Well, I guess Ageplay is now Officially banned

Actually, it is not logical.

Some killers use knives. It does NOT follow that having a knife will lead you to be a killer.

It is not logical to be saying that anything that might conceivably SUPPORT illegal behavior should be banned or controled.

That is not logical at all.

Fire should be banned because all arsonists use it?

Universities should be banned because student uprisings happen there?

The holidays should be banned because suicides are assiciated with Thanksgiving and Christmas?

Where does it end?

That's even more restrictive than the original law, and so vague it could be interpreted to make film adapations of Romeo and Juliet illegal. Juliet was a minor after all. It would hinge on the subjective meaning of "obscene." I can't imagine that law would stand up to a Supreme Court challenge either, but with Bush's two new justices who knows? Sad. I'll sleep so much better tonight knowing that imaginary children are safe from predators.



If the off-topic forum were still around I probably would be.

But it should never blind you to facts or the truth, or doing what's right. Emotion is great, in it's place. But in making the rules a society should live by, they have no place. Every action taken should be stewed in fact. If we let emotions decide the issue, homosexuality would be illegal. And you see where the feelings of others have kept us from giving them their right to partner one another equally with those of us that are heterosexual. Great wrongs are not perpetuated in fact, only in emotion. Where it's easy to whip up the populous to follow you like sheep to the slaughter.

Key word: minors. A computer avatar is not a minor as it is not a real human being. You can't place such standands or something that is not real.




You seem to be hung up on one word while ignoring other key important words.

yes... ban them

Wait a second...

in regards to the case in question... the one blogged about that has brought us to this point...
fact: REAL children WERE involved in regards to the very real images being viewed by the people in question.
Fact: PIctures of pretend children COULD be used to hurt real children...if shown to real children
FACT: what you "know" or "dont know" doesnt make it right.
fact: thought normally preceeds deed
fact: Two consenting adults do not have the right to engage in illegal acts
fact: no one is FORCING anyone to live by anyone elses morals. people have a right to log off their computers and go away. Which is exactly what I would suggest people who want to engage in this kind of thing should do... just before they go and seek out professional help.


Alice

Those that have been around knows Chips statement is correct.

But those that are using it to support their anti LLABs support of child of Pro age role sex play. Is problem sum here

Everything Alice said in that post has been studied and said first by many respected pyschologists. I didn't say that it changed my mind, but it was a good arguement based on facts and not emotional appeal in that area. Something that is easy to discuss, with the ability to share information instead of some idiot standing in the middle of the room stomping their feet and screaming "CUZ I SAID SO"

You seem to be hung up on something too... and that is whether or not it is an ACTUAL minor... or just a simulated one. Which ...when DEPICTED..doesnt really matter does it?
Just for your reference

de·pict /dɪˈpɪkt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[di-pikt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–verb (used with object) 1. to represent by or as if by painting; portray; delineate.
2. to represent or characterize in words; describe.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Origin: 1625–35; < L dépictus (ptp. of dépingere), equiv. to dé- de- + pic- ptp. s. of pingere to paint + -tus ptp. suffix]

—Related forms
de·pict·er, de·pic·tor, noun
de·pic·tion, noun
de·pic·tive, adjective


—Synonyms 1. reproduce, draw, paint, limn. 1, 2. Depict, portray, sketch imply a representation of an object or scene by colors or lines, or by words. Depict emphasizes vividness of detail: to depict the confusion of departure. Portray emphasizes faithful representation: We could not portray the anguish of the exiles. Sketch suggests the drawing of the outlines of the most prominent features or details, often in a preparatory way: to sketch the plans for a community development.

Ok, NOW I remember the whole Whorely case.

It was a red herring and the FBI is claiming victory for something they really didn't do.

Yes, he had anime on his computer. He also had a hard drive full of real child porn and was sending sexual emails to a minor. All of that was enough to put him away. Claiming that he was convicted because of anime is completely disingenous on their part. There has yet to be a conviction of someone based soley on "virtual child porn".

The Japanese anime was just part of the case against Whorley. Our cyber experts found digital photographs of child porn on the same VEC computer. Whorley had also used it to send explicit e-mails to a young girl and for other e-mails describing the sexual abuse of children—further violations of federal obscenity laws. In the end, we were able to link Whorley to the pornography, e-mails and other evidence on the computer. He was convicted of a total of 74 counts of obscenity and child pornography.

Again, this is NOT AT ALL TRUE. The Blog is very very clear on this point.

SL users were banned ONLY for avatars having sex (of a certain apparent kind).

Period.

