Lets try to work out a solution for the Security Scripts Issue

Since you are asking calmly, I will explain.

As it -currently- stands, landowners can completely block all flyers off their property.

The current compromise proposal has landowners limiting their security, and allowing flyers to pass through, provided they don't get right next to buildings.

Thats what landowners have given.

Please lets NOT start the snipe war again!

From what I am seeing it seems as though only the 20 sec warning is adequate.

Does anyone disagree and think there should be other measures?

I don't feel any other measures are necessary, to be honest. The proposal as it stands givesflyers more freedom to fly, and does not strip landowners of their desired security and 'faux' privacy.

Granted, the security scripts costs more if its not copyable or you don't write them yourself.

Granted there are no signs to navigate by, or beacons.

On the first grant - landowners have all their prims

On the second - you have adequate warning through IM to avoid tp or ejection


Its a compromise, no side is getting everything they want. Thats what compromise means.

Maybe if LL wake up and realise it IS a problem, then it will become an offense. Campaigning for a solution - such as restricting where security scripts can be used and limiting their effects - is what I'm trying to do.



But nowhere was I infringing anyone's privacy - just flying THROUGH some land that happened to be between me and my destination, with nothing untoward in mind. Yet I'm being cast into the same bucket as griefers and nosey people, and suffering unwanted disruption to my gameplay, simply because people can't be bothered to give a warning that they don't want visitors. As the default option is full access (except for the "No Entry" ban lines area, then it is up to YOU to tell me you don't want me looking at a build in a public space (ie the view).

If people who wanted privacy would build at height, then legitimate flying and cross-parcel traffic would not be affected.

People that start a battle with me will find I fight back. If you let me pass through your land with no interruption, when I don't intend to stop, you will get no trouble at all from me.

Lewis

Thank you for the infomation, It is what they will give under the proposal. English is a third language and sometimes get confused about word meaning.

As it stands, however, it's an abuse of the Abuse Report system, and contributes to over-working the lindens who handle it, which leads to valid abuse reports recieving less attention than they deserve because you want to "make a point".



Show me a script function that equates to "llIsMindingOwnBuisness()" and we're in buisness, then. Unfortunatly, until you can do that, then yes - you are getting punished for the actions of the griefers and snoops.



As currently stands, no it isn't. It's simply suggested. Again, we aren't talking about a utopia that has not yet come about - we are talking about what is, here.



Frankly, I'm not concerned with "trouble from you" or "you fighting back" if your next statement is "if I let you" do something on my land. I fully agree that it would be *nice* if land owners used security scripts with kindness, but they are under no obligation to do so. And the more you try to force them to, the less likely they are to. There's an old adage that you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar that I think applies nicely hear. Come to the table willing to discuss calmly and actually listen to the other sides views, you might get results. Bash your head over and over against the same brick wall, demand that you have "rights" over another person's land when they clearly see it differently... Well. It's a waste of time.

Ask nicely and you'll find I'm a pretty nice fellow.

Demand or pontificate and I can be a royal asshole.

I have encountered a force that is unable to overcome. Some people fight but that is not my way. To fight the unwinable is stupid.

Have retreated to Sanctuary where Umi Chan and Myself are safe. I have been chased off of the northern continent by my foes. Nobody who has posted in this forum is my foe, including Jonas.

This is my last message on this subject.

You are welcome Ranma

It's also pointless having a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

Lewis

If there is no more discussion I will write up a final proposal and get it posted here for everyones approval in the morning.

I will split my votes between this proposal and my own proposal.

I need to get with the lindens but as I understand it this will not be a proposal as it is policy change and not a feature change.I need to get with them on what exactly our next step is.

If you are so tight on prims that a sign is a hardship, than I can see leaving them out... but it would be polite to extend the warning time if you can't afford the signs. Not required, but polite.

Signs are not as bad a prim hardship as you seem to think, though, because the script itself is sitting inside a prim, and each prim can provide three signboards:

First, the prim the script is in can often be a sign itself. Second, it should be possible to use particle generators to create two more signs per script-containing prim, using angle and radius and giving the emitted particles zero velocity.

I feel 20 seconds is polite enough, but thats me..

edit: On a side note I am only a beginning builder, what you mentioned about particles is beyond me (and probably half the users on sl)

Just to let everyone Know I have not forgot the project here or what we have managed to bang out.

What I am trying to do is track down the best way to proceed from here. I will post with details when I have them.

Ranma.. it seems you have a choice:

1: the proposal as is, which still allows security scripts.

2: universal ban lines to the build limit

No the comprimise doesn't make anyone 100% happy, but its not supposed to.

Well, in terms of the potentially broken scripts, let me ask a question coming at it from the other angle. Are there any security scripts that people would recommend that would give people accurate, fair warning, and not act against them if they had left the parcel?


Kyushu

Just making some obervations from my travels looking at land for sale. It seems to me that a lot of residents do not think of others when making decisions about their land. It is just that in SL there is no sense of living in a community. It almost always comes down to a me first and last point of view.

I have no objections to the above proposal. It allows me to avoid conflicts with other residents which is what I seek.

agreed, let us fly!

Jarod, read the proposal..read -all- of the thread.

Ranma, the point is noone needs to consider their neighbours when building their land..its their world, their imagination. Part of why I built an airstrip on my new land (shared with my sl gf) for public use.

That flight is part of my imagined world. But its not a part of everyones..

We tried to compromise with security scripts, and neither side will get all they want. Jarod, scripts will not go away, but you can vote for my proposal on the feature voting ( 999 ) for ban lines all the way to 768 feet, if you don't like the script compromise.

In real life we have to thou.
SL isn't real life of course.
But if one of my neighbors has a car out in the lawn for a year, another neighbor calls some athority, and the first neighbor gets his own car towed away off his own property. Because it does not run. And he gets the towing bill. Missouri law
Just for some comparison I guess.

I wish I could control our air space above our house. Heh then live near an airport.

I can't disagree more strongly. A world where nobody considers their neighbors is not a world that can possibly work. Linden Labs may not prevent you from building a giant toilet that fires brown particles all over your neighbors, but you still should not do it unless your neighbors are OK with it.

The counterpoint to the slogan is not "my world, my imagination.", it's "our world, our imagination". The word "you" is plural as well as singular, and unless ALL OF US work together to create OUR world, we'll end up with a mean and crabbed world that's not worth living in.

Hell no, whats the use of a sky box if there we have to build on the ground! Whats the use of the sky???????

The problem I see is that interrupting the enjoyment of Second Life for others IS a violation of the TOS and thats what these Security scripts do.

And I dont give a flying you know what, anything or any person that throws me half way across a sim or changes anything on my avatar, including it's position in the world is a PvP attack and will be reported by me as such.