Acceptance, letting go and moving on.

Well good on you, but I do not accept it, US 125 dollars is almost double for me here in New Zealand.

I have just joined openlife, and the moment I landed I was in the middle of a lot of other SL refugees, if you take this from LL they will continue to walk all over you. Once the price hike kicks in, I am walking.

LL is cutting off their nose dispite thier face. It is YOU who have made SL what it is today, not them, YOU. The people who are clever and creative and it is YOU who have bought them all the customers/residents they have today. So don't accept the fact they are now kicking you in face!

Sometimes I wonder why people do not actually "read" what is being written instead of focusing on one or more words, taken out of context. *sighs*

With respect Vryl, defeatism is what LL wants. In my view we should not go quiet and roll over on this issue. It's too important and it is more than just about the price hike now. It's a crisis of confidence.

Far from shutting up and moving on we should be shouting louder.

Some people are saying it will make no difference whatever we say but if we keep saying it, shouting it even. Then it will have it's effect and LL's monopoly is only good for perhaps 6 months ahead now.

Others are catching up fast and the choices are beginning to open up to us. Competitive pricing is on the way.

Mighty Rome and Britainia all crumbled in the end.

I don't want to see second Life destroyed but it wont be the residents who do it. It will be Linden Labs themselves through sheer greed. No where else on the internet dose it cost so much to run a server. And, lets face it, that is what LL is doing. Hosting servers on a grand scale.

For me and many others this struggle goes on and, as much as LL digs their heals in the people who pay will buck them.

They started this war but can they win it in the end?

I never said to just accept it and roll over. I think if you read through all of my posts you will realize this. What I said, is that there is a middle ground as opposed to all the radicalism. (does this word exist? lol)

You can call it radicalism if you like and I have been reading through the posts. I do understand you but you are saying, lets move on. And, why'll I can sympathise with that view - everyone wants a peaceful life - I can't bring myself to let it go.

I keep thinking how unfair it is on the thousands of people out there who want to enjoy what we can afford but can't with prices rising like this. And what of the people creating products in SL? Are they benefitting when the probability is that trade will slide downward in any event given the economic climate?

High pricing means less people spending.

LL has got this wrong and been dishonest about it too and that is typical of monopolist attitudes.

I wish we could move on and get back to doing what we do best and enjoy most. But, alas, the struggle will go on.

Yes and I agree with you. Of course they have been dishonest.

However, we can't get anything accomplished if we are simply going around in circles and circles. I did not say to simply let it go as in the sense of accepting the changes as they are. I merely suggest to steer away from the militant protests and find a more peaceful approach. I feel that a compromise is good.. a middle ground that we can all benifit from, one that is fair to not only the users of SL but to LL as well. They also have related expenses to pay. If they do not pay their bills, then there is no Second Life anyway.

If you read in this thread, I offered several possible alternative solutions and invite others to do the same instead of just screaming, ranting and raving which is not prductive at all. I don't know about you, but I do not tend to listen very well to people who shout as opposed to people who communicate in a more intelligent tone. Yeah we all get angry and scream sometimes but then really enough is enough and yes I do stand by my words of moving on.. but what does this mern to move on? Maybe we don't share the same definition..

well thats not the issue but how do you make sure they wont come up with another crazy thing like this in the near future???.... i see if this decision passed and they went with their plan then be sure that whats coming is worse and at that time no one can say something, there should be a limit to what LL can do... and what they can not

So you wish for the US Government to enter the picture and make Secondlife like a utility company and the public service commission approve all rate hikes? They need to do that with broadband ISPs first and wrest control of the internet from the corroded copper cable dynasty first don't you think?

But are you really sure you want the US Government taking over control of Secondlife? Because that is the only way you can control a company in the USA. Otherwise it is up to the company what they do.

Not trying to throw water on the fire but I do not wish to have governmental interference in this industry as long as it is possible to mostly keep them away.

