Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Definitions

Now LL might be saying NOW that GLBT venues are not automatically adult or mature but I am a bit suspicious of that given the focus of religious fundamentalists on preventing any questioning of their version of hetero normative gender identity and sexual orientation. Quite frankly I can see LL coming down on people such as myself whose gender identity as being different from my biological data are openly reflected in our profiles.

I don't have any explicitly sexual groups visible in my profile. But am I now going to have to hide the couple of non sexual groups I belong to that deal with GLBT support issues. Is SL going to be like first life where we have to hide ourselves or "cover?" I sure hope not.

Maybe LL should check out the pressure put on libraries by fundamentalists to remove books they deem offensive.

As a counter offer, I propose the creation of a G-rated area for all those "adults" who can't handle being either "adult" or "mature." Leave your statues of David and your skins without baked-on underwear at the door, pick up a freebie hat with a buckle, and enjoy a second life free of anything that might ever be offensive in the Puritan sims.

See, I can use hyperbole, too. Just because some people can't tolerate ANY instance of nudity doesn't mean that EVERY instance is "XXX" or "Pornographic".

Sorry everyone. My previous post was sent to the wrong thread.

The definition of "adult" is much too strict in SL. Mere nudity is obviously mature, and not adult; there's plenty of nonpornographic nudity in R-rated movies, in art, and other media. Skins are a perfect test example. Pictures of skins are definitely non-erotic; their purpose is to display a product, not to stimulate. Ironically, requiring individuals to put censor bars over certain areas on a skin product sexualizes it even more, because the act of "OH NOES CANT SHOW THIS" implies sexuality, rather than a straightforward, non-controversial anatomical display of a texture for a 3D figure.

Quoting the FAQ:

"What are "Adult" Regions, Groups, Events and Classifieds?

Any publicly accessible Region must be designated "Adult" and therefore require Adult validation if it advertises, makes available, references, or displays the following:
Representations of explicit sexual conduct or genitalia, whether or not photo-realistic ...

***

Why can't there be an "in between" category for ART that depicts the human nude body SEPARATE from the PORN???

This is an issue I have raised with Linden Labs regarding its "adult" classification on xstreetsl.com. My artful female nudes, about which there is NOTHING pornographic, end up appearing in the same category as explicit REAL LIFE sexual acts, and SLAVERY SIMULATIONS.

I object EMPHATICALLY to this.

Why should this:

https://uncensored.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&file=item&ItemID=1294034

be placed in the same category as this:

[WARNING! - you may be offended by these images!!!! I AM!!!->>]

https://uncensored.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&file=item&ItemID=605745

or this:

https://uncensored.xstreetsl.com/modules.php?name=Marketplace&file=item&ItemID=1118213

???????????

They are no where near even on the same planet!!!!

I understand some people are offended by nudity no matter what the purpose or conditions. Fine.

But DO NOT put ARTful depictions in the same category as PORN!

Please at the very least create a category that does not force people who appreciate art that happens to depict the nude human body to consent to also view pornography.

This is Puritanism at its WORST!

First, I like the idea of having a designation for extreme content on SL because I think it will make browsing around a lot easier. That is not saying I will only be searching for Adult extreme content but when I am trying to do some shopping I would rather not walk into the middle of a couple copulating.

That being said, I do have some strong issues with the current definitions. For instance, some art forms including nude photography and skin creation are currently deemed adult. I don't have a problem with these being deemed mature, but adult? I think nudity should not be deemed adult and the standard should be realistic depictions of sex using either real people or avatars in a public area. That way in a mature mall vendors could sell their photorealistic skins, sex balls and prim genitalia without fearing retribution. The places deemed adult would be places where using these items is a large activity.

This would allow art galleries to display art without censure, skin creators would be safe from censure, and a person could sell their genitalia that they probably have spent a lot of time creating.

Regulating the definition to public areas would eliminate the idea of private residences being put underneath public regulations. In my city you cannot smoke in any business, but you can smoke all you want in the comfort of your own home, even if friends or other people step inside. The same idea should apply to SL. What happens behind closed doors is none of the government's business. It is good of folks to warn those who may not be looking for that type of entertainment though.

I support "General" tag replacing "PG". PG is not a term that should be used in sl as it encourages people to think that people who need parental guidance (ie teens) can be in SL, And they cannot and shouldnt be.

If we go by the 95/5 Rule it would be easy for me to define what should be considered adult vs. mature. Although, I'm no expert on sex sims. But I have seen a couple things in SL that were - disturbing. While I consider anything in SL as voluntary (in other words, if you don't like what is going on teleport away), I can understand why the issue is there.

In any event all policy statements regarding sensitive issues should be caveatted by a 'buyer beware' clause. It is not an idle claim that you cannot be responsible for users' behavior. After all, it's a user-generated environment.

