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Ginko Financial

Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
11-17-2005 10:43
From: Nathan Stewart
Well thats what it seems like to me, she wont answer any questions regarding her own business, so for the third time anshe as you say you have the funds do you guarantee to refund the purchase price to the estate holders in all the sims anshechung.com owns


Funds she is under no obligation to use to refund to anyone, and there is no ability to force her to. She dances around this one. Linden Lab is not going to give land or money to those owning deeds on her private islands if she pulls out. People are just supposed to trust in her, even though there are no enforceable guarantees or protections. Ginko investors are not even asking for protection - they know fully the risks they are taking.
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Cristiano


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Nathan Stewart
Registered User
Join date: 2 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,039
11-17-2005 10:46
From: Anshe Chung
If you would have read the terms on our website, you would know that in case of liquidation, the proceeds from each sim sale would be proportionally distributed among the land owners in the sim.

You are welcome to ask question about my business. But please be so kinda and start one separate thread :-)


I had read them :) which means that your L$ balance in your account has no relavancy to your business, it is merely on your investements inworld, you could close up and sell each sim to a partner for 1$ and give that to the land owners. Of course ginko holds 2mil lindens which is tied to the business, as well as the investments, so really they have 2 million more than you have in guaranteed release value.
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Anshe Chung
Business Girl
Join date: 22 Mar 2004
Posts: 1,615
11-17-2005 10:46
From: Cristiano Midnight
Funds she is under no obligation to use to refund to anyone, and there is no ability to force her to. She dances around this one. Linden Lab is not going to give land or money to those owning deeds on her private islands if she pulls out. People are just supposed to trust in her, even though there are no enforceable guarantees or protections. Ginko investors are not even asking for protection - they know fully the risks they are taking.


I do appreciate your interest in my own business. However, in this context it is irrelevant. I will gladly answer your questions on separate thread :-)
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Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
11-17-2005 10:48
From: Anshe Chung
I do appreciate your interest in my own business. However, in this context it is irrelevant. I will gladly answer your questions on separate thread :-)


Anshe, it is relevant. All of this goes to your motivations for starting this thread, which are horribly suspect.
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Cristiano


ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less.

~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.

Anshe Chung
Business Girl
Join date: 22 Mar 2004
Posts: 1,615
11-17-2005 10:49
From: Cristiano Midnight
Anshe, it is relevant. All of this goes to your motivations for starting this thread, which are horribly suspect.


My motivations are irrelevant too. The question is: where are those 16 mio L$?

It is not only me who think Ginko is fraud. It is almost everybody I talk to!

Please put your money where your mouth is and deposit on Ginko. Hehehe. Please, everybody who don't like me: use Ginko! ;-)

This could become fun :-)
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ANSHECHUNG.COM: Buy land - Sell land - Rent land - Sell sim - Rent store - Earn L$ - Buy L$ - Sell L$

SLEXCHANGE.COM: Come join us on Second Life's most popular website for shopping addicts. Click, buy and smile :-)
kavak Kolache
sir dingleberry
Join date: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 52
the greatest thing about sl
11-17-2005 10:51
everyones level and has a voice anshe has been challenged by a nobody and is completely choosing to ignore it maybe others should choose to ignore her as well
Nicholas Portocarrero
Registered User
Join date: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 237
11-17-2005 10:53
From: Anshe Chung
Now I have to say, I have one vested interest that this thing better ends sooner than later. It is the same vested interest anyone should have who is invested in the Second Life economy, directly or indirectly. One Ponzi scheme of this magnitute destroys one incredible amount of value and eventually also trust in the Second Life economy. Maybe 20 mio? 50 mio? 100 mio? 1 billion? The bigger this bubble grows, the bigger the crash will be when people realize they can never get their money back. The result will be very bad press for Second Life and Linden Lab and many piss off people calling for Philip to "just create some Linden$". Maybe he will have to give in and we all pay for it with inflation, removal of stipends or higher tier fee. In any case: what is bad for SL economy is also bad for the community! And, surprise surprise, Anshe Chung is also part of this community.

