temp prim rezzers zapped?

Yeah, read on Argent, lol I got it wrong and was working on old info

It looks like I got sucked in with this one.

I have a few temp rezzers that I use for the express purpose of managing my available prims. However, the temp rezers I use only rez when somone is present (I realize that the script is polling continuously to do this though). For my purposes, I really wouldn't care if the objects were rezzed temp or permanent, only that they were not there if no one was in the immediate area (as I have low usage and traffic on my parcel and I am rezzing sectioned environments). Is anyone selling a product that will do this?

Also, having no idea how the server side uses resources with objects I have the following question:

If I have 20 of the same objects on the same parcel, how are the resources allocated to those objects? Is it 20 objects with 20 differnt sets of parameters, or is there some way to make it one object with 20 different sets of parameters (ie multiple location references for the same simple static object) to save resources?

For example, I have a large hall with 20 sconce lights, each being 5 prims = 100 Prims. It would be really nice to have the first one count as a full prim, and the rest maybe as half prim so that it worked out to be an array of 53 prims or something along those lines. Anyone know if this is possible at the server level, is it allready being done, or is there just too much overhead to make it feasable?

That must have been 2003. There was already a prim reserve for temp prims and vehicles when I joined in 2005... the prim limit on a 15,000 prim sim was actually more like 16,500 with the reserve.

There are roads where the speed limit is posted only as "reasonable". You can still get a speeding ticket on those roads.

It's always 20 separate objects. SL doesn't support instances.

And using 20 temp rezzers in a parcel strikes me as being a wee bit close to the "abusive" end for my taste.You could see if you can link them all together (that will depend on link distance and size) so you only need to rez one object for all 20 lights... but personally I'd consider getting some lights that require fewer prims.

Thanks for the reply Argent.

Sorry, I must not have been unclear. I have three of four temp rezzers, each re-rezzing 4 or 5 objects, with the exception of the one that rezzes the 20 sconce lights. I haven't noticed any major lag but you do notice something when I first wake the rezzers on arrival, which could be annoying others so I will get rid of them.

This is on my mainland holdings, which sees very little usuage and traffic and I have increased my holdings to get a reasonable amount of free prims. But in any case - yes, I agree, this is abusive and I'll get rid of the temp rezzers or ask the creator if they can remove the loop and rez permanent objects and tear them down when no avs are present.

I guess there is no way to know if instances will ever be implimented?

It's not the number of rezzer scripts that really matters, it's the number of linksets and prims that they rez... whether you have one script rezzing 20 linksets or 20 scripts rezzing 20 linksets, the impact is the same.

I'm not sure they can be cleanly implemented in the SL architecture. You might want to create a JIRA asking for them and see what the techies who follow the JIRA come up with.

Thanks for setting me straight and for the info.

Z

No. It was as I said, up until sometime last year. It may have been as you described sometime in the distant past, but last year temp prims counted against the sim's 15,000, and then they changed it so that they are now over and above the 15,000.

The problem with this is that it's only your opinion and has nothing to do with the Storyof's statement, except as an opinion. Other people's opinions differ, but at least other people have good grounds to differ, whereas you have no grounds for that opinion, other than you wish it were so.

Two years ago, before the "big fix", there was a 1500 prim reserve for temp prims, vehicles, and the like. It sounds like one of the many things they broke in the temp rez fix was to eliminate that reserve. They are still not properly applying the (restored) reserve to vehicles.

Spoken as a true botfarmer.

Purlease! I do not farm bots. I farm avatars. I hatch them for LL in my incubator - for when new users register. Where do you think new avatars come from? They don't grow on trees, you know.

Do temp rezzers affect the asset server or the network?
I haven't used them, but for some reason I thought that
they didn't actually touch the asset server (or hence the
network). And if it's your own sim?

Is this something that can also affect nearby sims?

I know that temp-rezzers can cause problems, but it would
be nice to have some more concrete information about them,
and about how to monitor/manage them. Perhaps an easy
way to locate them would be useful, too, rather than just
guessing there might be some on the sim, somewhere,
from watching some time dilation / objects stats flunctuate.

Details, details...

This has been found not to be the case in a court of law, in at least one instance.

Not all contracts are legal.

Just sayin...

Legal or not, what that guy who sued LL was doing was definitely unfair and unethical.

Indeed. But what's relevant is that the judge said those things about Linden Lab.

LL is not the only service provider whose contract seems to say,
"we can unilaterally do anything we want in this relationship",
and they're not the only ones who've been in court over it.
But every case is fact specific, and things are a lot more
complex than some people's "TOS thrown out" summaries
that were flying around in that instance.

If you don't care about whether you're doing something unethical.

And regardless of the TOS, ripping off the auction queue is unethical.

Even if the judge declared it legal, it's unethical.