GLBT venues will NOT automatically be considered Adult.

Everyone here knows this is totally pointless because Linden Lab have already decided what they are going to do.

Nonetheless, if LL are really soliciting our input for a definition of things that must be hidden in the ghetto then let's do it. Could be fun. I'll start with a short paragraph and everyone else can adjust it or add bits and we'll try to build a precise and accurate definition.

The only guideline we really have so far is that it should only include 2-4% of the mainland residents so let's go for that.

I agree. Not every case of nudity is Adult or pornographic. But would you think that it would be considered mature?

A concern...

One thing that I am afraid that will get lost in translation in the forming of this new definition, is the fact that the emphasis, and maybe rightly so, will only be on sexual content, and violent content will slip through the cracks.

Again, definitions for both can be interpretted many different ways by people in various places in the world.


*edit* - Welcome back Blondin

I like how you put it and I think it could help answer a few concerns that people are having.

I am not opposed to them being considered mature. Although the definition does not support that. See my former post.

I think part of the point is that LL has had the PG-only rules for things like profiles for YEARS and hasn't really been able to manage it. See also: welcome areas. This new deal seems like a far, FAR larger management project for LL. You guys really haven't delivered on enforcing the existing rules.

Why is this pg/mature/adult stuff suddenly so important that you're dumping resources into it like there's no tomorrow and why do you think you'll be able to manage it when you haven't been able to manage the existing stuff? Please, not the "more choices" line again either.

For the moment, that is.

And the same applies to BDSM, and nudity. Nudity is a prime example: ask the makers of child avatar skins about the malleability of Linden morality--with no bothersome fuss about posting a hint of policy, let alone a change to the ToS.

Practically speaking, and from experience, we have to assume that any definition based on actual attributes of content is bound to change at a whim and without notice.

That's why the only viable definition is based on numbers: the 2-3% most offensive content on the grid.

(Personally, I find most offensive the burnt-out adfarm parcels, the most egregious traffic-gamers, and Bloodlines. Can't we just segregate them to Continent Exotica and call it a day?)

I have a suggestion to changes being made in mature areas and mature content.

1) let the land owner decide what he/she wants to do on his land.
2) Let those who choose not to see any sexual activity not go to areas that are set up for such.

If I owned a place next to a sexual explict mature land and didn't want to see this activity. It would be easy for me to put up a wall with green trees facing them. That way I would not have to see it. The other option is that I could just sell the land and move.

A person that has mature land should make it clear to any going there what is going on there to anyone new. AKA what is allowed on his land. PG is PG content and mature is mature content.

Are we not 18 or older and adults? Age checks keep the kidies out. Leave it up to the land owners to decide what they do on their land.

Are we lead to believe that people are blundering into areas and can,t be adult enough to just leave these areas? This is crazy.

My concept would save Linden Labs alot of programing and cost. Lets just be adults people!

We don't need to segragate any group or type of sexual content.

I seriusoly hope that I or anyone would not be required to move mearly because SL members can't be adult about sexual content.

SL is multi-cultural and, as mentioned before, needs to reflect the various cultural standards if this is going to work.

Myself, I'd offer the following as definitions of 'adult' content:

- Items or activities of a sexual nature, including depictions of sex acts, sex beds, and related pose balls
- Attachments that imply sexuality (such as prim 'appendages')
- Areas where sexual acts are practised publicly (whether shrouded by trees and buildings, etc, or not)

If there's sex beds in the open, whether they're hidden by trees or whatever, to me that's an adult area. If they're inside a private building, to me that's not an adult area. It's pretty easy to make the distinction in that way.

As for the definition of what constitutes a sexual act, however ... that's when it gets tricky. In my view, a woman in a skimpy bikini is uncomfortable. However, I'm a self-confessed prude. So how do we decide what is acceptable, and what is prudish?

I have nothing against a woman showing her mid-section ... however, there are cultures where that is considered indecent exposure. In yet other cultures, that's considered prudish.

I think the Lindens are going to need to write up very specific guidelines as to what is and isn't adult content. Leave no grey areas, put it there in black and white. It's one of those things that is far too open to interpretation otherwise.

Well-said, Karin.

I'm scared for my second life. I love the freedom and beauty of SL. For that matter-- I love the beauty of all life. A recent article in the New York Times quoted someone as saying that our lives in SL are works in progress-- living art.

This whole thing smacks of censorship. Frankly, it's scary. What if I were to want to display the Hieronymous Bosch painting "The Garden of Earthly Delights" in my shop (If I was a shop owner)? Due to the graphic nature of the images depicted, would I have to move to porn-land too?

