Overzealous Security and Rude Landowners

Getting hit with push attacks has been my primary issue. It does not matter to me if hit by them from a security orb or a gun. Have only been TP home once or twice. One time was moving my house and lost control of it! It ended up in the persons next to me lot and discovered a 6 second countdown. I was so disoriented that got TP home instead. I was able to retrieve my house without problem

Problem is that none of the AR's I have sent in has done any good at all. I have never sent in an AR for a "good" attack on the owners land or airspace. I have been attacked while on Linden Land. This includes roads, the great wall and once while riding the trolley!

These push attacks and the problem of crossing sim boundaries has grounded my Viper and Tarn. Now the only flying I do is in the private sim It is too small for my Tarn and Viper.

Everyone ought to take notice that in the about land dialog, under the objects tab, it shows the number of prims being selected or sat on. Acording to a Linden response in live help, these prims do not actually count aginst your prim usage. Meaning people flying over in airplanes do not count aginst your prim usage. I remember this was argument aginst people flying over thier land.

Someone posted an experience they had with a large craft passing over and their objects were returned.

This is something they added in the update, so its probably new.

Either way that isn't my personal reason for security.

Aww... how much different is that from someone who wants to go all over, finds someone with a security script, then bans them from their groups sim out of spite?

I mean, honestly... with that kind of attitude, why should anyone bother trying to do her a favour? (after getting reported by her for letting her know she was breaching CS and ToS, I don't think I will...)
One thing I've never been with you, or indeed most other people, is angry...
No hon... just your ignorance of some very basic facts about flying in Second Life.

You do realise that being ignorant of that kind of thing does call into question your amount of flying experience in SL...And that has what to do with being ignorant of the basics of flying in SL? Nothing... it's just a way for you to backpedel and hope people haven't spotted your massive mistake... (didn't work...)*recalls you saying they should be banned...*Finally, something we can vaguely agree on... mainly because it isn't rabid "Ban Teh Ebil Orbz" emotionalist bullcrap...

On the other hand, as someone who uses an orb to keep a skybox secure while the land is open to all.....Funny that... I swear I remember you saying that you rarely get griefed... Yeah... but you claimed to have stopped flying back in April...

Must have been bad if you're still moaning about it over 2 months later...Well gee... I'd say being able to fly virtually hassle free every day could be something like what you want...

Oh hang on, you haven't flown since April... so you don't know what it's like out there anymore. (unless you went back on your word...)So why are you trying to make life harder for people in SL if flying is so much more fun IRL?

Is this a case of "I can't have fun so I'll make sure no-one else can either"?

In what way? If the security script is covering the house only and a small area around it it is understandable. Even more so it it is posted as private. However if a security script is running in the lot next to you in alarm mode it is different. Baning in return is not out of spite. This group wants to have its land private yet demand to fly over others land? Then they get upset when they cant. This is very strange.



Sigh.......You have never done me any favors. If I breach TOS the nice res mods or Lindens will tell me. Pathfinder or Torley will show me my misdeeds and tell me to stop, In any case it is not against the TOS to ban a resident from your property. You dont have to show "just" cause to do this.



No, I was thinking about something else at the time and looked at the data and came up with a quick solution. Well it was not only wrong but very wrong. These things happen. You never make a mistake? Also when I saw it was a mistake never tried to say otherwise. Again my problem is getting my client server crashed.



Problem with skyboxes is that they are all over the place! They pose a hazzard to flight without security orbs. Just want a uniform approach to things.



Never said that! I have tried a couple of flights since April and all have ended with my server getting crashed. No messages of get off of my land just the same old push attack. A couple of these might of been cross sim troubles. Oh I am being stalked now in the game. I worry about this person stalking me in rl.



You must be lucky! I have been very lucky in real life in this respect. I use to fly everday before point to point TP. I only remember a few warning messages. After point to point things started getting bad with security scripts. Having your server get crashed is getting griefed. All from push attacks.



Made a test flight that was suppose to end at the Poole stage. I started with my tarn and switched to my freebie jetpack. As I stated in another message. My client server was crashed at least three times.



Not at all. Lets say that a country A closes its airspace to all but its own aircraft. Well country B would closed its airspace to country A as well. Life is a give and take thing. If you close the airspace of your land to someone dont be surprised when you recieve the same treatment. It is not spite!

My position is the following, I want to be able to look at land and determine if it is safe or not safe to enter at a glance. In rl my charts tell me the status of airspace. If it is class B or even no fly zones. I would like security orbs to be phased out but give the landowner the tools to protect their property. The tools are not good enough. If things stand as they are then my position is different. Also for the Lindens to come out with a firm policy on overflight rights or lack of them. I have no problem at all with security orbs on target mode, none. I dislike security orbs on alarm mode with no warning. How was I suppose to know your land is off limits? Security orbs attacking people outside of their land really pisses me off! I have stated getting attacked on public roads, on the great wall and frack on the bloody trolley once. Theses are the ones that need to be eliminated now and given a few days off SL to think about their misdeeds.

Yes if set to atack people on foreign land that would be a big problem. to be safe i would have a target list and set it for target only and keep foreign land safe from the push. Maybe just set land security and leave it at that. What is the maximum number of banned avies for the Land security anyway?