So, Nicholas, where are those 16 mio L$? How much did you invest in what? What revenue have you generate sofar? Can you proove it to us, or at least to Linden Lab? You better answer us and give us one detailed account ASAP instead of insult our intelligence with silly "I don't want mamma look across my shoulder" phrases. I warn you. I am not going watch some crook take whole SL economy hijack and scam the newbies. You better show us the whereabouts of every single L$ you took or I will end this. It might cost me millions, but I don't care. This kinda scam goes so 100% against every sense of morality in my bones that I forget my business, forget my money, forget the PR and just hunt you down. Where is that money?


What I know:

- You plan to raise 25M L$ (about 100,000 USD) in a bond offering (or something of the sort);
- What you are going to do with the money is private and top-secret, even to the people who give a significant amount of it to you;
- You claim getting a loan from a bank at 6-7% is a very easy and rational thing to do;
- Your bonds are supposed to pay at the least 10%, and you said they would most likely pay between 10% and 20%;
- A ponzi scheme at 10% a year can last, even without new investments, 11 years fairly easy (as you can invest the money at a low safe return), at which point people are very willing to give you more money without any new disclosure.

Is it possible that you are doing this to facilitate your bond issue? What is that saying again? The pot calling the... hum...

Something to consider:

- Trade requires two consenting parties. If you force one of the parties to do business a certain way, it's no longer trade, it's slavery.

Do I really owe anybody an explanation which I never promised?
Anshe Chung
Business Girl
Join date: 22 Mar 2004
Posts: 1,615
11-17-2005 10:55
From: Nicholas Portocarrero
What I know:

- You plan to raise 25M L$ (about 100,000 USD) in a bond offering (or something of the sort);
- What you are going to do with the money is private and top-secret, even to the people who give a significant amount of it to you;
- You claim getting a loan from a bank at 6-7% is a very easy and rational thing to do;
- Your bonds are supposed to pay at the least 10%, and you said they would most likely pay between 10% and 20%;
- A ponzi scheme at 10% a year can last, even without new investments, 11 years fairly easy (as you can invest the money at a low safe return), at which point people are very willing to give you more money without any new disclosure.

Is it possible that you are doing this to facilitate your bond issue? What is that saying again? The pot calling the... hum...

Something to consider:

- Trade requires two consenting parties. If you force one of the parties to do business a certain way, it's no longer trade, it's slavery.

Do I really owe anybody an explanation which I never promised?


Nice you are here :-)

Could you now please tell us where those 16 mio L$ are, instead of post rubbish? :-)
_____________________
ANSHECHUNG.COM: Buy land - Sell land - Rent land - Sell sim - Rent store - Earn L$ - Buy L$ - Sell L$

SLEXCHANGE.COM: Come join us on Second Life's most popular website for shopping addicts. Click, buy and smile :-)
kavak Kolache
sir dingleberry
Join date: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 52
anshe how can you continue to challenge others
11-17-2005 11:00
when you yourself have been challenged and continue to ignore it? its not everybodys repsonsibility to support ginko that doesnt like you although i know that it would defintly increase ginkos value overnight BUT YOURS the time has come to rise to the challenge or dont and go back to whence you came the fantasyland of anshes
Nicholas Portocarrero
Registered User
Join date: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 237
11-17-2005 11:05
From: Anshe Chung
Nice you are here :-)

Could you now please tell us where those 16 mio L$ are, instead of post rubbish? :-)


Could you please tell me what you plan to do with your 25 million L$?
Jauani Wu
pancake rabbit
Join date: 7 Apr 2003
Posts: 3,835
11-17-2005 11:06
From: Nicholas Portocarrero
Could you please tell me what you plan to do with your 25 million L$?


could you please tell me what you plan to do with our .63 L$? i find it very unfair to small account holders that you refuse to pay this out to us. :rolleyes:
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Jauani Wu
hero of justice
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Anshe Chung
Business Girl
Join date: 22 Mar 2004
Posts: 1,615
11-17-2005 11:10
From: Nicholas Portocarrero
Could you please tell me what you plan to do with your 25 million L$?


