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LittleMe Jewell
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Join date: 8 Oct 2007
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12-24-2008 15:25
From: Amaranthim Talon
.... so if anyone actually wants to get back to a real discussion ....
not necessarily
:p
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LittleMe Jewell
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Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
12-24-2008 15:29
From: Avawyn Muircastle
I've never heard that, but I'd say all immigrants have had to struggle to find their way into American culture and have their own hardship stories to tell. ...
Wow.
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Avawyn Muircastle
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Join date: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 528
12-24-2008 15:30
From: Brenda Connolly
I can't stop laughing from that one.


Well, I grew up in Hollywood, what do you expect? Besides, what's his name loved Kathrine Hepburn but could never marry her or get a divorce because he was Catholic. Not to mention I've seen Catholic-oriented movies that were made in 30's and 40's. Can't remember the names, but there are a lot of Catholic oriented movies. A whole lot of them as a matter of fact! I'll try to get some names off TCM.

Now what would my bringing up the current genocides in Africa have to do with anything other than to prove all peoples have had hardships and oppression if not been mass murdered or sacrificed by all types of religions or cultures or mystic beliefs including Hilter, agnostic, athetist, and how does this relate to great schism between Roman Catholics and Protestants regarding the apocrypha among other things?

And to the above poster who said put an icon! I can't figure out how! I'm legally blind in one eye and I cannot see well. If you tell me how to put icons, I will. I can only see how to add one at the top of a post as shown above. And about my eyesight, I am not kidding period.
Brenda Connolly
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12-24-2008 15:33
From: Avawyn Muircastle


And to the above poster who said put an icon! I can't figure out how! I'm legally blind in one eye and I cannot see well. If you tell me how to put icons, I will. I can only see how to add one at the top of a post as shown above. And about my eyesight, I am not kidding period.

Upper right, adjacent to the posting area are 11 icons. just click the one you wish to put into your post.
Avawyn Muircastle
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Join date: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 528
12-24-2008 15:41
From: eku Zhong
they would be the savages you were talking about.

but then .. if the Romans (read pagans) hadn't invaded the British Isles.. then ppl would still be running around daubed in wode (that blue shit) going bonga bonga and eating ppl too...

happy holidays to you too :D


read the rest here
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/bones-provide-irrefutable-evidence-that-ancient-britons-were-cannibals-692882.html


Wow. And I don't mean World of Warcraft.
Amaranthim Talon
Voyager, Seeker, Curious
Join date: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 12,032
12-24-2008 15:42
How did we manage thru day after day before we were graced with such presence? The mind boggles really.


The truly frightening thing is that this is most probably not an aberration but more common than we wish to acknowledge...

I am still stuck somewhere back around how non-Western peoples were savages, btw.
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Avawyn Muircastle
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12-24-2008 15:43
From: Brenda Connolly
Upper right, adjacent to the posting area are 11 icons. just click the one you wish to put into your post.


I only see icons along the bottom. None on the upper right?
Zander Ronas
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Join date: 18 Dec 2008
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12-24-2008 15:47
From: Avawyn Muircastle
Well, I grew up in Hollywood, what do you expect?

I love this line. Just love it.
Avawyn Muircastle
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Join date: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 528
12-24-2008 15:48
From: Amaranthim Talon
How did we manage thru day after day before we were graced with such presence? The mind boggles really.


The truly frightening thing is that this is most probably not an aberration but more common than we wish to acknowledge...

I am still stuck somewhere back around how non-Western peoples were savages, btw.


I was referring to some cultures on Africa, and/or on Islands who still live as they did when Jesus of Nazareth walked the Earth, meaning no evolution of their culture, no education, no improvement in financial means whilst their population grows to the point were there is no food and they are starving to death or sold into the sex slave trade, or worse - genocide.
Damien1 Thorne
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12-24-2008 15:48
From: Avawyn Muircastle
I only see icons along the bottom. None on the upper right?

In the UserCP section, dark blue title bar at top of page, goto "Edit Options". The last choice is the type of editor used for posts. Change it from "Basic Editor" to "Standard Editor". Save your changes.
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Brenda Connolly
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12-24-2008 15:51
From: Zander Ronas
I love this line. Just love it.


It does explain a lot. But it was a good comeback. :)
Amaranthim Talon
Voyager, Seeker, Curious
Join date: 14 Nov 2006
Posts: 12,032
12-24-2008 15:55
From: Avawyn Muircastle
I was referring to some cultures on Africa, and/or on Islands who still live as they did when Jesus of Nazareth walked the Earth, meaning no evolution of their culture, no education, no improvement in financial means whilst their population grows to the point were there is no food and they are starving to death or sold into the sex slave trade, or worse - genocide.

