"reasonable expectation of privacy"

I usually don't post, but I do read now and then. Elite being my rl bf and partner in sl, I have to speak up on his behalf as to ppl calling him names. In rl he is a very nice, very intelligent, and very sensitive person. He not in the least, creepy! For the ppl calling names and putting ppl down over an opinion post, is very childish. Yes ppl have their opinions to what they think is private. Myself, I do not talk in general voice if I feel what I am going to say might offend others, so I take it to private. Also he is not the one streaming the voice chat. Im sure there is lots of chat spies around doing the same thing. Anyone can add a chat spy to a prim they are wearing. Jesh anything can happen in sl.

I appreciate your candor, Keltee; and I don't think any of the respondents here arrived at this thread with the intention of starting a flamewar. The big problem here, is that your bf did not post like an an uninvolved third party just asking a question, and he flat-out refused to listen to anyone else's point of view. He may be a wonderful man in RL, and I don't dispute that. But here, on these forums, he's earned himself a really bad reputation.

What is wrong is that Linden Labs makes privacy so expensive. As for the rest of your message, let me direct you again to the Wikipedia page on the "Tu Quoque" fallacy. Camming on avatars when they're changing is creepy, too

You said you were asking for public opinion. Public opinion is that it's creepy. If you were doing it for longer than it took to document the flaw, you're creepy. If you're just pointing out that someone else is doing it, they're creepy, and you're just tone deaf to public opinion.

Legally it might be hard to prove a case - some states in the U.S. for example it's *illegal* to record someone without their knowledge - a phone call for instance. Other states it is not. I'm not a lawyer, but perhaps LL gave up proving the case and was afraid *you* might sue *them* about it, who knows.

I think people do have a reasonable expectation to privacy when on voice in SL. People forget it's not their kitchen, right or wrong that's how it is. Here they are having what they think is a private convo with an online friend, they do not *see* anyone else around so they think no one hears. They think they are alone. They are not tech savvy enough to know the many ways one can bend another person's privacy backward without their ever knowing...Or maybe not duplicitous minded enough to think that even is possible. Who knows.

"Creepy" - we can't know his intentions. Wrong? Yes, I think it is. I wouldn't want it done to me and I wouldn't want to do it to anyone else.

I haven't seen it posted 'why'. If it is an infohub maybe it is about helping others with SL who for some reason can't download or use SL themselves. Who knows. I can't see a practical purpose in it quite frankly. Unfortunately people tape others in public places too and put them on the 'net mocking them, things like that. I can't think that is legal either - doesn't that require a release form signed?

Cat's out of the bag though, it's like we're all living in a Gene Hackman movie, now.

(Tip: Use IM voice call if anything, but then trust who you are speaking with there, too. Or wind up on you tube...)

Thank you for offering your (unbiased? ) opinion, assuming you are who you say you are.

Pep (your post will have swayed public opinion with its convincing rhetoric, or maybe not)

Well, you asked for "public opinion", so here's one member of the public...

Your RL gf might not think you are creepy, and that's fine, but what you are doing here IS creepy, and morally wrong, in my opinion. When two people sit at a campfire and there is nobody else in the sim, they expect nobody else to hear their conversations. Most especially they don't expect it to be rebroadcast from a website across the internet. I don't care whether it's voice or text chatting.

I don't care about the technical or legal ramifications, this is peeping-tom-esque.

If your intentions are honourable, then you need to make sure that anyone entering the sim knows that their public chat is being rebroadcast - I don't care how you do it, but do it. Anything else is just plain immoral, in my opinion. If they know it, they can make their decisions based on it.

There. You asked.

Well considering I am an alt too, but someone else's, I might as well jump on this bandwagon also.

You may think your rl bf is not creepy but think again. For one thing, I am his rl BF that you don't know about. AND I bet you don't know about the microphone he has hidden under the bed!!!!!!!!!!

See how easy all of this alt stuff is?

Haven't been following the thread so I don't know when this "I/he is not the one streaming it" started. But just in case people forgot, he has the stream link in profile and made these statements:

and if you connect and listen to the stream, you too "have the ability" and are "remotely monitoring" - lol

... and are also creepy ...
... and are also breaking the TOS ...
... and are also so socially insensitive as to not recognize a grave faux pas ...
... and are also a conversation voyeur ...

oh..right.. "lol" *sigh*

look...I don't know what people are still going on about.

