Will you use SL voice for the majority of your communication in world?

I removed the voice thingy from my computer but something that bugs me is will i be forced to turn off my speakers in areas where the parcels have the voice chat turned on? Cause I Like ambient sounds I dont actually wanna be listening to people chatter away especially if i am tired and have been having to chatter away all day while working. I don't even like to listen to music half the time I just want quiet and to hear the virtual birds and bees and wind and that's enough for me.

Or maybe they don't require the anonymity afforded someone on the internet to express their opinions on various subjects. It's possible they may express themselves better through other means...I don't know...maybe through speaking?

I love the "it'll be us vs. them" mentality so often portrayed in these anti-voice threads. It's like you're taking the Bush Administration mentality of premptive strikes on people that may or may not attack you in the future.

You're actually helping to create the very scenario you hope to avoid.

p.s. when I say "you" I mean "those that have said "us vs. them" mentality.

It is possible to disable voice chat in preferences. It'll be business as usual for those who opt out!

It was a return barb for your sarcastic take singling out one of three reasons I gave to make my post look conspiricist.

You are right most people have poor reading comprhension. The Average American only reads at a 10th grade level.

To counter the supposed advantage of intonation pause, stree, etc - I could counter that text has detail, the lack of a need to repeat oneself, continuity, it can be concurrent and it works when you are afk.

Some people are actually much better with text than they ever were with voice. I would be one of those people. Of course I have read at a college level since grade school.

I don't think it's too unreasonable to go out on a limb and say that people who don't like voice in general wouldn't be so eager to join SL in the future since it's so much part of the user experience by default.

What remains is load after load of newbies who are used to and comfortable with voice from day 1 and aren't part of the "voice vs no-voice" debate. It's always been there for them, why would someone *not* want to use it?

Then look back a year at the number of users and contrast that with today. Marginalization and exclusion won't happen overnight, but it will happen quietly and silently over a period of time.

There's a place for everyone who will use voice occasionally, but I don't think there is a long-term space for those who won't use it at all outright.

(Actually There.com refugees could probably answer that one. How many people - relatively - did you meet who just signed up and wouldn't use voice at all?)

Just because the people you choose to surround yourself with have the same opinion as you doesn't mean you're in the majority.

164 people is not a very big cross-section of SL residents. This forum does not represent the opinion of any majority in SL other than the majority of people that frequent the forums.

Anonimity is not the only reason. It certainly is not mine. For you to highlight anonimity alone is self-serving in as much as it minimizes the dozens upon dozens of other equally valid reasons anti-voice posters have stated.



Perhaps so. But its all we have isn't it? And when combined with all of the other dozens of forums/threads/blogs/polls that come to the same conclusion...well I think at some point even blind supporters like you can see the big picture. Which by the way, you've pretty much admitted already.



For the millions of reasons given in the dozens of other threads on this subject. Which I am sure that you are aware of since you've ardently argued your point in all of them. But you didn't listen then, so I am sure you will not listen now.



Actually your hundreds of posts on this subject pretty much cement the argument, but none do you as much justice as this gem of a paragraph...

Oddly enough, I agree with this post in it's entirety. Except to add, the Us vs Them is evident on both sides of the argument.

Why is it necessary to trivilaize people's desire for anonymity on the internet?

You are saying less people read and post on the forums becuase they dont like being anonymous?

You also have no idea what opinions forums posters express away from the forums and whether they have anything to do with anonymity. Many might be quite vocal about their opnions in their Real Lives - in voice and in person.

You'll note I said "one reason". Keep trying...



Is there a point or an arguement in there somewhere? All I saw was a condescending attitude.

I'm not even sure what you're trying to argue. It started with you debating what my opinion was (I guess it's not alright for me to be okay with people's desire for anonymity) and now it's turned into something out of left field.

Here is my stance...

a) voice is optional. Don't use it if you don't want to. You can shut it off in the preferences section of your client and it'll be like nothing happened.

b) the only reason you need is "I don't want to use voice". Don't try to make it into a big impending social catastrophy because it won't be.

c) all the calls of "the voicers are going to discriminate against the typers" is only paving the way for pre-emptive discrimination and will cause the scenario you so wish to avoid. Just about every voice user I've met just wants to enhance their social experience. Sounds good to me!

d) any predicitons about any changes (negative or positive) in SL due to voice are just that; predictions. Anyone acting like their prediction is more likely to happen than another's is way too into themselves and will look stupid when they're proven wrong.

There are some good points in this Kitty, a lot of people will avoid signing up for Second Life becuase it has voice. A lot will probably sign up becuase it has voice. Leading to a larger percentage of people who wish to use voice over time.

A lot of people are going to be tired of being asked why they dont want to voice - so they will just avoid meeting new people. Or log in less. Etc.

Pot meet Kettle.

Memo to you, you project a condescending attitude on the majority of your posts.

Perhaps you have a copyright on condescending attitude?

Why is it that pointing out that there are people that have different preferences to you is considered trivializing your own preferences? You're reading way more into it than what I'm actually saying.



No I'm saying there are people out there that express themselves and their opinions through other, less anonymous means. Thus these people tend to have less of a desire for absolute anonymity.