Dear god woman! Who the hell do you think they got sold into slavery to???? They were fine and dandy til western man decided they needed improving- there is no overpopulation if there is not enough food- who needs financial systems when u can barter for what u need? Genocide?? Who was committing genocide if not over zealous do-gooders intent on making them over and leading them into salvation? What's wrong with people living the way they have lived since their CIVILIZATION developed? If the christians hadn't been so bent on saving everyone the Mayans or the Incas or countless others might even now exist. Sure Western civilization spread - as civilizations do- for better or for worse- but to think that it was all for the best is ludicrous!
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eku Zhong
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Join date: 27 May 2008
Posts: 752
12-24-2008 16:07
From: Avawyn Muircastle
I was referring to some cultures on Africa, and/or on Islands who still live as they did when Jesus of Nazareth walked the Earth, meaning no evolution of their culture, no education, no improvement in financial means whilst their population grows to the point were there is no food and they are starving to death or sold into the sex slave trade, or worse - genocide.

ooooo

Avawyn... you should have quit while you were ahead.. :p

(i hear a great warming up of typing fingers....)





(actually when i stop laughing i might just write a bit about some of the great savage tribes like the egyptians... and the tale of Horus, born of the virgin Isis-Meri on December 25th, Son of the god Osiris, raised by Isis-Meri and step daddy Jo-seph... baptised at 30 by Anup the Baptiser in the river Eridanus (Anup was also later beheaded) ... Horus was taken from the desert of Amenta up a high mountain by his arch-rival Sut where he resisted temptation... His key address was .. :eek: The Sermon on the Mount... he walked on water, cast out demons, healed the sick, restored sight to the blind. He "stilled the sea by his power." Later he was crucified on a hill, accompanied by 2 thieves.. was buried in a tomb... descended into hell and was resurrected after three days..)
Avawyn Muircastle
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Join date: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 528
12-24-2008 16:15
From: eku Zhong
ooooo

Avawyn... you should have quit while you were ahead.. :p

(i hear a great warming up of typing fingers....)





(actually when i stop laughing i might just write a bit about some of the great savage tribes like the egyptians... and the tale of Horus, born of the virgin Isis-Meri on December 25th, Son of the god Osiris, raised by Isis-Meri and step daddy Jo-seph... baptised at 30 by Anup the Baptiser in the river Eridanus (Anup was also later beheaded) ... Horus was taken from the desert of Amenta up a high mountain by his arch-rival Sut where he resisted temptation... His key address was .. :eek: The Sermon on the Mount... he walked on water, cast out demons, healed the sick, restored sight to the blind. He "stilled the sea by his power." Later he was crucified on a hill, accompanied by 2 thieves.. was buried in a tomb... descended into hell and was resurrected after three days..)


According to what? I've heard of Horus born of virgin, and that's why the ancient Romans decided to set that date of December 25th to appease the pagans whom didn't want this date done away with and probably to piss off the Judeo-Christians whom they fed to the lions.

Is humanity getting anywhere yet?
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Brenda Connolly
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12-24-2008 16:18
From: Avawyn Muircastle
According to what? I've heard of Horus born of virgin, and that's why the ancient Romans decided to set that date of December 25th to appease the pagans whom didn't want this date done away with and probably to piss off the Judeo-Christians whom they fed to the lions.

Is humanity getting anywhere yet?


Perhaps not

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ObubKk7WxY
Avawyn Muircastle
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12-24-2008 16:18
From: Amaranthim Talon
Dear god woman! Who the hell do you think they got sold into slavery to???? They were fine and dandy til western man decided they needed improving- there is no overpopulation if there is not enough food- who needs financial systems when u can barter for what u need? Genocide?? Who was committing genocide if not over zealous do-gooders intent on making them over and leading them into salvation? What's wrong with people living the way they have lived since their CIVILIZATION developed? If the christians hadn't been so bent on saving everyone the Mayans or the Incas or countless others might even now exist. Sure Western civilization spread - as civilizations do- for better or for worse- but to think that it was all for the best is ludicrous!


Good grief, not all genocides are by Christians? Haven't you heard of Darfur? :shock: Not to mention Christians and Catholic are probably the only ones helping Darfur!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And Hilter was not Christian. He was a crazed mystic/atheist.
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Brenda Connolly
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12-24-2008 16:23
From: Avawyn Muircastle
Good grief, not all genocides are by Christians? Haven't you heard of Darfur? :shock:

And Hilter was not Christian. He was a crazed mystic/atheist.



Mein Gott in Himmel!!!

http://www.nobeliefs.com/hitler.htm

From: someone

"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.


-Adolf Hitler, in a speech on 12 April 1922 (Norman H. Baynes, ed. The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, pp. 19-20, Oxford University Press, 1942)
Alisha Matova
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12-24-2008 16:23
That's just current news. You have to admit the Crusades were a blast!!! =P



edit: /me runs away, not entirely noticing the "depth" of this conversation before butting in.

