heed my own advice. In your case, I'd just focus on getting a reasonably decent graphics card without blowing your budget, and use those charts as a reference to get a handle on how they rank, although I'm sure anything you get will be way better than your 4yr old machine and improve your SL experience. Oh and btw the Dell Vostro I'm thinking of getting is a desktop but bear in mind the link is for the Cdn Dell site so the price/specs may differ for you.

Oh one other thing to consider Brenda is whether being able to see shadows will be important to you in the future. "The new renderer supports only high-end graphics cards and requires a GeForce 8 or Radeon HD2600 or later, but will not work on Mac OSs." I think both of the models you linked would theoretically support it. I'm not so sure if the one I want will though. FFS this crap is hard to sort out

Since you are going to wait until Jan to buy I would recommend that you wait until then to look for your new computer. This month NVIDIA is supposed to come out with a new graphics card (the 300 series) and we might see their others drop a bit in price. That being said this is not a bad computer Brenda. The 9800 GT will run SL at a nice frame rate I know this because its what I have. You should have no trouble running SL with that computer's specs I think you could expect 20-30 FPS doing most anything in SL especially if you play around with your settings a bit.

The "Future-Proof Technology" comment about the graphics is BS because in just a month Nvidia is going to have dirextX 11 enabled graphics (ATI already supports it with their 5000 series) but the price tag will be in the 1k range for the graphics alone.

[GEEK]
I built my computer over a year ago with the e8400 3Ghz DUO Core and a high end mother board (StrikerII Extreme) with 3 GB 13333 DDR3 RAM (was 4 but one of my sticks went to crud on me.) I've overclocked everything about 20% and get 20-35 FPS with my prefs set at 256 draw distance, ultra, impostors off with 40+ avies dancin' around. I've pushed my FPS to 340 by turning everything as low as it will go. [/GEEK]




This computer will kick SL's butt, but ummmm its a DELL dude.

The computer that Brenda is thinking about will run with shadows enabled. I take a HUGE FPS hit with mine but hopefully that will smooth out a bit once shadowing is in an official release.

It comes with Windows 7, I checked that. I plan on using the monitor I have now, a 22" LG Flatscreen.

Shadows? Never really thought much about them, they probably aren't that important.. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'll start looking again in January.

This is so damn confusing Rafe lol. I'm kinda like Brenda in that I use my puter for basic stuff and don't play games with the exception of SL. I don't wanna splurge for essentially something I'm getting just for SL.

Can you explain what all this Direct X stuff is, in relationship to its impact on SL? I'm a bit confused about all the numbering crap with gcards and the Vostro I'm thinking about has a OEM card that doesn't seem to have all that much info about. Apparently it's a bit of a repackaged version of some older models http://www.nvidia.com/object/product_geforce_gts_240_us.html and it's confusing because they also have a GT 240 without the "S" which has different specs. For the one I want GTS 240, it just says Microsoft Direct X "compute" while the GT 240 says it does "10.1". I think you need at least direct x 10 to enable shadows, but in reality I'm not even sure if I want to spend the money on something I probably won't use all that often just to see shadows. If I can see the nice water and skies and be able to sail on the Blake Sea without lagging to death I'll be happy.

I've never ordered from Dell before and I've heard mixed reviews about them. I'm also a bit concerned it comes in a "mini" tower so if I ever did want to upgrade my gcard, it might be hard to access plus I'd prob have to get a bigger fan and power supply. Gah, I really WANT a new computer, even though I don't really NEED one and this decision making is stressing me out lol!!!!!

He he....I'm just the opposite. I really don't "want" a new computer, but this one is on it's last legs. The sound has failed, and the video card is ancient, it has no DVD drive and only a 350W power supply, so upgrading it would probably not be cost effective. If I weren't playing SL I would probably get a $500 Lenovo or something with an integrated graphics card and be done with it.

I also looked a Build to Order on TigerDirect, but figuring all that out made my head hurt even more.

