Teens on the Main Grid: pre-emptive discussions

Yes Void that is where it begins but where does it end.

For instance, some parent objecting to their kid running into someone with a tag to a group whose activities they disapprove of on a 'moral basis' or even that the group exists within SL. (Like various gay rights or activism groups for instance. Remember Falwell objecting to tinky winky carrying a purse?)

One way people will try to keep their activities and friends and social circles would be to make their own groups. And just meet in private homes. Like a '70s key party all over again. Lol.

i thought the 70's were suppose to be the wild times..like the sexual revolution and all that..
i always here older people talking about disco days and how they went out to have sex and dance and things like sex just used to fall out of trees on them lol

Sexual revolution as well as a LOT of backlash once the Establishment got a good look.

my dad said rock was still getting crap from christians..i guess that was when the whole stairway to heaven led zepplin thing happened with playing the records backwards..

Like why go after LedZepplin when they had ozzie??
probably Cause Ozzie would have said something like..Damn right ya FFFFreakin bostods you can hear the same thing if you play mine forward lol

that's where it ends too... that's really all the law requires of LL, past that it's up to the parents to decide if it's allowable for their children. their recourse is to prevent access, or not.

Just the way it should be, IMHO. The fact that a large percentage of parents would fail a test if they had to pass one to become parents in the first place should have little else to do with the issue.

You forget: This is the USA. Sex is "bad". Violence is "good".

We cant let lil' Jimmy see a nipple, but we can let him watch some guy be eviscerated.

My point was regarding 'parental pressure.'

For instance if teens came into SL tomorrow, parents could *already* sit beside them during their SL time, or could *already* order them to stay away from mature parcels. But some balk at the mere *presence* or *possibility* junior might see something bad, and so, censor the entire grid.

What's to stop some watchgroup from doing the same to gay content, religion, politics, or any other thing. Note how some are gleeful about this current change because they 'hate smut'. If they hate smut, don't teleport to it, seems more reasonable than enforcing one's mores onto everyone. What will they hate next, and what then.

I understood your point, mine is different... what's to stop them? Law. LL is only going to conform to that level... it's not really in their interest past that

@ Void: Law against special interest groups pressuring or boycotting to remove 'certain content' they deem offensive? Where is such a law?

I think you missed my main point which is that LL seems to have already bowed to such pressure. Otherwise why the huge forced march to adultland? One of the arguments being made by some in favor of the changes, is that "some people do not want to see 'smut'." So it sounds like it's one reason behind this - group A finds category B, C, and D offensive, therefore push it over there.

However what LL's full logic is - we are not privy to. And, I doubt we will be, at least officially. Tell me why you think the changes are happening then, if not 'pressure'? (Real or perceived.) (And marketing yes but who to?)

A private corporation can do what it wants. LL could completely pasteurise SL tomorrow if they wanted to. No law against that, Void.

I personally think they will merge it all, and we have a lot of children walking around.
The problem with that is only a problem if you can't see if they indeed are children.

Because right now any child can lie about their age and join as an adult. Soon they can still do that unless there is a good working age check.

And then place a beacon on their heads that says, "don't sex me" or something.

As for their annoying, childish, possible behavior? lol
I had to deal with adults acting even worse. So I only see improvement, and a gold plated mute button, that allows you to auto mute any minor by default.

Would that work?

Surely, the predators will be looking for that beacon around every corner. And, instead of going for the Mute button, they'll be going for the IM button. (T_T)

I've said it before. I don't care if kiddies have access to teh pr0nz. In my eyes, that's a meaningless and unimportant issue. It's who has access to the kids that gives me the chills. (>_<

Right now.... People want to see the kids away from pixel sex. Teen grid does that.

Right now.... People want to see the predators away from the kids. Teen grid does that.

Right now.... The Lindens are saying they WANT to merge the grids but have NO PLANS to. Can we take them for their word considering how much they have to lose if they're bluffing? (T_T)

Yes, and real life predators know where the real life playgrounds are. And so do the parents, and their 12 gauge rifles.

Also, they WANT to merge it, and they are the only ones really having power over what they want. Linden Labs rarely looks at what their customers want, and having no plans doesn't mean they still do it. They just have no thoughts, no KEEN plans, and no preparation. They just push a button, and when the smoke clears they decide whether it was a good idea or not.

Sure most adults have no business with minors, and second life should be a nice escape from them. Being a child avatar myself, currently has near to nothing requests from any adult regarding sex.

Sure they're out there, but they know I'm not a child, and thus they shut up.
But when I change into my other adult avatar I get loaded with nasty IM's

That's why I use a child avatar that's cute and fun to look at. I could also change into the freebie Darth vader avatar. That should keep the hornies away.

So we don't want beacons on children, but then how are adults going to know whether they are making sex requests to a child or not?

Appearance means nothing in SL. It's the person behind it that is most important.

So Linden Labs should just leave the grid like it is now. no kids around me, and no adults around the kids. perfect solution.

We need a way to prevent them from entering our land Without having to move to the naughty continent.
Sometime you dont want kids around even if you arn't doing anything "adult"

So we adults will only be safe in the porn district. that would be too odd to explain to the rest of the world.