*waves* Happy Holidays!!
Avawyn Muircastle
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12-24-2008 16:27
And can Popes be both good and bad people? Yes of course. But that doesn't mean I agree that Popes have a right to dictate from the chair things that aren't in scripture or things that if they were important I believe the Apostles would have written about it rather than a Pope deciding something some 1950 years later for an example. Does this mean they are bad people, no. Catholics do a lot of good in this world. My point was that they caused the schism that can never be breached in the Middle Ages by declaring those who do not believe in the apocrypha as anathema (excommunicated).
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eku Zhong
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Join date: 27 May 2008
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12-24-2008 16:33
From: Avawyn Muircastle
According to what? I've heard of Horus born of virgin, and that's why the ancient Romans decided to set that date of December 25th to appease the pagans whom didn't want this date done away with and probably to piss off the Judeo-Christians whom they fed to the lions.

Is humanity getting anywhere yet?

there are so many other religions with parallel stories to that of Jesus Christ.... most ppl who are fairly well read and have an interest in anthropology and history are pretty much aware of it, and take it in their stride.

I am not anti-christian, and dont want to get into a theological war here.
Religion (of any kind) has its place in all societies as a moral code for ppl to live by and has been used over the centuries for that purpose as well as a political tool for controlling the populace.. and for many, many other reasons.

but what got me going was your (um .. how can I put this politely.. :p ) attitude of ignorant smugness that western civilization and christianity did the rest of us savages a favour...
but since then you have carried on putting your foot more firmly down your gullet... and i have brewed some fresh coffee.. and settled in to see what comes out of all this... :D
Avawyn Muircastle
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Join date: 24 Jul 2008
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12-24-2008 16:34
Posted by Brenda regarding what Hilter said:

"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.


__________________________________________________

The above is bizarre because that totally contradicts Hitler's purpose to breed a perfected Aryan race, doesn't it? Nor does it explain why Hitler killed those with handicaps and disabilities also as a Christians doctrine revolves around helping the blind and the lame and the sick not killing them. Not to mention why Hilter wanted all blacks and gypsies in Poland killed too.
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Jojogirl Bailey
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12-24-2008 16:40
I have to admit to only having read the last few pages of this thread but i literally have bene sitting here with my mouth hanging open....just a few points...

As recently as the turn of the century, Irish in Boston were so completely discriminated against that there were literally signs in shops - Irish Need Not Apply. They were relegated to certain neighborhoods and treated as inferior. The fact that Boston got an Irish mayor who was Rose Kennedy's father or grandfather was a HUGE step to changing this. This was a very real and very rampant way of thinking and the things another posted mentioned about it are in fact quite true.

As for all the religious discussion...is anyone who is reporting here actually a religion expert?? Like having studied academically to understand that much of what has been stated is theory and not hard facts of why Dec 25 was chosen etc? There are as many theories about all of this as there are people who think them, but there are theories that are more accepted than others. But unless someone here has actually spoken to the ancient Romans, Greeks or Hebrews, best to preface all of this with the word "theory."

There is no religious document that "proves" much of anything...that is why we have so many different interpretations and so many religions. And for me a sure sign of anyone who does not really know what they are talking about is when they make statements of truth with info that is based on belief or is totally theoretical.

As for Hitler...stop trying to make his rantings make sense...he was nutty. LOL
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Avawyn Muircastle
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12-24-2008 16:41
From: eku Zhong
there are so many other religions with parallel stories to that of Jesus Christ.... most ppl who are fairly well read and have an interest in anthropology and history are pretty much aware of it, and take it in their stride.

I am not anti-christian, and dont want to get into a theological war here.
Religion (of any kind) has its place in all societies as a moral code for ppl to live by and has been used over the centuries for that purpose as well as a political tool for controlling the populace.. and for many, many other reasons.

but what got me going was your (um .. how can I put this politely.. :p ) attitude of ignorant smugness that western civilization and christianity did the rest of us savages a favour...
but since then you have carried on putting your foot more firmly down your gullet... and i have brewed some fresh coffee.. and settled in to see what comes out of all this... :D


I know this. A lot of ancient cultures had sacrifices of virgins also. This doesn't stop me from being a Christian and believing in God's perfect plan of salvation.
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eku Zhong
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12-24-2008 16:41
From: Avawyn Muircastle


The above is bizarre because that totally contradicts Hitler's purpose to breed a perfected Aryan race, doesn't it? Nor does it explain why Hitler killed those with handicaps and disabilities also as a Christians doctrine revolves around helping the blind and the lame and the sick not killing them. Not to mention why Hilter wanted all blacks and gypsies in Poland killed too.


probably for the same reasons Jesus is portrayed as



rather than

Brenda Connolly
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12-24-2008 16:53
From: Jojogirl Bailey

As for Hitler...stop trying to make his rantings make sense...he was nutty. LOL


Of course. But inside the rantings of a Meglomaniac are shreds of truth and lucidity. That is how they get to be a meglomaniac as opposed to just a random loony.
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