If I would ever raise 25 million L$, the whereabouts would be visible at all times.

But you still have not answered my question: where are those 16 mio L$?
_____________________
ANSHECHUNG.COM: Buy land - Sell land - Rent land - Sell sim - Rent store - Earn L$ - Buy L$ - Sell L$

SLEXCHANGE.COM: Come join us on Second Life's most popular website for shopping addicts. Click, buy and smile :-)
Travis Bjornson
Registered User
Join date: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 188
11-17-2005 11:12
From: someone
could you please tell me what you plan to do with our .63 L$? i find it very unfair to small account holders that you refuse to pay this out to us

Umm, what are you going to do with 0.63L?? Decimals don't exist in L$. And in USD it's less than 1 penny. So it can't possibly be paid out. But the 0.63 is held in your Ginko account so that if you deposit more and bring your balance up to 1L, you can get that 1L out.
Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
11-17-2005 11:15
From: Travis Bjornson
Umm, what are you going to do with 0.63L?? Decimals don't exist in L$. And in USD it's less than 1 penny. So it can't possibly be paid out. But the 0.63 is held in your Ginko account so that if you deposit more and bring your balance up to 1L, you can get that 1L out.


You have been ensnared in the Jauani Wu sarcasm trap.
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Cristiano


ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less.

~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.

Nicholas Portocarrero
Registered User
Join date: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 237
11-17-2005 11:16
From: Anshe Chung
If I would ever raise 25 million L$, the whereabouts would be visible at all times.


I very much doubt that a private top-secret project which will not affect SL businesses in any way would be visible at all times.

From: someone
But you still have not answered my question: where are those 16 mio L$?


It's none of your business.
Alexa Hope
Registered User
Join date: 8 Dec 2004
Posts: 670
11-17-2005 11:19
I can only repeat that I believe Anshe wants all competition out of the way so that she can launch her bond or whatever she has in mind.

The first post was completely out of order and if any other member of SL had written it, LL would have either edited the post or closed the thread. What the hell is going on here? Since when can we write personal information about another resident in the forums without being censured? Have you no backbone LL, do your job.

I bet if I wrote about how Anshe got her first money together before becoming what she is, she and they would be down on me like a ton of bricks. Maybe I should try it.

Such greed is not good for SL.

Alexa
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Jauani Wu
pancake rabbit
Join date: 7 Apr 2003
Posts: 3,835
11-17-2005 11:20
From: Travis Bjornson
Umm, what are you going to do with 0.63L?? Decimals don't exist in L$. And in USD it's less than 1 penny. So it can't possibly be paid out. But the 0.63 is held in your Ginko account so that if you deposit more and bring your balance up to 1L, you can get that 1L out.


i dunno, maybe you should ask nicholas why he was harrassing shaun about holding over fractional values of dividends until future payouts. he seemed to have urgent need of his .163 L$ :rolleyes:
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Jauani Wu
hero of justice
__________________________________________________
"Oh Jauani, you're terrible." - khamon fate


Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 5,250
11-17-2005 11:20
There is very little legal precedent, but that is no protection whatsoever, and surely going to change.


Anyone could call their homes, cars, or $L 'valueless' to evade taxes &c.

But US courts don't blindly follow what defendants tell them. Or Linden Labs.


The fact that $L are regularly bought and sold for USD is a strong indication of value. Disagree? Then send all your $L to me. :)


All it would take is one count of fraud, tax evasion, unlawful gambling, money laundering, or felony grand theft - anything over approx. $400 USD I believe - and criminal charges (with jail time) are possible if not downright probable.


