Gender stereotypes in SL: "Real" women
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samatha Congrejo
Registered User
Join date: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 188
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05-25-2009 17:13
From: Pserendipity Daniels /me slams his heels to attention at the behest of the Phorum Pleece.
Pep (Why is it that it is the worst offenders who claim that spelling and grammar are not important in presenting cogent arguments and views? Funny that . . . ) Surely you can argue your views without personal attacks on the others posting in the forums, I would hope. If not, then I am afraid you have missed the whole point of Second Life and these forums. |
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Melita Magic
On my own terms.
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,253
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05-25-2009 17:15
From: Pserendipity Daniels He's obviously not a real man then.  Pep (Probably drives a Prius too) I beg to differ. No, no Prius. Lol. |
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Monalisa Robbiani
Registered User
Join date: 9 Jul 2007
Posts: 861
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05-25-2009 17:19
From: Pserendipity Daniels The International Forums are here actually. It says so on the heading. SL is by definition an international venue. Expect people with English as their second and third language to be there. Deal with it. If you can't mute. From: someone And by having errors pointed out so you can know when you have made mistakes. If you corrected mistakes by IM it would make you actually look helpful. Praise in public, criticize in private. From: someone The same applies when EFLers present posts in a flawed fashion, so don't feel singled out. I don't. Actually I am honored that you still haven't muted me. That means my English cannot be that bad. *lol*
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 Dances, animations, furniture for Loco Pocos Tiny Avatars. Group dances, circle dances. Sculpted neko furniture. Prefabs, mediterranean styled beach houses. http://slurl.com/secondlife/Inochi%20Island/201/225/21
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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05-25-2009 17:20
From: samatha Congrejo Surely you can argue your views without personal attacks on the others posting in the forums, I would hope.
If not, then I am afraid you have missed the whole point of Second Life and these forums. Perhaps (since it appears from your posts that English may not be your first language) you are having trouble in comprehending that I criticise posts not posters . . . Pep ( . . . and *that* is what the forums are about; please don't bring Second Life inworld into your posts until you have any sort of basis for criticising my behaviour there.)
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Virrginia Tombola
Equestrienne
Join date: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 938
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05-25-2009 17:20
From: Briana Dawson
In 2003-2005 this was common in world with certain preconceived ideas like:
- Real women cannot build
- Real women cannot script
- Real women are not furries or neko's
- Real women cannot be tech savvy
Oh, for goodness sakes...  (from http://www.girlscantwhat.com/) Hey, all you out there who believe this (not Briana, who is just reporting), welcome to the 21st century. Somewhere, Ada Lovelace is looking up from her work with an incredibly annoyed expression on her face. But, yes, that attitude is out there. I admit, I never wrote a line of code until I started playing SL. Why? I honestly couldn't tell you. I wasn't discouraged from computer stuff, but I wasn't *encouraged* either. Two odd years of LSL, and I find myself scripting all the time. No, I'm not anywhere near the skill level of the pros, but if I'd started back in the day, could I have been? I don't know. *shrug* Well, anyway, I'm currently in the middle of a career switch into graphic design, which according to some is an appropriately girlish field. But I'm trying to focus on 3D modeling, which according to some is more for the boys. Keeping track of stereotypes is so darned hard, isn't it? Perhaps it's best if we just don't 
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 Horses, Carriages, Modern and Historical Riding apparel. Ride a demo horse, play whist, or just loiter. I'm fair used to loiterers. http://slurl.com/secondlife/Caledon%20Eyre/48%20/183/23/
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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05-25-2009 17:26
From: Monalisa Robbiani SL is by definition an international venue. Expect people with English as their second and third language to be there. Deal with it. If you can't mute. I deal with it. If posts are badly presented I comment as such, whatever the posters nationality. From: Monalisa Robbiani If you corrected mistakes by IM it would make you actually look helpful. Praise in public, criticize in private. My private tuition rates are £100 an hour; payable in advance. From: Monalisa Robbiani I don't. Actually I am honored that you still haven't muted me. That means my English cannot be that bad. *lol* You mute people inworld. Here in the forums you can only put them on ignore. But if you do you won't know when they are laughing at you. Pep (I don't ignore or mute anyone.)
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Hypocrite lecteur, — mon semblable, — mon frère!
