Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Definitions

It will effect my place Alice, since I'm on the mainland and its a public open place with sexual themes... but your place isn't on the mainland, and it isn't a public area, and there is no sexual aspect to it, as sex isn't even allowed... I don't think you have a thing to worry about.

Your ankles are waaaay too explicit!

But that does bring up a point - by what standards will someone be determined as explicit? The rules change depending on which country you are from.

ab stands for adult babys. the reson we dont alow child avatars is 3 main resons. one is ther is a bar. 2 the mall has vendors that sell stull like with diaper and diaper punsment. example one vendor sells cages another sells collars, ect.. 3. we have a hard enough time keeping the sicos out that prey on rl kids and child avtars as it is.

we try to keep a fun safe place and its not easy sometimes.

well hoping every thing will work out.

No, Theia Snowpaw, SL is NOT a game. SL is many things to many people, otherwise we wouldn't need this conversation. Your main point, however, is valid - we're all adults by definition so what's wrong with exercising some adult discretion?

Presumably LL are raising this now because there are rumblings of court-action in the States, just like there were when the US banned gambling in SL. People said then, "Whatever next, the sex clubs?", and here we are. Being English I don't know what the exact problem is be but I suppose there's a duty placed on LL to take reasonable precautions to ensure people are not exposed to unsuitable material.

It seems to me LL, in common with all other web-based material, can do this just by asking the customers to click an 'I am 18' button. Hiro Pendragon seems to have summed this option up nicely (Let's have similar options for Halal, Vegetarian, Kosher, Fundamentalist-Christian, etc.). LL appears to be creating a 'new' definition of PG which is incredibly tight, calling normality (ALL the bars, clubs, etc?) 'Mature' and X-Rated 'Adult'. Bearing Blondin's clarifications in mind this makes sense but is more than is required by 1. above. Secondly, why is it the 'adult' people moving. The 'puritan' areas should be the new ones - let people that want to move into them.

Age verification doesn't work! I'm too poor to have a credit card (thank you SO much SunShine Kukulcan and others) and the age-verification doesn't allow passports from the UK - or at least it didn't when I tried it. Ah well, I'm not desperate to visit any sex-clubs so as long as I can still go to the 'Mature' clubs and dance I'm ok. Oh dear! I've got customers who are Goreans! Will I no longer be able to visit their premises and install builds (really hard-core stuff like the teleporter I'm working on ^^)? There go the profits and, possibly, me too.

(Don't even get me started on "anything else broadly offensive" - I find a lot of things in SL very specifically offensive, but I know US LL is not going to agree, or do anything about them).

Sorry, Lindens. While I appreciate your efforts to make SL more "inclusive" and less susceptible to digs from the media, you're heading down the wrong path.

We already have standards - PG and Mature, as silly as those monikers are.

Setting up an entire new system to quarantine the Mature side of the fence is patently ridiculous. Just from observation (you would know better the exact count), the Mature-rated areas far outnumber the PG rated areas. So if you're going to segregate anybody, it should be the PG people. Then they never have to leave their safe enclave of sexless peacefulness. Anybody outside the enclave is free to mark their area as PG if they desire, but the PG residents should know that they may be "offended" occasionally when they step out of their comfort zone.

If you want to do it right, implement age verification via credit card (or passport or driver's license or other form of adult-oriented ID). SL is an adult activity by its very nature. Catering to a vocal minority is a way to damage relations with your majority stakeholders, and make your eventual competition far more attractive than it might otherwise be.

Work on improving your SL business interactions. Provide in-world help wanted/services offered controls so that people like me who are looking for sales pros can find them easily. The more people are able to look at SL as a serious enterprise (and not just a sex and shoot-em-up playground), the more serious the media and users will take Linden Labs and Second Life

i may be a bit loopy to make my first post in such a thread, but here goes..

i ahve read this whole thread (skimmed a couple posts) and see a bunch of stuff that a buinch of people have said, but that's not important right now.

i'm just responding to the fact that they have asked us to discuss what we, as residents, think the line should be. so, with that in mind:

Adult, to me: anything very explicit. sexually, violently, or any other "-ly".. if it's explicit, it should be Adult.