Anyone losing more than about $10,000 USD (approx. $L 2,500,000) would find prosecution to be worthwhile. No doubt, Linden Labs would be quite interested at that point and very cooperative with the courts I am sure. It is not in their interest to become a haven for criminal activity.

Internet transactions of any type usually end up on electronic record for quite a while and are subject to subpoena. The internet is a very, very foolish place to commit a crime.
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Steampunk Victorian, Well-Mannered Caledon!
Kavai Onizuka
Spudzuka Properties
Join date: 23 May 2004
Posts: 452
11-17-2005 11:22
I don't think anyone got 2,500,000 L$ deposited in Ginko at this time. Least not yet.
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Jauani Wu
pancake rabbit
Join date: 7 Apr 2003
Posts: 3,835
11-17-2005 11:24
there have been deposits of that size kavai. ginko does solicit them and send their agents repeatedly to pursue such kinds of investments.
_____________________
http://wu-had.blogspot.com/
read my blog

Mecha
Jauani Wu
hero of justice
__________________________________________________
"Oh Jauani, you're terrible." - khamon fate


Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 5,250
11-17-2005 11:25
My comments are not aimed at anyone in specific.

These rules apply to all of us.
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Steampunk Victorian, Well-Mannered Caledon!
DogSpot Boxer
vortex thruster
Join date: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 671
11-17-2005 11:29
From: Anshe Chung
Nice you are here :-)

Could you now please tell us where those 16 mio L$ are, instead of post rubbish? :-)


It's none of your business where it is. Nicholas has been quite up front that he doesn't make this visible to people and people can decide for themselves if Ginko is something they want to do.

I think you're a great businessperson, but I'm starting to really question your motives here.

I also think it's very rude of you to show up here and make accusations that you can't possibly prove.
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Nicholas Portocarrero
Registered User
Join date: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 237
11-17-2005 11:29
From: Jauani Wu
i dunno, maybe you should ask nicholas why he was harrassing shaun about holding over fractional values of dividends until future payouts. he seemed to have urgent need of his .163 L$ :rolleyes:


That is not what I was "harrasing" him about. I was told by his associate that fractional cent earnings would be put in a big pot and shared out equaly amongst shares the next time dividends were paid. That essentaily means that people with few shares are paying part of their dividends to people with many shares. What I do is register exactly what people are owed, not create anonimous "pots".. Either way, I eventualy shut up about it, because it's such a tiny issue considering the number of shareholders that I thought it wasn't worth pushing it and Shaun himself told me that wasn't what they were doing (even though it -is- what his partner said they were doing). It did cost the bank Shaun's investment, which was the only reason his company lost so little money the previous quarter.
Aaron Levy
Medicated Lately?
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,147
11-17-2005 11:30
From: kavak Kolache
when you yourself have been challenged and continue to ignore it? its not everybodys repsonsibility to support ginko that doesnt like you although i know that it would defintly increase ginkos value overnight BUT YOURS the time has come to rise to the challenge or dont and go back to whence you came the fantasyland of anshes


kavak, as you stated, Anshe lives in her own little fantasyland world where the Lindens turn a blind eye to every rule she breaks. She can make baseless claims on the forums based on speculation and guessing. She can, in one thread, demean every single person who has ever had anything to do with Ginko.

I mean, haven't you heard? She's ANSHE. I'm surprised when new users sign up the first name Anshe isn't available as a new name.
Nicholas Portocarrero
Registered User
Join date: 13 Jul 2004
Posts: 237
11-17-2005 11:33
From: Jauani Wu
there have been deposits of that size kavai. ginko does solicit them and send their agents repeatedly to pursue such kinds of investments.


That is news to me. Indeed, there has been one person that held more than that, Shaun Altman. I assume his records are public now, so I don't feel this is a breach of privacy. Other than him, nobody.
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