Well Vryl. I might be forceful in what I say and you may see it as radical even but it all has it's effect and judging by the vote on the JIRA a lot of people agree - a lot more than those who disagree. I think the majority agrees even if they are not all so out spoken.

I have seen many reasoned arguements and good ideas being put forward. That is, in deed, your middle ground. But, I would argue they wont be listened to by the people that caused this, LL. I think LL is just waiting for this to simmer down and go away.

But are they listening at all?

You bet they are for I logged inworld to a warning shot across my bows from the Lindens - an IM warning me to stop posting links to outside businesses, namely Open Simulator Project and such.

The impact is being felt and monitored where is counts and the more we say the more the chance something will come out of this for the better.

I'm not shouting you down. I don't wish to do that. Even I need to listen to the voices or reason for I have a tendency to blow my stack. Ask my partner *giggles*

I am reading what you say and people like you do hold me back. I have to think about it.

*sighs* But why dose it always come down to money?

What price creativity?

Oh, my, Ann! Another voice of reason that stopped me in my tracks on the JIRA *chuckles*

But I have to agree with you anyway, the thought that the government might control second Life dosen't bare thinking. Big brother would be infinity worse than LL's monopoly.

Though police and all.

Thank God, i was starting to think i was the only person that realized this... if we bring in those kinds of regulations (and i hate to tell all those threatening with lawyers and law suits, but your bringing us closer to this) once the US government steps in what we know as Second Life is over. one of the very first things they would do is slip out favorite guys in the whole world the IRS in to the mix. Bad enough i get raped when my money hits PayPal.

posted by Bella Posaner
"Well good on you, but I do not accept it, US 125 dollars is almost double for me here in New Zealand."



Okay lets look at the following and let everyone draw their own conclusions, shall we?

"I don't know about the rest of you but personally I think it's time to accept this change and move on. I don't want to waste more negative energy on this topic. M Linden pretty much summed it. If you think about it, 125 USD is not really so bad.."

"It would still be nice to have a grandfathered price but I don't see this happening. They learned their lesson from the past and we just need to accept this."

"Stepping off my soap box and running for cover."

By all means please point out any quotes in that post about getting a spine and fighting back.

But you know what? Forget that, I got better things than to waist time giving ** any more of my attention. She seems to feed off it.

(Oh and I put those ** in to save Katt the trouble btw.)

First you thought so strongly on this issue that you destroyed a group of more than 3000 people- though not before recording every name and then trying to re-add them to your own group which you had control over to try to "save the movement" from itself. The most important, fastest growing group SL has ever seen. Then you thought so strongly as to try to hire a lawyer to pursue legal action against Linden Lab.

Your power grab failed. People saw through the obvious tyrannical act, and did not join your group. Now you completely backtrack and say that we should accept it fully, and in fact Linden's rationale is perfectly ethical and OK?

This is the largest bunch of sour grapes I have ever seen.

Madam, your actions show planning and calculation underneath a facade of emotion. You still haven't backtracked on your actions. You were held accountable for your words and your acts, and you must live with them. To try to garner sympathy only makes you look worse.

Yes but one interesting aspect is we now have the first documented case of someone recording voice without permission. You must know about that right?

That was not a power grab, and you know it... YOU who unlawfully recorded my voice and hand delivered it to the Herald without my knowledge or consent to publish on the net. For this, I shall never forgive you. You wanted to hurt me and violate me in the worst way possible in real life. I think you are a sick individual to do such a thing. You did not think or care that perhaps my children may come across and hear that or what type of impact it may have had on me in real life. And all over a online program. I think you need help for what you did. You basically raped me in the worst way that you were able and took sick sadistic, tyrannical pleasure in it. So do not hypocritically speak to me of Tyranny. Don't even get me started on what I think of you.

MOST People only joined the second group because they were mass spammed group invite.. something I chose not to do.