I have a question-- will non-pornographic activities be banned from porn-land? "Sorry, go back to the mainland-- no intellectual chats allowed here in PORN LAND, only hardcore sex and rape please!" If Porn-land is uncensored, maybe we should all just move there.... but something tells me that LL won't let that go down either....

I am an academic in RL-- and artist and an art professor. I've been reading all the discussions on various threads with a growing sense of dread. Part of the beauty of SL is the heightened juxtaposition of contrasts. Ony yesterday I was at a popular cafe and realized that there is a "gentleman's club" next door. In my RL, there's a porn shop next to my auto mechanic too... but I don't expect to sit in the mechanic's front room and see a Mistress and her sub on a leash... thank GOD I get to have that in SL.

I just started exhibiting my paintings, which have nude figures in them, in SL. Sometimes my work is more erotic in nature. In RL, galleries and museums may (but rarely do) have a sign warning those who enter regarding "explicit content" but this does not stop teenagers from entering, unless their parents keep them under lock and key. What happens to people like me??

What about my friends who rent an apartment near a bunch of shops and galleries on a sim where there is no porn at the moment... but they are madly in love.... Will they not be able to have sex in their apartment due to camming through walls? Or is LL going to restrict camera access too?

I feel ill.

Personally, I wouldn't. What about a child av who wants to rp bathtime? What about a breastfeeding mum? In RL I will very happily take my kids to museums and galleries with nude content. The human body is beautiful and astonishing and I want my kids to grow up feeling proud, not ashamed of their bodies. I think it's a terrible pity that some people view such things as obscene, but then I am from Europe and I understand that people from other cultures have different views. This is the whole problem with trying to come up with a cut-and-dried list of mature or adult content. We will never all agree on this. I think the best you can do is to just use the local laws (Californian?) and have done with it.

This is similar to Bri's post prior to yours. Not all nudity would be considered adult. Its when the overall theme becomes sexual or violent that it crosses that line.

I like how you say: nudity should not be deemed adult and the standard should be realistic depictions of sex using either real people or avatars in a public area.

However, you raise an interesting point about stores that sell sex balls and prim genitals. In my experience, people like to try on to see just what it is they are buying. And with people jumping onto and off of sex balls and trying out different genitals, then it seems to me that the overall theme of the store is sexual in nature. With search being filtered, it may benefit the person to be flagged as Adult, allowing them to advertise freely.

I posted earlier, but I've been mulling this over for a couple of hours now, read a lot of the posts here, and I'm having very strong feelings, so I want to chime in again.

Where is this idea for imposed segregation and censorship coming from? Did the Lindens get a couple of IM's from Newbies who wound up on a nude beach by accident? Or is it indeed, as suggested previously in this forum, motivated by some monetary concern, such as from the corporate world?

It is very easy to figure out what you're getting into when you do a Search and TP somewhere. And if you don't like what you see, you can TP away. We already have incredible control over where we go and why and when.

You can't ever fully "protect" the "virgin eyes" out there, it's not possible. We don't need this kind of "Parenting" by the Lindens. I love Jezebella Desmoulin's idea of giving the "G" people THEIR own land, and police that. Leave the rest of us alone to be free and express ourselves, our sexuality, and our aggression the way we want to (sans assaulting unwilling participants.) Corporations & Universities buy their own sims and make them the way they want them to be, so there is no issue there. And, if they want to, Sim owners can insist that visitors are part of a Groups they create, to gain entry to their Sim.

I agree that trying to define "Adult" is completely subjective, it's just not possible. It depends on the part of the world you live in, your upbringing, your stage in life, a zillion things. Furthermore, I've been in SL since 2006, and I have yet to be offended by anything I've seen, and I've seen a lot. I'm more concerned with griefers, and being "orbited" (if that's still possible), and SL functioning properly.

I think the only possibility here, is for the Lindens to make rules about only Linden owned public lands, and post the rules at the entrance hubs to those Sims. Everything else is the sim owner's business, and is already "under control" via Sim owners Covenants, and posted rules, "Abuse Reports" and other policing standards in effect already. And to make sure that all "first time entries" into Second Life come into a G rated sim, with the rules posted, and perhaps some kind of warning, or choice to TP to "G-Land" (should it be created) as a first exit from there. And maybe a "Touch for a notecard about what you may encounter in SL."

FREEDOM FOR SL!!

Leah

First, I like to say, I like the approach and definitions...
However...

If I have land, surrounded by a fence (even including a lock-out barriere which is possible) and have a hot tub in my back yard where I like to encounter in sexual activities...

Would that be allowed or not? Sexbed in home is ok to your findings... how about visible but private property?

Am I to blame for that one shocked person who keeps hovering at my fence to be offended when (s)he sees what I'm doing?