Openspace Announcement Discussion with Jack Linden

i also paid 1600 plus per sim on three sims! but i did not fall in line to buy up open sims for gain. they were talking about removing them all together if you remember right. this in moy opinion is a better outcome. wish everyone would stop complaining. i been in sl enough to see when something is coming and yes i could have forecasted this as well with all the chatter during the change of pricing in april or march. this should even everyone up. i went from making 57000 per sim in october of last year to 5000 per sim this october so i really dont want to hear about it. those of you new business owners should be contacting us older business owners to know whats coming at you.

One thing that strikes me is the escalating incompetence of decisions from LL.


Open space prims were doubled. Cost was 400 something (1/4 of 1625)... and open spaces were opened up as singles...... YAY! Some methods of usage were NOT ADVISED but certainly not prohibited. And I was there when they started selling these things and I like many of you KNOW LL knew full well how they were used at 1875 prims let alone what would happen when they doubled. I had many conversations with Jack himself about how they could switch me away from abusers. That was in 2006. so what happened??? BUY BUY BUY
phil got a tan and new blue blazer



A few short weeks later.... Lower full sim pricing to 1k and since an os is 1/4 let's lower that too! So what happened UPROAR, UPROAR BUY BUY BUY CONVERT CONVERT CONVERT sell privately sell privately lose shirt lose shirt. The claims some made (I include myself) were born out when in a few short month abandonment and private transfer give aways ran rampent b/c the glut created so much vacant land that people thinking they could break even (forget making a profit) saw large tier bills they couldnt carry.

This started to calm down about a month ago. Private transfer prices started to stabilize if not actually start improving. There was s cleansing of sorts where the guys that jumped in at the lower price were selected out b/c they either didnt know what they were doing or didnt get rich so fast like they expected or both.


Now enter genius decision number X.

All of this on top of mainland that was flooded, Bay City and Nautilus that is an ambush on uneducated noobs and a farce and we have where we are today.


There is no more question. LL has and imo will continue to do all it can to squeeze out the middle man in the land game. And you know? I don't really mind that if that's their goal. Just say it for god's sakes! If that's what you want for SL do it. I won't gripe. Obviously I'm not building my own VW and no one else has a viable alternative yet. LL you really are doing a great job of wiping your true amazing accomplishments from the minds of many who would actually accept your decisions if you'd just own up to them.


Now another thing. I don't profess to know about all this server stuff and dual core whatevers. But here's a sincere question. Does this abuse talked about in OS sims affect mainland? Or is it just affecting open space users? If it affects mainland then by that argument why are we not going after mainland abuses and raising tier there. That might actually accomplish what many of think this is all about anyway. If it only affects open space users then how exactly does one lag another on a sim that they arent supposed to be using for more than standing in the forest or meadow? What I'm saying is, LL it's hard for me to swallow you all of a sudden care so much about function that you need to do this. If it's os function you are trying to improve, then that is counterintuitive to your argument about what is reducing function in the first place and that is "light use."

So bottom line. LL is not competent at defining what it indeed is. LL is not competent at working toward that goal if they do w/o alienating people that in all likely would actually stay if we knew what that goal was.


Someone enlighten me.

Please stick around and ignore the trolls. We need a bit of clear-eyed sanity in this discussion.

As I will be directly affected like so many others here... I feel like a fish on the hook of a mean little brat, being shaken about.

This seems a very opportunistic, i.e. shark-like, strategy to administer usage limitations. There could be any number of fair alternatives, but they would all decrease revenue by decreasing value. The obvious solution to them is to curb technological shortcomings by decreasing demand, with potentially higher revenue.

What's the end result? LL has gone from a progressive company (remember Burning Life) who respects its customer base to a Walmart style "do whatever pays off" machine. It's survival, but it's ugly and it dehumanizes.

I may be willing to spend the money on a full sim if it benefited a company that had a real face. That all seems to be fading. :/

So in other words you are now saying that SL has gotten soooo big that it needs to force a few thousand people out of SL by raising prices for the common folk, WOW, Does US Congress own SL also. That is real close to raising the RL takes on the poor and leaving the rich to stay rich. Typical for the politics.

If you were really protesting, you wouldn't be clogging infohubs with your BS and flagwaving. I'm not on your side.

When you have servers you hire from a major provider and they tell you there is a bandwidth limit, it is is your best business interests to make sure that limit is not just NOT reached but well within the limits of usage for all accounts on that server. This is just Webhostuing made simple.
SL is just webhosting.... that is all, with a very large program on it and many accounts using the same program per server.

When we ran our servers we told people they had bandwidth limits, at first there was limits then was "UNLIMITED" accounts then they realised the folly of this as "abusers" not really abusers... developers that understood that they could take advantage quite klegally of the unlimited bandwidth allocation, would use all of their allocation.
BUT... this was recognised in the bsuienss plans, and throttleing was strictly adhered too when people were found to be using too much.

Yes... it meant more moeny for us, but it meant loos of some smaller customers, and everyone knows in business.... a studio or small business is kept afloat by "bread and butter" customers. In this case the people who use less badwidth..... on SL are the bread and butter and keep the LL coffers alive and trickling to a healthy income..... its the over users... in this case they are being called Abusers ..... that should be made to pay the bill or be throttled.

I dont understand the logic to the LL decisons here and beleive the Asylum is being run by the patients!!