Not Adult, to me: general nudity, (non-sex/escort) strip clubs, regular violence (damage enabled war zones and stuff would be fine, mutiolation.. not so much), and all the PG stuff

by the way, "PG" isn't really meant as "Parental Guidance". and whoever points to it and says "that doesn't make sense", no offense, but you're just not getting it.. it's just a familiar term (for the people who made SL and most initial users (you know, from the USA) where they automatically think of PG as "not R". so, fer serious.. PG means exactly what you know it does.


For the record, i think having a seperate Adult grid is MUCH easier than trying to start up a "G" rated grid.. yuck.

AND.. if this does mean that the TG/MG will combine into one world, then GREAT! it means we're that much closer to being "the next version of the internet" or whatever. Is there an age restriction on your internet browser? nope. anyone can surf the net. it has controls to limit what people can see, but that needs a very different way of being handled in a 3D environment. (including parents taking responsibility)

i think i have more thoughts, but i have to go hang out with some people in RL (and i bet i don't drive by some rape fantasy setting or mutilated cadaver scene on the side of the road, because there's zoning)

I agree with the individual who posted that PG refers to parental guidance and doesn't really define how LL intends the define PG. In a PG group on SL you can't swear, but in a PG movie you can. This only serves to cause confusion. I agree that it should be called something else such as general.

Furthermore i think that mature and adult are two TOTALLY different categories. On our sim we do not censor chat topics or attire. On the same note we don't have any sex beds currently located on the sim but could just as easily have sex poses. Our sim however is not ADULT in nature. We do have conversations of an adult nature or silks dancing that can be adult in theme at times. We would not want an underage group on our sim nor do we think people should be age verified to come and hang out. Our sim is private already and only those invited to the group may visit (except when we occassionaly drop the ban lines for public access) but our sim and our group remains mature at any cost.

I think it would be silly to lump mature and adult as one group. I have no problem with overtly sexual content (strip bars, adult product stores, sex clubs etc) to be flagged as Adult, as well as extreme violence areas. But there should also be a mature tag for people who are going to step over the line sometimes with the nature of a conversation, some casual flirtation, a sexy outfit, use of foul language. I personally don't want to censor people and i don't want to demand age verification. Our group also involves alot of alt players and it would be a nightmare to expect them all to have to age verify just for the sake of game play. I don't want to open the can of worms where someone can file a ticket because while in a mature area someone makes a sexual joke or inuendo.

Please keep Mature and Adult as two separate groups.

Due to the multiple threads on this topic, some of the below might not precisely fit "definitions" and might fall under the other threads. My apologies in advance, but I find that many of the above areas seem somewhat linked, and I cannot so succinctly separate them out in my writing.

It is my hope that one or more of Linden Lab's representatives might be able to correct me where I am wrong in the below.

1. The decision was made to weed out extreme sexual conduct in order to make the majority of the grid appropriate for business and educational needs, as well as a presumed minority of individuals who have spoken loudly about sexual content within SL. This is not a decision specific to the majority of users' desires, but is instead drafted with the intent of keeping Linden an and it's core products viable to business and educational uses.

2. Said decision, while it could certainly help pave the way for such, is not directly intended as a stepping stone towards sanitizing the grid for a full and complete merger of the teen grid and main grid. Such merger discussions remain in discussion, but are separate from this decision.

3. Content affected by this decision is specifically addressing locations designed for extreme sexual and extreme violent content. Such would include locations where the *majority* of the activities in these locations are geared towards such activities. Prostitution, "vore," bestiality (note: separate from either ferals or furries), extreme BDSM, Gor, combat zones, slave auctions, etc. would be required to relocate to a specific zoned area (presumably Ursula) or face disciplinary action.