And that's *always* relevant.

This is a very good question, and I've never seen a comprehensive answer. But I think there must be some network, neighboring sim, and central services activity when a temp prim is rezzed, because it definitely gets a fresh UUID, and it's a perfectly valid prim on all neighboring sims for however long it lives. (Unless it's taken into Inventory, I don't think it should hit the asset cluster, but as for other central services, I'm just speculating; whence come freshly-minted UUIDs? )

Watching the object stats is probably the easiest way to tell if a sim (or parcel) has a rezzer. Finding the things can be arbitrarily tricky, though. Sometimes it helps to use Advanced / Show Updates; that reveals a lot of other laggy stuff going on, too, which could be a plus or a minus, depending on whether one is tracking lag, or temp prims, specifically.

It does affect the asset server the same way as rezzing from inventory does. It is all about degrees and common sense. No one would think anything about going to the Blake Sea and rezzing a 200+ prim sail boat and sailing around for a few hours (I do this), but only a fool thinks that it is alright to stand in the same spot and rez that same sail boat every 50 seconds, again and again, 24 hours per day. Unfortunately there are fools around and they will even want to argue that there is no rule in the TOS stating that you can't stand there and rez that sail boat again and again, forever and forever.

Come on people, use a little common sense!

I had thought that if an object has other discrete objects in its Contents, then those contents are stored in the asset servers. If that is so, then every rezz would drag the prims, textures and scripts from the asset servers. However, it could be that the details are stored entirely by the sim.

Whatever about the system storage location, the impact on the sim and on neighbouring sims would be the same as for rezzing any object.
Loop-rezzers have a double-whammy in this respect.
In order to avoid blinking in whatever time lapse between the temp poofing and the next rezz, they rezz the next incarnation before the previous one dies. Avatars inthe vicinity hae to process double the load, sucking the data from the sim over the network. THey get a brand new object to see every rezz interval.
Each incarnation is a brand new object that just appeared in the sim. They are not multi-instances of the same thing.

Oh, yes of course! The rezzed object has to *come from* somewhere when it's rezzed from the scripted object's inventory. Duh. Sorry to have overlooked the obvious.

What is blindingly obvious, is that the Lindens did not create an entire object type as they were engineering, programming and developing a virtual world, exclusively for "ammo".

A "physical object that might escape to somewhere unknown" ? In case "some script went out of control" ? These are computers using math, not the Twilight Zone where strange and mysterious things happen in a mystical world. You are thinking they are helpless in it, unable to predict unknown places and unsure of how a script may work ? I dunno, doesn't make sense to me.

Like I said, they make the rules, not you, nor I, and until they say what a rule is you cannot know it. Your speculation of intent is just speculation of intent. Therefore it's ok to rezz right up to the max ? Well I dunno, are they bullets in a war sim, or should they be counting their arrows to use your example ?

I developed a non-temp demo rezzer system, and what I noticed is that the sim seems to cache the objects in a rezzer for a certain amount of time. The FIRST time the rezzer rezzes its contents, there is noticeable hit in time dilation as each object is rezzed that is proportional to the number of prims and scripts with on_rez events the object contains. There is also a noticeable increase in the Pending Downloads that seems to depend on traffic internal to SL - maybe that is the asset server to sim data, I don't know, but it slows down the rez process because the sim is busy downloading something. Subsequent rerezzes still cause some time dilation hits but no Pending Downloads problems and rez faster than the first time.

Looking at the Statistics Bar is one way to see how any rezzer is affecting the sim performance, but it does not update as fast as an object can rez its contents which is 1 object every 0.1 seconds. The Statistics Bar I think updates every 1 seconds. With scripts, at least time dilation can be monitored and I incorporated configurable thresholds in the rezzer to throttle the rez if the sim drops below a configurable time dilation and wait until it recovers or if the rezzer is rezzing too fast for its own good. This is checked before each object is rezzed and seems to work well. The only best way to see time dilation performance is with scripts.

So, there are many things that can be done for a static rezzer to make it sim friendly and reduce lag. But TEMP REZZERS as we are talking about tend to spit out the contents in a timed loop as fast as possible with no regard to sim performance. I guess they have to in order to prevent the appearance of a building flashing in and out of view. I never liked them and once had a neighbor who used them for about 500 prims for his shop! I could see the dilation spike every time it rerezzed and if I was walking around, I would stall every time it rerezzed, but when Lindens looked at it, they said it was my butterfly rocks! They finally moved and the temp rezzers went away and so did those periodic lag spikes.

Another consideration of any static or temp rezzer is the contents they rez, especially if they have lots of scripts that reset upon rez. This will cause performance hits in sim Script Time, which can cause problems if it goes too high.

Not directly related but sorta related, Andrew Linden just posted about temp prim limits.

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