Brenda here is a computer that is 14 dollars less once you add an OS and a couple other options...scroll down and choose the "NVIDIA GeForce GTS 240 512MB 16X PCI Express," 500GB HD, and win7 home premium and you'll have a kick ass computer. It will be about 35% faster graphics wise than the one you're looking at. CPU wise its a lot better too

http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Core_2_Duo_Configurator/ Notice that like the computer you listed this one does not come with a monitor. And I highly recommend spending the 49 dollars more for the 4GB of DDR3 memory over the 2 GB of DDR3 memory the base comes with. Notice that the computer you listed has DDR2 memory... DDR3 is much faster now that the drivers are up to snuff.

Here is a link to an independent review site that will give you an idea about buying from CyberPower. http://www.resellerratings.com/store/CyberPower

ETA here is a link that I set up to compare these cards (you'll have to cut and paste because auto parsing creates a bad link)....http://service.futuremark.com/hardware/graphics_cards/nvidia_geforce_gts_240?chipsetId=465&popularChipsetIds=518&popularChipsetIds=523&popularChipsetIds=524&popularChipsetIds=465


Josh...the directX thing has nothing to do with SL as far as directx9 vs 10 vs 11. You are more worried about Open GL when it comes to SL and that means go with an NVIDIA card if SL is your main concern. DirectX is is more of a concern for highend games like Crysys. Goto youtube and search for directx 10 and directx 11 to see the difference in eye candy.

These computers all have Win7 so they will support DX10+ (XP only supports DX9 unless you hack the drivers) All the graphics cards we are looking at are DX 10 as Nvidia will not release a direct X11 card until later this month (maybe as late as march '10, they are being very secretive about it.)

The computer that I posted above from cyberpower is a better deal than the one you posted from dell brother. ETA... its almost exactly the same specs but $150 less once you goto the 4 GB of RAM. It is only a duo core vs the quad you're looking at though Try building your computer on this site and see what the final price is, i'm thinking you'll get a better bang for the buck on CyberPower.

I already answered the directX question....

The GT...GTS....GTX is just Nvidia's way of saying this is the same chip with different amounts of shaders and memory buffers...I listed them from lowest to highest. Basically just like manufacturers do with CPUs they make ALL the chips in a series to be the highest end possible. There are manufacturing defects in most of the chips so they turn off the bad areas and sell those chips as lower end options in the series. ROFL there is way more to it than that but it really isn't something to worry about

out shopping, and just randomly came across this gorgeous unicorn.

note the earrings.

NM I just did it for you, you save 20 bux on this site.

lol I'll save my comments on the one 3

all this computer talk is making me WANT a new desktop. but, my diehard saving for splurging priorities lie elsewhere at the moment (better prize at the end ), and any extra money will not be spent that way unless mine both crash completely. but man, i'm getting all hot n bothered just the same. now if you start talking about handguns and guacamole i'm going to go into cardiac arrest from all the super happy hormonal overload. LOL

Thanks so much for the tips Rafe and I appreciate you keeping it simple cuz some of the stuff I've been reading has been like trying to understand some obscure foreign language! I have a feeling once I finally decide and get a new computer, SL will be a totally different ballgame for me and it will be like I got cataract surgery and can suddenly see properly!!

Josh.... *hugs* i'm really sorry about your friend's sister, and all of the other women too.

Thanks 3. Scylla actually put together a really nice memorial service today that I had a chance to attend in SL. I was a bit surprised for some reason because there was someone else there that also knew one of the 14 women.

Thanks Josh!!! And thanks also to Brenda, and Brann, and Jig, and 3!

Josh, it was lovely seeing you there, the more so because the event does hold a personal significance for you. I'm sorry I didn't know which of the victims was your friend's sister, or I'd have asked you to light that candle. The fellow you mention had known Sonia Pelletier.

I went to the candlelit vigil in Toronto tonight, in Philosopher's Walk at the University of Toronto. It was enormously affecting and in an odd way rather beautiful: hundreds of men and women carrying candles and roses to lay on the memorial there. Here's a picture (from the Toronto Star) of tonight's ceremony:



The small sea of placards you see in the background of this picture are individual memorials to each of the women in Ontario who have died violently at the hands of a partner or lover since the massacre in 1989.

It's been an emotionally-charged day, but cathartic.

Both ceremonies sound as if they were lovely. What a sad, stupid event that made them necessary.

just wow.