4. Vendors whose primary business is catering to violent or sexual activity (places that specifically sell MLP beds, BDSM equipment, prim sex animals, prim genitals), etc. would be required to relocate to a specific zoned area (presumably Ursula) or move their sales out of SL (to XStreetSL, for example) or face disciplinary action.

5. Vendors who sell items of a violent or sexual nature *in addition* to other goods (Ms. Ventura's store mentioned previously, mixed content malls, or a hypothetical furniture store that *also* sells MLP beds as part of its regular house wears) would be able to continue to sell on mature rated plots without an adult flag, and without relocating.

5. Skin and shape vendors would be able to continue as they do today, presuming their vendor images remain non-sexual in nature. Simply showing a skin on a model is not considered to be sexual in context.

6. Except from the above are examples of sexual ageplay, which are already banned from the grid. Conversely, those participating in the non-sexual use of child avatars are not considered "adult" and in need of any relocation or disciplinary action under these rules.

7. Artistic nudity, as seen in Michelangelo's David, Bottecelli's The Birth of Venus, or even in inworld examples such as Cheen Pitney's Water Is Life are not considered "adult" and in need of any relocation or disciplinary action under these rules.

8. The use of MLP beds and other non-extreme sexual content within ones own parcels, as in the case of a private residence, is not considered "adult" and in need of any relocation or disciplinary action under these rules.

9. Avatar nudity, in and of itself, is not considered "adult" and in need of any relocation or disciplinary action under these rules -- presuming there is not sexual activity involved with such nudity

Please clarify on these points if you could.

What is actually quite funny is that clothing which is considered the height of morality by a particularly repressive group, the Burka (properly called the Chandor), is considered obscene by some Europeans. I would love to see how that will be resolved.

The actual MPAA ratings don't really work in a way that would be compatible with SL. Each movie is vetted by a committee before release. The ratings are negotiable, the producers can alter or cut scenes to change the rating. GTeam on the other won't tell you in advance if something would comply, like the guessing games with the gaming machines a few months ago. People had to basically AR themselves and hope the outcome wasn't too negative if the stuff was returned. Additionally, LL won't discuss the specifics of returns and suspensions, people ask "what can I change in this content to bring it into compliance?" and they get stonewalled.

Define "sexual". Skimpy swimsuits are designed to tittilate. No sexual activity takes place, but the purpose of a gathering on a beach (topless or not) is innocent sexuality. Will tittilation be sufficient to define a gathering as "sexual", or does implied pixel sex have to take place?

It's possible to lose payment info from an account.

Overall opinion: what a disaster but at least Linden Lab is consulting us. Here are two quibbles:

1) I noted this in your definitions:

"For instance, stores that sell a range of content which may include some "sexy" clothing or objects may generally reside in Mature rather than Adult regions"

I don't have any idea how Linden Lab will be able to monitor and enforce this detail.

After all, as many point out here, "sexy" might be a flash of a woman's calf in Eastern Turkey (where alleged violations of family honor lead to young girls being killed by relatives). Yet at Turkish beach resorts, you'll see topless bathers at the beach. I have a headache even thinking about the hair-splitting your lawyers will have to do to make this work for a global audience.

2) Dancer pointed out:

"Whether fair or not, it's already required that all additional avatars (alts) have payment info, because there is a $9.95 charge for alts. Anyone who hasn't paid this is violating SL's TOS."

This is laughable. I repeatedly tried to pay the $9.95 fee to register an ALT and was told--twice--by your support folks that the option no longer exists (I did register another one a year back). I also put payment info on file for this ALT and the new status never showed in-world.

I have this feeling that one hand at LL does not always know what the other is doing.

You'd be better off making us all age-verify and blocking minors completely. Good luck--you folks will need it.

As many has allready pointed out in this thread, there is a wast divergy in how PG is intercepted.

What the lab needs to do is clarify what the so called ratings actually are in practical.