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Weston Graves
Werebeagle
Join date: 24 Mar 2007
Posts: 2,059
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05-25-2009 18:09
Okay - let's debunk some male stereotypes:
1. I enjoy some interior design. This is probably because I am (or at least have been) an illustrator. Designing an environment isn't all that different from designing a two dimensional space, so there must be some crossover interest.
2. I cannot abide sports. Even the Olympics are Greek to me, though I might briefly enjoy watching something graceful like ice skating or gymnastics.
3. I am rather bored with action movies and don't mind romance as a plot element. (This however does not mean I would sit through one of those "heartwarming" Lifetime channel monstrosities in which someone dies for an hour and a half.)
4. I actually enjoy shopping. I do however HATE trying on clothes.
5. I couldn't tell you where anything is under the hood of a car - and I do mean anything. I can just manage to check the oil, but that's about it.
6. I almost like to dance, but I'm not quite there yet. I do flail about my living room (yes it's not a basement) to music for exercise, though the music is closer to Gene Simmons than to Richard Simmons.
For the record I am fully hetero and have never been anywhere near the proverbial closet. I think most women are the epitome of creation. Forget Mars and Venus. Men are from Earth. Women are from Heaven.
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Goodbye for now from human Weston, beagle Weston, and Keyboard Guy.  Best of both lives to you all. 
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samatha Congrejo
Registered User
Join date: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 188
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05-25-2009 18:19
From: Pserendipity Daniels Perhaps (since it appears from your posts that English may not be your first language) you are having trouble in comprehending that I criticise posts not posters . . .
Pep ( . . . and *that* is what the forums are about; please don't bring Second Life inworld into your posts until you have any sort of basis for criticising my behaviour there.) No sorry you are critcising the posters, their spelling etc. Not the ideas or the views. That is not what the forums are about. Second life is what these forums are all about, if you fail to see that, then why are you here? |
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Bree Giffen
♥♣♦♠ Furrtune Hunter ♠♦♣♥
Join date: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 2,715
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05-25-2009 18:23
Haha! Pep is an awesome troller... hook and reel em in! Do you catch and release Pep?
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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05-25-2009 18:26
From: samatha Congrejo No sorry you are critcising the posters, their spelling etc. Not the ideas or the views. That is not what the forums are about. Second life is what these forums are all about, if you fail to see that, then why are you here? Your post (not you), as far as I can understand it, expresses entirely invalid opinions. Pep (My inworld persona is *not* my forum persona; you have no basis nor right to comment on it at all.)
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Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
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05-25-2009 18:27
From: Bree Giffen Haha! Pep is an awesome troller... hook and reel em in! Do you catch and release Pep? Not trolling! Pep (Can I help it if they throw themselves in the keepnet?)
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Hypocrite lecteur, — mon semblable, — mon frère!
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
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05-25-2009 18:34
From: Monalisa Robbiani uses linux (I am still to meet ONE SINGLE woman who uses linux) I have met several who use FreeBSD. Including the fourth figure in the following spoof:  Pretty sure it's the same one, she was wearing that costume at a UNIX convention party. |
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Briana Dawson
Attach to Mouth
Join date: 23 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,855
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05-25-2009 18:34
From: Weston Graves
I think most women are the epitome of creation. Forget Mars and Venus. Men are from Earth. Women are from Heaven.
<3 |
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Ian Nider
Seeds
Join date: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 1,011
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05-25-2009 18:53
From: Briana Dawson What sort of gender stereotypes do you ascribe to if any at all?
It seems that there is an attitude among certain male posters in this forum that if one "claims" to be female, and yet believes "A, B, or C", then she is clearly male and a poseur.
In 2003-2005 this was common in world with certain preconceived ideas like:
- Real women cannot build
- Real women cannot script
- Real women are not furries or neko's
- Real women cannot be tech savvy
Recently, I have seen people say things like:
- Real women do not like "X" sexual activity(ies)
- Real women do not seek out sex
- Real women do not watch porn
- Real women are not attracted to violent sexual activites/RP (in varying degrees)
- Real women WILL voice or cam verify
- Real women do not carry weapons
- Real women are not violent
- Real women do not like Anime
- Real women do not use Anime emoticons
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What do you all think of these sort of stereotypes?
Do any of them hold a sliver of truth to them?
Do any of them have truth to them in the year 2009?
Do you believe in any of these? Or have you once believed in any of these? If so, which one(s) and why? I've never believed any of them online or in real life, I know chicks that like and do it all and have done in all my 20 years as an adult.