Since anonymity is one reason people site for being against v-chat then these people are less likely to be against it for that reason since anonymity isn't as much of an issue for them.

I'm not attacking anyone. I'm just showing that these forums don't neccessarily represent any sort of majority other than the majority of SL residents that visit the forums.



So how can they be against voice if they are vocal about their opinions through voice?

It's starting to look to me like people are just reaching for reasons to be against voice for the sake of being against it.

Im glad the forums is never going to turn out the way you want it to be.

Becuase it would be pretty boring.

People can make whatever predictions they want. Even if they turn out wrong so what? I for one, do not assume people are stupid just becuase they are proven wrong.

As for the self fufiling prophesy affecting the actual SL world - thats nonsense; too few people read the forums for it to really affect how people will act, its like the flea trying to move the dog.

The self fufiling prophesy affects how people on the forums relate to one another. Such as when some prove to other posters that there will be some intollerance of their opinions.

And yet you failed to bring up any relevant points here.

Next...

Agreed.

I brought up the point to debate the issue on its merits, rather than attempting to reduce the opposing point of view by attempting to accentuate a non issue like their demeanor during said debate.

Especially when said demeanor is the norm for you.

this is all noise

----------------------
You made your post about Anonymity directly in response to my post about the fact that many who are going to prefer voice dont use things such as Forums.

Many people who will prefer voice are more capable with voice than with text communication. Those people are actually a statistical majority in the United States. Such people, logically, are not going to spend much time reading the forums.

If your post was not directly related to that comment as it apeared to be, then you should not have quoted me.

Wait, so you are saying the forums don't represent any sort of majority in SL?



That's ironic for you to say.

I would have to disagree, though. A group of people brooding over what may or may not come to pass, no matter how small the group is, will not only affect each other but affect those outside of the group they come into contact with.

This is evident with any hate group or religious faction out there (not that I'm trying to draw any parallels with anyone here). A small group of people keep among themselves and eventually form outlandish philosophies that come to affect people they come into contact with outside of said group. Sometimes as a result these people are considered odd and sometimes they actually do damage to the community.

Again, I'm not saying anyone's trying to start a skinhead group against voice chatters, but all this assumption of discrimination and intollerance before anyone has a chance to act could prepetuate negative attitudes to people outside of your particular group...in this case voicers.

Why?
Have I shown that I'm intollerant of opinion? - or have I shown that Im merely quick to disagree with some?

Theres a considerable difference.

I dont tell the people I disagree with that they shouldnt be posting here. I do not make statements that I am always right, nor do I call an issue decided just becuase I have commented on it.

All of which others have done recently.

I can't hear anything. My v-chat is off (sorry I just had to! )



...things such as THESE forums.

But seriously, folks. Do you think half the people that voiced their opinion (regardless of what it was) about age play and rape would have if their real names were being used?? Can you honestly deny the fact that anonymity is a major part of internet forums in general and this one in particular?



Where do you get your information? You're assuming a lot here.



It's a good thing these forums don't run the way you'd like them to. Then it would be boring.

I will be another mute resident. Not interested in voice at all.

Considering the way you go about it starts with "this is all noise" or "agreed" when quoting a post that has no argumentative value and was simply made as an attack...yes I think you have shown that you are intollerant of others' opinions.

I make an effort to respond with actual information (be it opinion, observation, whatever) and keep personal attacks to a minimum (other than the occasional barb in jest). In just about every instance where I have been accused of personal attack or being condescending was due to misunderstanding or an inability/unwillingness to take what I said in proper context and thus implying an attack where there was none.

This has gone completely off topic. I've conveyed my opinion as clearly as possible (see the "my stance" post for further details) and no one has responded with anything that adequately refutes or otherwise changes it.

I'm sorry if it doesn't jive with the status quo set up on the forums.

Perhaps, but that is a seperate point from the fact that many who will prefer voice over text do not use forums.



I wasnt aware the fact that most Adults in the US do not read at a college level was in debate.

Here are a few sources for you.

http://www.informatics-review.com/FAQ/reading.html
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/facts/reading_facts.html
http://www.brown.edu/Administration/News_Bureau/2003-04/03-025.html



Boring would not be the word that would apply to expecting people who Quote and then comment on a statement to actually say something pertaining to that statement.

Obviously this is a very contentious issue.

This is my personal take on it:

I, personally, have no problems with people hearing my voice. I live alone, and therefore have no distractions that would keep me from using it. However, I use a laptop and have no idea if the microphone installed in it will be sufficient for voice chat purposes. I have no interest whatsoever in spending money on additional equipment to use the feature right now.

I think if I did use it, I'd only really be interested in using it in an intimate, conversational setting, rather than in a public space. From what I've heard of people who have tried it, that seems to be the optimal situation for it.

I know quite a few genderbenders in SL, and I don't really know how they plan on handling the situation. I know at least one who is looking at voice alteration software or possibly even hardware.

I'm not 100% thrilled with the notion, because I do feel that it breaks the fourth wall, in a way, to have human voices intrude on the space we've created. But if I find it unbearable, I suppose I can always switch it off, become one of those enigmatic text-only types, and have people assume that I'm male. *shrug*