Looking at f.ex. http://www.mpaa.org/FlmRat_Ratings.asp there is a lot of questions about what kind of PG rating SL is under. If it's PG as in PG, nudity is allowed which it seems it's not in the new rules (they are more G rated really than PG), and if PG in SL would be more equal to PG13 then there is quite much more that is allowed.

(Thinking of the 18+ age requirement for the main grid in the TOS, it would actually be more appropriate to use R rating for the PG sims *grins and winks*)

So in the end... be more specific as there will be a lot missunderstandings around the RL world. Think globally as not everyone knows about the MPAA ratings or the different diversions thereof.

And now, how is it with nudists/naturist, or for that thing those just suntanning or bathing naked or zomg happens to crash naked into a PG hub on relog LOL.

"Representations of intense violence depicting death, torture, dismemberment or other severe bodily harm."

I was planning on a vampire-centric sim along the lines of Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Would I have to move according to the propsed regulations?

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More generally, what about the sims in which combat and death are features? If someone staked me in real life, I'd definitely consider it "intense violence". But then, this isn't real life. So where are you going to draw the line between Tom & Jerry cartoons and a hack-and-slash horror films.

Ah, LL and her Users now run into the sticky business every growing town eventually finds themselves facing: Zoning.

It is true, some people do not benefit each other as neighbors, like the stripclub next to the daycare, or the toxic waste dump next to the arboretum.

Outside of personal interests in their private affairs, I think the biggest matters here are the point of relocation, and the finer gray area distinctions, which, to be blunt, LL has done a muddled job of in the past.

I have read all the threads on this matter up to ten minutes ago, and have not seen a solid answer on these points, so, if a Linden would indulge me a moment:


Hypothetical Business: Henri's Erotic Greek Statues. Outdoor sculpture garden selling replicas of famous Greek and Roman statuary and original pieces in the same style. Where does this business fit in the Adult/Mature Division? Would that distinction change if it were actually a display hosted by a Museum Foundation, such as the Louvre or Smithsonian?

Venue Rental: In my town, the local stadium is used for local sports. In the off season, it has a gunshow, a horror convention, a sextrade convention, and an children's fair. The Venue is neutral, but the events it hosts fall into all three ratings. So, where would the SL representation of this venue fit?

I sell a combat-system based gun. My customers shoot each other till one falls down dead, only to get up a minute later. Violent death reduced to little more than a game of tag or capture the flag. Where does my business fit in this divide?

I host a builds on mainland recreating in three dimensions famous paintings. Currently I host a build recreating Heironymus Bosch's "Garden of Earthly Delights." Where does my event fall in this new arrangement. (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Garden_delights.jpg for referrence)

My business sells animations meant to encompass a wide range of human motion and interactions, including some violent animations and a number of sex animations. Where does my business fall?



When it comes to Moving businesses around, well good luck. You aren't likely to make anybody happy there. However, as I've commented on other past decisions, LL must learn to sweeten the pot for all parties. What tangible incentives are there, besides "Or Else" or "Because We Said So" (which is how this seems to be being received at the moment). Simply saying this will be better for target marketing is not a tangible incentive.

You would have an easier time to start a new continent that is strictly PG, and another Strictly Mature, than to attempt to sort out mainland as it stands.


The discussion has dwelt on place, but what of persons? I am far beyond 18. I have payment info on file. Am I going to be ARed if I am short and slight TPing to shop in an "Adult" sim, like some of the foolishness that has surrounded child avatars?

Or alternatively, say my profile is nothing but adult groups advertising adult activities. Am I even allowed near a PG sim? Is there grounds for ARing me for violating global TOS regarding profiles when all my groups and picks in adults area's like "Ted's house of rough donkey sex" and "Club whip-me-till-I-bleed vampire sex club"? Would I myself have to have some sort of "Adult" tag on my profile?


Zoning is zoning. People will be angry. Just don't go about using this inane and meaningless "broadly offensive" label. I find its use very specifically offensive.