Gt a grip LL..... get the over users to stick to the usage allocated. Go to the owners of the Full SIMS and throttle their bandwidth, I promise you they will VERY soon go back to their customers and throttle them too..... maybe not with bandwidth controls...grin!!

Do the right thing here, act like webhsoting business people you are meant to be..... stop eating too much of your own product... come back into reality!!!

Mr. CEO, you are new, save your company.

Oh btw, I was wondering if the timing was significant??? Isnt Jan 1st when Americans have to get their Tax returns in....????? Just thinking..... ?

Non-sequitor. You don't need to play SL. Until big rigs get better than 7 MPG or run on something other than petroleum, we're all subject to it's price fluctuations, even if you are lucky enough to not have to commute to work /and/ you live across the street from the grocery store.

No credit crunch?

With this announcement we will see about that won't we?

Let's see what the BBC, BT, Cisco, Diageo, IBM, KPMG, Orange, Unilever, and Vodafone think about resident's reaction. These companies usually do their homework!

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13772_3-10074637-52.html

There is a saying: "Be nice to the people on the way up because you will meet them on the way down."

IT'S ALL ABOUT TRUST!!!

@ Joshe Darkstone

This is the most concise analysis of the current situation yet composed

read it and the water will clear

The moving finger writes and having writ moves on: nor all your Piety nor Wit
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,
Nor all your Tears wash out a Word of it.

This is more like a zoning issue. The openspace sims were obviously never intended for business use or they wouldn't have such ridiculously low prim and avatar counts. Quite a few people are going beyond the max prim count, it's not hard to find openspace sims where this is a problem; I have no reason to believe this is by any means not widespread based on the openspace sims I've been to.

Want to fingerpoint and blame someone for the price increase? Look at your fellow openspace owners.

People keep addressing me directly and acting as if I somehow orchestrated this just because my opinion varies from the masses. If you don't want me to answer, I suggest you don't address me directly, or don't make it personal ABOUT me, as you have in this post.

I have stated before that I WILL defend my right to have an opinion, and YOU are just going to have to suck it up and accept that my opinion varies from yours.

Yes, I recognize that it might make you feel better to feel like you kicked someone else when you are hurt. But I did nothing wrong other than disagree with your opinion.

Just a small question from a concerned customer of LL (not 'resident' as LL prefer to call us because we all pay to be here making us customers).
How exactly does a price hike serve to reduce lag in an OS..?
Additional money will not magically add processing power to servers unless the funds added is used to improve server performance.

I'm sorry but this smells to me like someone is lining their pockets at our expense.

How, exactly, does one go beyond the max prim count?

Temp rezzers, for one.

Privacy, or as extra acerage for a telehub for adjacent regular sims, etc.

A sim has zero load on the grid once it is taken offline. This really looks more like an exit from an ill-conceived service offering than a "real" price hike. The price boost lets them essentially discontinue the offering without saying they are dropping it.

I have a friend in Sweden and for every dollar he spends in US $ he has to pay an additional 25% VAT. He pays even more than the USA resident with sims. He has 6 OS and one Full sim. Not overload and had done this out of his pocket to join with others to create 125 sims of sailing. Open Water....... So that sailing can work and not crash and be enjoyable and have races . Along the way are beautiful open to the public areas that creations of the owners have created to enjoy SL. Not commercial not business. He cannot keep these as well as the other ones who have contributed to the community of SL. A sad day....indeed. There will be many that cannot keep this up. Boy is it not rough enough in RL now here too.
This is the very first time I have ever said anything against LL. But this one hurt.

I bought my first land in SL about three months ago after a year of in-world experience, but not much attention to the land game. I was going to buy estate land in a residential sim for x Lindens, but one of the estate managers redirected me to open space when I said I could get along with half the prims (for about x/2 Lindens in tiers). That manager owned the land he redirected me to. I am not complaining, but I guess using almost all my prims seemed like an OK thing to do since they were allocated to the land, even if the avatar count at my place has been low. It is hard to know, in retrospect, if my plans for the land were what Linden had in mind for open space. I was looking for a SL place to "live". So, I might have gotten caught up in the open space land "abuse" thing, or as likely Linden miscalculated how open spaces might appeal to first-timers like myself. Live and learn I say more often these days in SL.

Lindens, please do take into consideration the severe economic downturn, world-wide, when you make chances to the cost of the game.

For it to be a violation of antitrust law, Linden Labs would have to be the only grid in town. That's simply not the case. http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Grid_List

Yes, Microsoft successfully avoided getting broken up using the "but open source is our competition" defense.

As others have mentioned upthread, abusing scripts to re-rez temporary objects after they get returned.

This will end my home in SL with my partner. We love our sim, and do not over use it either. We probably won't bother to get another place unless it is cheap rental. I just can't see us bothering to invest in land again to possibly lose it. We, especially my partner, worked so hard to make our place beautiful just for us. I'm so sad we will not be able to afford it. Please reconsider this.
LaTrue Nightfire

How about LL send me back my 1600 that I paid for a full sim last march, and in turn, they can have back the open sim they gave me, for the last time they made a major change, and the original full sim.

Not only is the SL economy in the tank, because of the floods of land that LL has been releasing, RL econonmy is in the tanks too, you surely have seen the stock market lately, so as I see it, not a better time to raise tier.