Tier fees increased by tax

LL has handled this appallingly badly. Surely a month's notice would have been the right thing to do? And for goodness sake, set up a blog before e-mailing people. They really are the worst I have ever known at communication.

The great pity is that there is no viable alternative to SL. If they had some serious competition then they would have to get their act together, one would hope.

Once again, I don't think anyone's complaining about being charged taxes as such. We're all used to paying VAT.

However, if the relevant EU directive has been in force since 2003, LL has either known about it forever, or they're simply massively clueless when it comes to doing international business. Either way it makes LL look *extremely* bad.

My post is awaiting moderation...

We will see:

"To be fair, I saw the charges implemented on my account page long before I received any email.

Could you tell me what will happen with BFPO addresses as they are VAT exempt. Are your systems in place for that?

Also for all this time as a EU resident I assumed I was already paying tax as by law we need to be know if we are not...

I have no problem in paying what is due... I just feel that we had it sprung on us despite thinking we were already paying it.. but sprung on us with no warning.. this has affected a lot of peoples budget in the sense that the day before they were buying land having no warning this would be sprung...It seems land is being dumped now already.. What a mess."

Yep, 36-48 hours late though...

There's only so much you can sweep under the carpet before the bulge shows

Gomez

I have been watching blog posts being deleted left right and centre regarding the VAT subject, including my own. I guess Orwell's 1984 has arrived, just 23yrs late and in another world. I'd post your blog post across all forums on this subject and at least get your voice heard somewhere.

Posting the blog in the very early hours of the morning in Europe is a master stroke...

But maybe I am too cynical and need to stop moaning!

I would, but don't wat to risk being banned from the forums

Strange that my post on the new VAT blog went straight through though, the other post is still "awaiting moderation"...

Gomez

I have been watching blog posts being deleted left right and centre regarding the VAT subject, including my own. I guess Orwell's 1984 has arrived, just 23yrs late and in another world. I'd post your blog post across all forums on this subject and at least get your voice heard somewhere.

Just did a little bit of working out - if VAT is chargable:

Any EU customer *should* now be billed at (for a full sim) $181.82 + vat (this is $195 less california state sales tax @7.25%) - in the UK, it would be a total of $213.64 - still more than agreed to, but less that what they are trying to claim from us....

If we are still being billed at $195, this means we are still paying US tax (as though we had purchased the item there) and UK/EU VAT (as though we had purchased the item here)... Now, although i'd love to be, I can be in 2 places at once

Gomez

I don't think you are paying US tax as there is no tax here on internet services. I may be wrong though.

Gomez, the problem is unlike EU, the USA have no unified federal sales tax rate, every state has it's own, sooo.....can we assume US residents do not pay sales taxes when dealing with LL? Or tomorrow Lindens will wake up and tell us they've been "absorbing" US sales taxes too?

This has been said a few times already, but you're still missing it. You are NOT being charged California state sales tax. California state sales tax doesn't apply to services, and if it did, it would only apply to people in California. (from a California resident)

The EU doesn't have a 'unified federal sales tax rate' either, as has been stated repeatedly in the thread. Especially since the EU, unlike the US, is simply a loose confederation of sovereign states.

Each EU member state has its own VAT rate.

Only grandfathered islands pay 195. Most European people will be paying a lot more. My own UK island tier is now $295 + 17.5% = $346.625 per month!

Salkin, agree I stand correction, it's been a long day, don't know what I was thinking when typing this... The truth is Lindens delayed the blog post as long as they could and did not actually answered many questions.
I have to get some sleep now, keep on guessing

If anyone seriously wants to continue their business legally as they have and is now affected by the VAT differences, contact me in-world. Just send me an IM, and we can set-up a time to discuss business.

Most comment is already given but still, I am dissapointed and want to expres my anger:

The most disturbing thing is that LL is applying VAT to the existing billing period, having given no notice beforehand. You have increased the price for a service while we already had an agreement about the price. !!

According to EU law, if you didn’t mention excl. VAT, the assumption is that it’s charged. period!

What is next? Oh I know!, all EU residents will sell-off the mainland and start renting American islands. Meaning Mainland prices will drop even more. Maybe that way we can get First-land back into the service?

Now that we are working Under EU laws: can I re-open a casino ?

What about the tax-laws of Netherlands Antilles? Is it EU or US?

Well in the US it's done by state of residence of the purchaser/buyer. So if LL has a presence in your state of residence, then that transaction may be subject to tax, if your state of residence taxes internet services. California, for example, could tax CA residents who purchase from LL in CA, but as I understand it, CA's sales tax does not apply to internet services.

It looks like Prok's interview has been changed to remove the "we've been absorbing it" quote *blinks*.

Taxing of Internet services is not permitted by Federal Law no matter what State you are in. That law is due to Expire in November. Stay tuned........


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Tax_Nondiscrimination_Act

The Internet Tax Nondiscrimination Act, Pub.L. 108-435, is the current U.S. federal law that bans Internet taxes in the United States. Signed into law on December 3, 2004, by President George Bush, it extended until 2007 the then-current moratorium on new and discriminatory taxes on the Internet. It also extended the federal prohibition against state and local Internet access taxes until November 2007.

The law's co-authors were Representative Chris Cox (R-California), Senator George Allen (R-Virginia), and Senator Ron Wyden (D-Oregon).

The law was supported by a congressionally-sponsored study commission known as the Advisory Commission on Electronic Commerce, which studied Internet taxes in 1999 and 2000. The Commission was chaired by then-Virginia Governor James S. Gilmore, III, who led a coalition of Commission members to issue a final report opposing taxation of the Internet and eliminating federal telephone taxes, among other ideas.

Yes I know that, Brenda. My friends downtown tell me it's likely to be extended, but, you never know. If it isn't extended, then we will see what the states will decide to impose.

To be honest, in the UK VAT is 17.5% which is cheaper than some EU countries, thats why so many EU countries and those outside the EU come here and built car plants etc...

The revenues are justifiable when you consider we not only have our own Government to pay for, but also the EU government. A EU MP can earn upto £380,000 pa and claim another £85,000 for a secretary, plus 1st class air fares to the EU from their place of residents, twice a week! Oh, and at the 6 monthly meetings in Genevia, if they take their spouses to the meetings, they get a 'complimentary' £15,000 'spending money' and a chaufer driven car to ferry about the shops while their spouses 'work'. Most EU MP's, buy a 'small' residency close to the meeting places and walk to work. They can also then claim 'expenses' back for such things as 'cleaning, maintenance and assistants (house keepers, butlers and guards)' over an above still gaining their air fares.

With so much Value for money, VAT is quite a low don't you think?

The moratorium will be either extended or made permanent. If they extend it, that would mean all these tax issues will legally be handled case by case and that would be double the effort since it will involve at least two complete different jurisdictions. That can be quite a costly process for most businesses if they extend it. It would be easier to just make it permanent and settle the moratorium.

EU already has a permanent ban on taxes for internet sevices that come from outside of EU.

The US has a law to ship everything through customs except for internet services.

I wouldn't be surprised if a decision is made to extend the moratorium just for the states and permanently ban taxes for internet services outside of the states in the likeness of the EU.

Dear Linden,
Im very very disappointed and lost all my faith in U.
This is not the way U should treat Ur customers.
U have a lot to learn 'bout communication.
Or maybe u accidentally have pushed the mute button,
then right click on ur customers and click unmute!

And to my goverment, stay out of my second life!