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Playin' Perky Pat
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Ian Nider
Seeds
Join date: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 1,011
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05-25-2009 19:05
From: Weston Graves Okay - let's debunk some male stereotypes:
1. I enjoy some interior design. This is probably because I am (or at least have been) an illustrator. Designing an environment isn't all that different from designing a two dimensional space, so there must be some crossover interest.
2. I cannot abide sports. Even the Olympics are Greek to me, though I might briefly enjoy watching something graceful like ice skating or gymnastics.
3. I am rather bored with action movies and don't mind romance as a plot element. (This however does not mean I would sit through one of those "heartwarming" Lifetime channel monstrosities in which someone dies for an hour and a half.)
4. I actually enjoy shopping. I do however HATE trying on clothes.
5. I couldn't tell you where anything is under the hood of a car - and I do mean anything. I can just manage to check the oil, but that's about it.
6. I almost like to dance, but I'm not quite there yet. I do flail about my living room (yes it's not a basement) to music for exercise, though the music is closer to Gene Simmons than to Richard Simmons.
For the record I am fully hetero and have never been anywhere near the proverbial closet. I think most women are the epitome of creation. Forget Mars and Venus. Men are from Earth. Women are from Heaven. I love a beer and women and being outdoors, but can also cook, hate sport and love art too. People are just people these days, there's less holding them in type than there used to be.
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Playin' Perky Pat
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
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05-25-2009 19:39
i think it is a mistake to completely dismiss stereotypes. the do not evolve in a vacuum after all. i do believe that amongst the sl tech/geek crowd there is a higher percentage of 'female impostors', just as there is in the hardcore xxx crowd.
that isnt to say the majority of female avs are impostors, but i have no doubt their number is significant.
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pro-life? gtfo! slu- banning opposing opinions one at a time
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learn to shut up and nod in agreement... or be banned!
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/off-topic/1239-americans-not-stupid.html
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Jesse Barnett
500,000 scoville units
Join date: 21 May 2006
Posts: 4,160
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05-25-2009 19:54
From: Nina Stepford i do believe that amongst the sl tech/geek crowd there is a higher percentage of 'female impostors', just as there is in the hardcore xxx crowd. Don't know what you are basing that on except for maybe a gut feeling. There has been a tremendous surge of females in the tech fields in the last 15 years. It is also about a 50/50 mixture in gaming. After fighting for my rightful place for decades in fields that thought men were better at technical stuff then women, it sucks to hear the same, misguided crap here. EDIT: As an aside, interestingly enough, now all 3 technical/design positions in our company are all female now.
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I (who is a she not a he) reserve the right to exercise selective comprehension of the OP's question at anytime. From: someone I am still around, just no longer here. See you across the aisle. Hope LL burns in hell for archiving this forum
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
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05-25-2009 19:58
one doesnt need to be a guy to see male stereotypes any more than one needs to be a minority to spot racial stereotypes. male sl/rl stereotypes: sl- they rarely change clothes sl- favours women with beachball-sized breasts and pencil-legs sl- thinks about cybersex a lot sl- is willing to cam/voice sl/rl- lack taste and/or refinement (unless gay) sl/rl- have little appreciation for art or culture (unless gay) rl- cannot cook (despite nearly every kitchen ive ever worked in being male dominated) rl- are domestically helpless, unable/unwilling to clean, do laundry, etc. there are just as many male stereotypes in life. but unlike 'strong' gender redefining women, stereotype-breaking tendencies in males is often ascribed to repressed homosexuality or weakness. i reckon men dont have it any better. From: Melita Magic ^ I'd like to know what the guys think are unfair stereotypes of them (RL and SL/online) too. I wouldn't know or hazard a guess, I'm not a guy! And I don't ask my brother these things. ^
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SLU - ban em then bash em!
~~GREATEST HITS~~
pro-life? gtfo! slu- banning opposing opinions one at a time
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/zomgwtfbbqgtfololcats/15428-disingenuous.html
learn to shut up and nod in agreement... or be banned!
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/off-topic/1239-americans-not-stupid.html
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
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05-25-2009 20:03
of course there has been an upswing in the number of women in those positions. in the west at least, the inverse is true in other parts of the world. i base my view on my experiences on the grid. i am not claiming that it is a hard rule, i do build, script, and texture afterall. From: Jesse Barnett Don't know what you are basing that on except for maybe a gut feeling. There has been a tremendous surge of females in the tech fields in the last 15 years. It is also about a 50/50 mixture in gaming. After fighting for my rightful place for decades in fields that thought men were better at technical stuff then women, it sucks to hear the same, misguided crap here.