But we can retreat to our own lands, where we can ban anything not age verified.

But we miss something here. It's the WHY they WANT to merge the grids.
They want it, have no plans, but still desire it somehow. Why?

Maybe they think they'll make loads of money form the lucrative 13-18 demographic. The additional 600 concurrent users will push SL into the big time. The Brain Slugs told them to.

No, they are hoping that their advertisers will make lots of money selling crap to the kids...and their parents.

Probably. Just look at Habbo Hotel and Gaia online, and other child targeted communities.
They make loads of money off the intellectual inept.

Kind of sad actually to drain children of their money. But Linden Labs is all about making profit. So what other reason than money would they have?

There should be more than selfish moneymaking.

you ASSUME that's the reason, the truth is probably a bit more bland. LL has long regretted it's poor design ideal in sticking PG land next to Mature (adult) land. they get endless complaints from people that don't understand sim borders, and they don't feel it's a great plan to be able to legitimately stick mike's bdsm playground and torture dungeon, next door to wee bits daycare and adoption center. it's about organization so they can avoid hassles.


that may be an argument, but it's not LL's argument, it's somebody else's, and after the fact at that. truth is segregating the areas always made sense, it was just never done in a consistent way. was there any pressue before this move? certainly not from the press. certainly not from the residents, or the users. from potential corporate clients? maybe, be I doubt it, since LL courts them for private islands, not mainland placements. but it might be possible, not having the minutes from those meetings I couldn't say. neither could anyone of us.


organization and good business sense. attract the segment that worried about having to deal with adult content neighbors, and reduce their own load of complaints about the interaction. and that works both ways, mikes bdsm plaground doesn't a child av themed build next door to it either. currently it could be, and it causes paranoia for people, and endless complaints.


nope, but it'd be bad for business. adult content locations pay tier, tier is baseline funding that keeps the grid up, regardless of venture capital. but even farther than that, LL can see in other venues how poorly 'sanitized' worlds do, never mind that the people that frequent, create, and provide locations for it are just as likely to create bad press for them if their wiped out. what the do create is numbers, and a corporation is going to laugh at any of LL's proposals without those numbers. plus we have corporate wage slaves here, in adult areas, which provide word of mouth and casual presence in their companies, and that helps LL's goals. if they get badmouthed by those same employees it hurts LL's cause when talking to those companies.

Now do you see what I mean?

the only time LL has cared about public pressure is when it involved something actually illegal, or a contractual obligation (like casinos and credit companies, and I suspect the banking ban was similarly driven by credit companies, though you only heard about it being and issues of people being defrauded)

If they let teens onto the main grid legally I will log out and haunt these forums until the day they put it back or make an adult only grid that I can port my inventory to. If my year subscription lapses before then well then bye bye SL. That will be in September. I've always held SL in the highest regard. I spend 30-80 hours a week and i spend lots of cash. But there's no way in hell I'm gonna have some teen getting a mean streak and throwing an assault charge on me.
I 'll be sad and mad but at least I won't have the worry. So yeah Merging would totally suck for me personally.

No offense Void but unless you have privy information, you are assuming/speculating just like the majority here are. (I did, though, specify in the part you quoted, that others say it. I never claimed LL said this or that.)

Ya see? Lol.



(Stars added for emphasis)

I'd take more heed of it IF the reasoning had shown up before hand, or IF there was some demonstrable link to LL being pressured into it by a group with enough clout to affect LL. but they've only really had policy reactions to legal and contractual obligations.

after the fact, any supposition that doesn't account for what's gone before is highly suspect. I won't say my assumptions contain any information that isn't available to anyone here, but they do fit the pattern and behavior LL has exhibited in the past.

occam's razor.

Problem is there will be no way to designate who is a teen reliably.

They get in now by committing fraud and identity theft.. that will not change in a merged grid.

What will change is them having the same tools they do in RL to harass and destroy an adult. The fact they can hop onto a proper teen account and file an AR about an adult that booted their fraudulent adult avatar out of an 'adult' venue that gets them banned at best... and at worst facing a knock on the door and being registered as a sex offender (many places are moving to pass laws that don't require a conviction anymore... simply the accusation to get you listed)

A merged grid is never going to be safe for teens/kids... and it will be unsafe for adults too.

After all the same mommy and daddy that buy their kids GTA so they shut up can set up the account for the kid... and do it under their name without thinking about it... and said kid is now an adult as far as the system knows.

A merged grid will be a dead grid within a year, even less if the lawsuits hit first and hard...

The moving of 'adult' content is already got their legal team looking at long nights in the future as people will snap back about lost sales, tier prices if they have to pay for the old land and the new while being moved, possible discrimination based on what they rule as 'adult', etc..

besides. What do almost all teens like to do?

Do whatever their parents say they can't.
Pose like adults.

You played house as a child. You can't deny that.

well FIRST they'd have to be on a fraudulent account, THEN they'd be informing LL that they'd been CORRECTLY booted because of that fraud. since the logs would show an adult account was booted, and not the complaining teen account (which presumably couldn't get there to be booted in the first place)....

if anything, that'd result in a good citizenship award.