Spying on the conversations of others is not socially acceptable, whether those conversations take place in private, or in the public commons.

I don't care if it is possible, or legal. It.Is.Wrong.

Those who choose to do it should not be surprised at being ostracized when their actions are discovered. Nor should they be surprised when public sentiment is against them.

Yeh, but I wouldn't do that, because it's creepy.

^^^THIS THIS THIS. I don't really care much about the techy stuff. Just seems nosy, eavesdroppy and well.....creepy. Not calling 'him' a name as I don't know him. Referring to the behavior he is discussing.

Doesn't have anything to do with this topic and the violation of the TOS and community standards by remotely monitoring a conversation as written. So your still bringing things that have nothing to do with the topic into conversation..

Oh BTW... Classy having your girlfriend chime in to defend you. hahahahahaha.. omg that was funny.


Maybe I can get my girlfriend to write in and defend me too, then maybe my points will be more valid. Oh wait mine are already covered in the community standards.

I chimed in because i thought it was childish to call names here, I could care less what you or anyone else does. Man some ppl need to grow up! Have a great Day!

Personally, I think this was a great service, and I wish the rebroadcast were still active, and from every Welcome Center and InfoHub, 24/7. If it were, I'd do everything possible to publicize it.

Anything to further discourage adoption of Voice wins my support.

for the record I am not sure who is calling him names

I have seen people (myself included) say that they feel what he does is creepy

there is a difference

why would it bother you if other people enjoy using voice?

That would be like saying, I do not like scripts so I would do what it takes to discourage further adoption of scripts.

never did understand the mentality of "I do not like voice so it should be done away with (or before voice was made public, I do not like voice so it should never be an option)

*shrug*

THERE IT IS!!

I knew I had seen him outright say he was doing the remote monitoring

He has of late been making it seem as though he is not the one doing it, but right here he states that he is doing it.

There are many interesting things to do, and to participate in, in SL. Seminars, workshops, presentations. For the deaf and those of us with hearing loss, if these things are done in voice only, we are excluded, and cannot participate. That's my only issue, but I am not anti-voice, nor will I go out of my way to make a big cause/project of it. I can do either although voice is often hard for me, with my hearing loss. Those that are totally deaf, have no options here, unless to possibly ask for a notecard later, if the presenter has a script they were working from. But I don't think voice should be done away with, just that not all have access.

I can relate as I do suffer from hearing loss and sometimes voice is difficult, and as you said you would not go out of your way to make a big cause/project of it.

Some would though.

http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-1317

So long as Linden Labs keeps hiding this essential information from people who aren't using voice, people who aren't using voice are going to remain needlessly hostile towards voice.

If you are not using voice, why would it matter if you could see who is using voice???

(sorry but that logic confuses me a bit, after all, if I have no interest in something, I then have no interest in who is using it or not)

edited to add after reading the JIRA it seems the knowledge is so one would know if people are ignoring text chat due to voice chat etc

My take is, if I go somewhere and have voice off, and people do not chat to me, then either they are in voice, in which case I am sure they are not interested in chatting with me via text (know this from experience) or two they are either busy or away or just do not want to talk to me

I do not need to see the dot to know someone is in voice. *shrug*

if they do add that option, then cool to those who want it, but I do not see it as something necessary, especially if they could be putting their efforts towards other stuff (and who is to say, that by activating that option, it would not cause more issues with SL)

Because if there's a bunch of people not saying anything, or not saying much... then they're idling, or they're on voice. Idling does not mean "they're busy", it could simply be that they're waiting for something to happen. They may be intermittently AFK.

I am in this situation frequently. This is not something that I'm making up or imagining, this is something that has a major impact on people who don't use voice.

Sure you do. You just don't have a reason to care because you don't mind using voice.

Until they do, please have some compassion for the people who don't use voice and have seen hangouts in SL turn into zombie playgrounds.

Okay, I confess: I was kind of baiting the OP, to see if the whole scheme all along may have been to discourage Ahern regulars from using voice.

The thing is, I've listened to voice at the Welcome Areas, and I've never once heard it used for anything but harassment or *the* most mindlessly inane drivel I've ever experienced in any medium of discourse. That's not an argument for getting rid of voice (the same stupidity would manifest in chat--albeit more slowy)--rather, it's an observation that I cannot reconcile with the OP's flat claim that they just like to listen to this stuff. I very much doubt that, given the evident ability to form coherent sentences and press the Submit button without assistance.