Your group has harassed people, violated the Terms of Service.. abused it's own members and others and most of the people in the group do not have a clue what is going on. The leadership in the group have done horrible acts such as curse people out, even encouraging unlawful acts in real life towards Lindens and so on. Hundreds were leaving the group and more said that they would leave if the leadership did not change. Furthermore, members who did not agree with these militant actions were forcefully ejected after being verbally abused. If that is not tyrannical, I do not know what is. Your militant group has rightfully earned a reputation of abusing others who disagree with your aggressive and abusive tactics.

Cube Republic chose to continue to support the tyranny and abuse and was about to close the group anyway and had even sent out a group notice stating such. Most of these members were spammed group invite into the other group falsely thinking it was the new more calm group formed. I think the fact that Cube and others have been banned during this process says something in itself.

Then you, a known griefer, according to what I have been told, decided to record my voice at an emotional moment and take pleasure to see me humiliated in real life.. So you Sir, do not have the right to speak to me ever. You Sir, disgust me. I think nothing of a man such as yourself who enjoys to abuse women or even others and take pleasure in it. I do not know how in good concience that you could have illegally and unlawfully recorded my voice without my knowledge or consent to be published in a rag of a tabloid called the Herald.

This is all I have to say to you besides I shall never forgive you for this action alone. It is bad enough that you try to twist the story of what ACTUALLY happened, even to the point of lying, to make me look like some tyrant but to resort to snakelike tactics is beyond justification. It is reflective of the entire HATE and militant campaign of your SOS. This is one of the very reasons many did not want to rejoin that group or any group. Not everyone wants to be abused and cursed at and called cowards simply because they choose to not go protest and by one of the most nortorious adfarmers in SL .. not everyone wants to hear the foul and disgusting language, even life threatening comments directed to Lindens or others who did not support their "cause".. Some oppose violence.

Your group made us all look bad, as if we were some terrorists on the loose. Your group has continued to spam, abuse and disrupt our more peaceful group to the point we had to disable chat and close open enrollment.

Frankly SIR your group can be compared to a Nazi organization. I have NO regrets to disband it. My only regret is that I did not do it sooner and did not send out a notice first to explain but time was of the essence and I had to act fast as Cube was in the process of doing the same. Sometimes in life, we are forced to make split second decisions.

One last word, I am giving you a formal public notice since you have decided to make this public.. DO NOT EVER SPEAK TO ME AGAIN. If you do, I consider this harassment.

Thank you.

Actually I've never been banned. And the reason you decided to eject the group was because I said I was not going to talk to you anymore after you cursed and swore at me in voice and called me a 'maddy'. The shear hypocrisy of your actions was further amplified by your attitude after you ejected the group members, as you then contacted me demanding that I remove your name from my profile as it was included in an explanation. You quoted the TOS to me while casting aspersions on my mental health by again calling me 'maddy'. I'm sure there is something in the TOS about harassment. This was after I placed you into a position of trust by making you a group owner, a position you then went on to abuse.I'm sorry I pointed out to you that it was not up to me what people did. I did and do not feel I have this power over people. The movement gained its own momentum due to it being driven by itself. Most people are aware that within any group structure there will be those who have extreme views, however the majority do not adhere to this negative behavior and only want whats best for everyone. I wish to add that I personally did not condone violence of any form, and never will. At this point in time, +SOS+ is now in the process of regrouping and organizing so we can speak with one clear unified voice. This is being enabled through discussion and democratic decision making, not by any one person standing on a podium and dictating THEIR manifesto. The position your tried to force yourself into, is one I found myself in by chance and am rather humbled by. As I've always stated this was never about me, but about the people the group speaks for.

You are not about the people. You do not even own an OP sim. You have become consumed with power. It is all about sheer numbers for you, to get as many members as possible and exploit them to the fullest of your ability, using this situation with Open Space Sims. You even have posted negative of me and the lawyer who has graciously offered to help draw up a petition. You have encouraged violent protests, lies and deception. Your group has griefed those who oppose your militant views, even verbal abuse and ejection from the group. You are the main one with extreme views and have forcefully pushed that onto others.