Most people are courteious enough to have about a 30 second count down to get off their land or at least 15 seconds. Not really a big deal. With the new ban limits its becoming less neccesasry but we cant ban an unlimited amount of people so quite often that is why security is put in. I guess in a variable sense LL's land tools for banning someone could still vastly be improved increasing limits disabling sit/scripts/push etc for banned users of that land would work well. If they cant sit they cant get back on essentially and no chance of them greifing from the sky then either.

30 seconds is too long on my land, and I've taken the warning off due to flyers whe belittled my giving ground, kept demanding more, and never gave any themselves.

Should you be flying faster than 3 m/s though, my orb won't smack you.

The reason I use an orb is not a small ban list, its the inability to have a white list at skybox level.

Who are you? ah Jonas why dont you post with your main account?

Because I'm signed in on my alt, openly let people know who I am, and have said the EXACT same thing on my main account?

Would guess that plane was built from multiple linked parts set up to follow the 'core' plane through scripts, or something similar... so the following parts didn't have anyone sitting on them and as such counted against the limit o.O;

If true and people wanted to grief you using prims there is nothing you can do about it is there? I dont have the time for such nonsense myself. Am busy building my space station in the private sim Oh seems like my no copy aircraft was lost on its last flight. It is gone

This is the thing I don't understand... people who grief others using security systems are setting themselves up for retaliation against, and are causing more trouble than they realise for themselves.

Maybe if enough people flood the reporting system with reports of security systems, LL will have to listen to the majority population who do not use security systems or have any need for them, and set up some more realistic guidelines that deal with the problem, rather than the typical 'head in sand' attitude.

If an avatar with a push weapon can throw you across a sim against your will and it is called griefing, then the same guidelines should apply when a security system does the same.

If you have security, just do everyone a favour and turn it off when you aren't there and don't feel the need for privacy, instead of just being an antisocial old scrote.

Lewis

Maybe if enough people like yourself would quit flooding the abuse reporting system with frivolous crap the people at Linden Lab who handle abuse reports would have more time to address *real* abuse.

Should have shopped wiser. Any flyer worth their salt would use planes they can rez copies out of, so as not to lose them.

What happened did Jonas get suspended for his misdeeds?

No, I just checked my 'bank' account of stored lindens on this account without signing him in in game. Paranoid aren't we?

Nope just wondering why the alt? I need only one account

This one is used to act as a bank account. I send lindens here to function as a savings account.

Another will serve as a sandbox builder, so I don't get flooded with IMs while working.

Y'know, Lewis, it's not always the desire to be antisocial which causes people to use security systems. On my land, it's a case of wanting to keep out a select few pinheads -- usually griefers -- at all times. I have renters to think of, in addition to just preferring to not have known assholes wandering about on my land.

Not all security orbs are set to bounce everyone in creation who wander near!

If the land in SL was something they gave you to use and you used it to abuse then yes I think an orb would be abusive... but thats not the case... the land in SL is owned... it is paid for on a monthly basis... therefor it shoud be protected in any way the private owner chooses so long as his security object does not cross his borders... also most security orbs do have a warning pop up that says "get off this land within x amount of seconds or you will be removed" depending on what you want it to say... I also know that prior to the new additions to the SL environment thanks to the latest update ... and the mute ability... it was the only way you could keep some griefer from hovering just above the limit was to object protect your land somehow...

Your land and your right to control it is why you pay for it... lets see what you would do if you actually paid something for the AV you enjoy and some griefer filled your land with scripts and boxes everytime you turned around or you build someplace for privacy but seems you cant get a private moment.

security divices suck ;sl is supposed to be like real life you don't get zapped when i fly my aircraft over someones house

If you actually read the thread, you'd understand that it is abuse.

Anything that pushes my avatar half way across the sim, or makes my avatar act in a way that I have not expressly given permission to happen (such as being thrown) is abuse.

Whether it's an idiot with a push weapon, or a security orb, I consider them both unwanted and will continue to abuse report them as is my right.

This is unfortunately an issue where Linden Lab have chosen to bury their head in the sand, and the reality of the situation felt by the players happens to be different from the experience of Linden Lab when they decided that security orbs are not abuse.

If this game is to be truly community-created and community led, then Linden Lab must listen to the majority of the playerbase who feel that the freedom to explore is a core part of what Second Life is all about - in fact a major part of their advertising push as Clubside Granville explained several pages back - rather than the few paranoid individuals who buy security systems - and set them up wrongly - to indiscriminently attack everyinnocent indivudal who happens to be passing by and, until they are griefed by the security system, probably had little to no interest in seeing what was behind the invisible wall of protection anyway.

Build on the ground, and use banlines. That is the game provided security system, and all that should be necessary. Anything else is excessive, and will always remain so. Why isn't a gentle bounce sufficient, just like you get when you hit ban lines? What is the point of throwing someone half way across the sim?

I'd love to know what drives people to the paranoia to buy a security system. So far I have only had one person in SL actually irritate me enough for me to cause me to take action against their avatar - adding them to my parcel ban list. Problem solved.

The real problem of course is the open registration system, something I was against and remain against ever since it was announced. Real griefers will keep coming back under new accounts, and of course once someone has set themselves up as a target by having a security system, their problems remain forever. It's just a pity that people can't see that they are making it worse for themselves, because most griefers will give up and go bug someone else when they see they aren't getting a reaction out of you, and to many it would be a challenge to get past their security system even if they have no interest in what might be hiding within their 'secret place'.

When people finally grasp the simple concept of NOBODY CAN STEAL YOUR STUFF in-game, perhaps people would finally ease up and get rid of unnecessary security.

Lewis