EDIT: As an aside, interestingly enough, now all 3 technical/design positions in our company are all female now.
_____________________
SLU - ban em then bash em!
~~GREATEST HITS~~
pro-life? gtfo! slu- banning opposing opinions one at a time
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/zomgwtfbbqgtfololcats/15428-disingenuous.html
learn to shut up and nod in agreement... or be banned!
http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/off-topic/1239-americans-not-stupid.html
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Kira Welty
Registered User
Join date: 15 Aug 2008
Posts: 125
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05-25-2009 20:53
Boys always have to be right. Good men are always wrong.
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Safe, Sane & Consensual ~♥~ Live and Let Live
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Oryx Tempel
Registered User
Join date: 8 Nov 2006
Posts: 7,663
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05-25-2009 21:00
A stereotype that I find hilarious: If you are a woman, you most probably know what this is:  |
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Weston Graves
Werebeagle
Join date: 24 Mar 2007
Posts: 2,059
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05-25-2009 21:05
From: Oryx Tempel A stereotype that I find hilarious:
If you are a woman, you most probably know what this is:
Lol! Well I'm a man and I know it's not as clinical as it looks. Though I can't remember where in the world I ever saw one. I think an elderly relative had one of those. |
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Jesse Barnett
500,000 scoville units
Join date: 21 May 2006
Posts: 4,160
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05-25-2009 21:11
From: Oryx Tempel A stereotype that I find hilarious: If you are a woman, you most probably know what this is: Toe nail clippers?
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I (who is a she not a he) reserve the right to exercise selective comprehension of the OP's question at anytime. From: someone I am still around, just no longer here. See you across the aisle. Hope LL burns in hell for archiving this forum
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Katheryne Helendale
(loading...)
Join date: 5 Jun 2008
Posts: 2,187
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05-25-2009 21:13
From: Monalisa Robbiani - uses linux (I am still to meet ONE SINGLE woman who uses linux) Just because you haven't met one personally does not mean we don't exist.  From: someone - says "I separate SL and RL, and don't you even DARE to ask me anything about my RL!" in their profile While I don't shy away from RL discussions, I play SL to escape reality, not extend it. If that marks me as one-of-a-kind, then so be it. From: someone - never uses voice and when asked why doesn't say "I don't use it" but uses excuses like "mic won't work" A lot of people don't take "no" for an answer - guys mainly, but women too. It is far easier to just tell them that I don't own a mic or that it doesn't work than to get into an argument over why I don't want to use voice. From: someone - their avatar has unnatural over-gendered proportions and looks like it's inflatable Agreed there. From: someone - they very rarely change their outfit if at all (a SURE sign!! lol) Definitely agreed there. I don't think I've seen my SL hubby in more than three different outfits in the entire time I've known him! From: someone - they talk lots and LOTS about PC games when asked (very useful trap *lol*) Wouldn't that kinda depend on the game? I could really talk your ear off about The Sims! From: someone - intimate knowledge of PC hardware, prices, setup, technical issues, knows their video card model without looking it up etc. There aren't many women interested in that kind of stuff.
- scripter (I don't know any female, good scripters out there. However I tend to disagree about building/other graphics design. Many females do that.) Same flawed assumption as the Linux statement. Just because you don't know any personally doesn't mean we don't exist. Some of us grow rather tired of the "blonde, barefoot, pregnant, technically stupid, and belongs in the kitchen" cliches. From: someone - if you are lucky they slip in theit language use, like "hey ladies" when entering a female crowd  Many languages also make a difference in male and female usage of verbs and adjectives (like Italiano vs Italiana). It is VERY hard to fake your gender when writing in those languages. So many guys slip. *lol* Yep - this one will get'cha! A lot of guys will overcompensate, and sound really, really ridiculous! From: someone I have been accused of being a guy a few times. There was this one idiot saying "you can't be a woman, your reasoning is too logical". To straighten in out, I muted him. *G* *HI5!* |
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Derbor Torok
Lost soul
Join date: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 1,016
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05-25-2009 21:27
From: Oryx Tempel A stereotype that I find hilarious: If you are a woman, you most probably know what this is: Eyelash curlers? I am not a woman and I knew before I read the url.. .d |