You and your group has made us all look bad. You and Aminom Marvin even had the Herald publish an unlawful voice recording of me taken on my private estate without my consent or knowledge. Your group has even griefed my group. Several group notices have gone out in your group defaming me. In the prvious group.. which you were in teh process of disbanding when this all came about, a group notice was sent out even calling me a dirty S*** of a Linden alt spy!! The Lindens can easily verify this if they wanted to by looking in the original group -SOS- notices. I hope they check the group chatlogs too.. but I was sure to save them. The abuse was staggering to say the least.

You are not about democracy.. this is all just a big game to you. So, to sum it up, it's all about your twisted need for power, which will fade soon. Please do not speak to me again. You disgust me. Finally, as I said the REAL message has been lost in all of the violent protests, griefing and harassment.

You and your leadership call it a war. Pity. It is not. It's just Second Life, an online 3D virtual program owned by Linden Lab. It is basically an Internet Service Provider. They have provided the users of Second Life with this wonderful opportunity to expand our horizons virtually. Do they care? Absolutely. If they did not care, they would not allow the freedom of speech here in the forums and inworld. However, they are still a business at the end of the day and have every right to protect their vested interests as does any other business. I seriously doubt the way to get LL to listen is through violent protests, abuse and intimidation. This is where I draw the line and where you and I had a huge falling out which led to the dissimiliation of the group as it was before.. a group that I also worked passionately alone on for untold hours without sleep, bringing many members in myself, and you had no interest to take effective measure to stop the abuse. You encouraged it!! Personally, I hate what this has all become.. the war as you called it.. I hope it ends soon. But I for one shall not advocate this type of abuse and will work towards amicable and realtistic alternative solutions which are both fair and attainable to all parties involved.. that is Linden Lab and the users of Second Life.

It is better to come away with part of what you want, instead of nothing at all. Your groups is all about all or nothing.. that's just insane and unrealistic. If this continues, it will begin to have a devastating effect on the already fragile virtual and social economy in Second Life.

Please consider this the end of our dialogue, in the forums and also inworld. Thank you.

Ok..this, I believe, should be taken elsewhere..has no bearing on the issue at hand - best taken care of through email or IM's not a public venue such as this where people are actually trying to rectify a situation that has arisen.

I completely agree with you, Dianne. Thank you for saying that.

This is classic bait and switch...offer something that seems a good value...then wait a bit and slam your client with a huge up-charge. I have been in SL since 2005 and felt the open sim was a good deal and shelled out the $250.00...I built a home there and had very, very low usage. Now I will abandon the sim and the $250.00...good luck to these people...what is really needed is an overall protest and to simply quit buying Lindens...starve the beast...it's the only way to kill it.

Lan Groshomme

I would like to redirect everyone to the On-Grid's plan of action:

/354/53/290509/1.html#post2202949

Says the person who ejected 3000 people from the group. What do you call that? Again...all you had to do was leave the group but instead YOU pulled a power trip. Your actions prove it.

Whatever...everyone just shop listening to her-arguing with her-she's a waste of everyone's time and energy to the movement she has already tried to sabotage and then say, hey lets just let go and give into LL.

They lift the restrictions and then leave us alone once and for all! (fat chance of that tho)

Can anyone answer this question?
With this price hike, are they going to allow OS owners /renters to do what they want on the land they have purchased? Or is it still going to be under restriction??

IMO, if they raise the price, they need to lift the restrictions. PERIOD.

Since I dont believe they are doin this because of "performance" problems, my guess is that they are leaving restrictions in place and raising the price. I havent seen an exact answer to that question in the thousands of comments. Maybe I missed it, but can anyone clarify for me?

Thanks!

Why am I not surprised that Vryl is from France.

Completely out of order.