I think part of your issues of a definition is that adult or mature is neither black nor white especially based on peoples own perspectives.

It has been said a few times already that we are all adults and adults have a responsibility to make our own choices. If we don't like something we have a choice to leave. What would help greatly in these choices is a more narrower indication of what content is contained. Some modern films and television now have statements prior to them starting saying this film contains nudity, violence, strong language etc. if i dont wish to see that i can switch off, but i am presented with a choice and do not watch a film only to be suprised by its content.

Categorising all things Adult, again will not solve my choices, one type of content maybe acceptable to myself another maynot.

However if a land owner could clearly define their content possibly using a simple pick list approach of predefined options, e.g. mild nudity, violence, sexual acts etc.. of what they consider is allowed or not allowed on their own land and I was presented with a dialogue upon teleport that said "The land you are teleporting to may contain...." then again I am presented with my own choice of whether to proceed or not.

Since the questions are being evaded let's ask again.

Will symbols like the tri yang or triskellion that have no sexual content displayed be censored and be declared adult?

Will Gorean Role Play be banned?

Will Vampire Role Play be banned or censored?

Will combat/violence Role Play be banned or censored?

Please provide direct answers from top management. No "I think" nebulous answers by low level staff are acceptable. These questions must be answered directly.

Wouldn't it make more sense to create new areas that completely conform to these standards and allow the current grid to exist in it's current state?
Also, will these standards be clearly stated on the sign up page rather than being lumped into the TOS that almost no one reads prior to accepting?

" Today, 06:22 PM #17
Korena Starbrook
Registered User


Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 4 I own a mainland sim and sell beds that contain animations - many of which are sexual in nature.

Sex is NOT permitted in the store and neither is nudity.

How will I be affected? I own the entire sim - does this mean I have to pack up and move??? "

I have a store that has sex animations in the beds. What we do so that no one confuses the store with a free sex area is allow people to access the menu but cannot use the balls. this allows a person who is considering buying one the ability to see what animations are loaded.
Of course the mention of " sex Bed" will be removed from the store ad and maybe bed with animations replacing it.
To any Linden reading this, is the above within the rules?

Simplicity is the path to enlightenment. You are dead on Taco, there is NO need for this! SL requires that its members BE adult.
What we have here is a classic case of tyranny by the majority (or more likely vocal minority). once again ADULTS are being told what is an isn't acceptable by other adults, in an adult only context.
The solution is easy, wake up to the fact that there IS no right to never be offended. As far as community standards go, I would suggest that the community in question would be the region in cases of public areas, and I just DON'T see the problem. If something in a certain region offends you, don't GO there! If you go there by mistake, LEAVE!
It is in no way ANYONES right to choose what I am able to enjoy in the company of friends and/or like minded strangers.
Understandably it IS LL's right to set terms of service and acceptability policies, but I would hope that they would understand that the vast majority of their members are intelligent enough to discern between what offends them or not, and avoid what does.

Mature Sims are exactly that. For Mature Adult activities which include sex. I have enjoyed sexual activities within SL for years. I'm a freak like that.. So, because you are a prude. I am not allowed to have a sex bed on my land. Not allowed to hang erotic art in my virtual home. Not allowed to do anything sexual that you might find extreme. Even if it is straight sex in the missionary position performed in my window tinted home with my land clearly marked as a mature area. No Thanks... Alot of you probably engage in activities in SL that I would find highly offensive and object to. But you don't see me banishing you or making you change your SL life. You move! You and all those who think like you. Go create your homogenized, pasteurized, squeeky clean disneyesque continent.. Bet you a million lindens more people would choose the freedom of how it is now rather than your confined, narrow, empty world.

What about Sex pools and Jacuzzi in "yards" At my private skybox I have a Jacuzzi that has Sex animations.... that I may or may not enjoy the company of a male resident from time to time

Ol' Mitch is taking his ball and going home.. He downt wike the way we pway.... So, he must banish us.. LOL!