This does not mean that the SL users were not ALSO guilty of other infractions... they might be speeders, they might cheat their taxes, they might be jaywalkers or pettey thieves.... all of that is immaterial.

They were banned immediately for avatar sex of a certain kind.

End of story.

No not even close, what it makes one to look like is a person that is very disturbed


hahaahah ok fine but like RP people soon forget the diff betwen RL and ssl..... and you fall in this catalog it seems



This does not make you a expert in any means, it just shows one can see with their own eyes what they want to see and read.



You really are a non caring person arnt you? If everyone on sl thought as you i really hate to see how SL would look

So when can we expect to see Dateline doing a "To Catch a Sexual Ageplayer" expose???

And will Chris Hanson be in SL to confront the "predator" in Chat, followed by several Avatar Cops & some of the Lindens??

Another person that has good resources with out the basis views

Sorry Mick, I'll stand by what I said, sexual ageplayers are pedophiles. Let me repeat that. Sexual ageplayers are pedophiles.

OK, not all sexual ageplayers trade pictures, not all sexual ageplayers hang out in kiddie whorehouses, and some of the sexual ageplayers just like to play with their partners ... who are pedophiles.

You say I'm painting everyone with the same brush? OK, yes, all sexual ageplayers are pedophiles.

And I'll once again say it's just not a good idea for a bunch of pedophiles to find other pedophiles in SL and share, and enact their fantasies with one another. And sure as hell it's just not a good idea to in any way enable or validate their fetish with arguments like "oh but it's only 2 adults in cartoon av's". Also, you're right Mick, I don't have any OFFICIAL DATE to back up my personal belief that if sexual predators are able to enact their fantasies in ever bolder ways, to connect and network with other pedophiles, then it does lead to pedophiles who sooner or later may very well want to take their fantasies into the RL.

Go ahead and call me hysterical if that makes you feel better. Go ahead and say I'm full of crap because I don't have a link to back me up. I will still stand here and say I think I'm right.

Its not the end of story...although I am willing to admit that I was wrong ...in part.

The people who were banned were not necessarily viewing RL child porn... however...child porn was submitted as being found in secondlife. IT is from the same blog... it would appear as though they COULD be seperate incidents...although they are definately related.

Then you would have to extend the argument... that regular porn leads to child porn that leads to harming children. So ban all porn.

But that can be extended...

Sexually charged song lyrics and tv shows lead to porn that lead to child porn that lead to harming children...

etc. etc. etc.

It is not logically bracketed. There is no end in the chain of events.... well, except birth itself (but that leads to an argument that no one should be born... which leads to an argument that there should be no sex... hmmmm)

Not too far from it, it seems:

From: someone

Ludwig Waldinger, a spokesman for state of Bavaria police, said "cyber-cops", real-life German police who hunt online for offenders, were doing spot checks of Second Life. They had not discovered the law being broken, but would act if they did.

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/60644.html

You do know TOON age play sex acts is not allowed in Japan. But the whole world thinks The Japanese Laws allows toon sex and not rl sex acts to be viewed without censorship........

And to reiterate, just because an AV may look like a child doesn't mean it is or is suppose to be a child. I personally have an alt who is very short, looks like he could be a young boy, but is actually a supernatural immortal being who is several hundred years old (an idea I had inspired by something I read in a book by Jeananne Kalogridis).

I wasn't talking about Japan I was talking about a US court case.

Actually we were discussing banning ageplay, not pictures of real children. Howeve,r the actual case in question does not actually say that the two banned were the ones with RL images.



If, yes. However, do you really want to go throw people in jail because IF they do it in private it MIGHT end up shown in public? Maybe, possibly? I'm sorry bt the fact stands as it is. We are not in some world where you can introduce possibilities until you win.



Actually, it has great influence on what I believe. And until told otherwise, I believe it wasn't. It wasn't in the facts given us.



Agreed...however, does deed ALWAYS follow thought? Does the thought usually happen and no deed actually occur from it? I tell you what., everyone in this world, no matter how saintly has THOUGHT about killing someone somewhere...when you turn yourself in for murder, so will I.



Correct, however, when we arrest couples from pretending to be teacher/naughty student, then we should also arrest two adults also effectively dressed up as children, just with better make up.



Yes, you are saying LIVE BY MY RULES OR LEAVE. However, who says your rules are right? And why? What right do you have to tell others that YOUR rules should rule here? The right to log off and go away applies to you as well. You don't have the right to not be offended, only to leave the place that offends you.

Please you don`t have the first idea what your trying to factualate let alone to reiterate. Sorry but your junping all over the subject matter here with little Warrant.

Sorry, let me make that clearer ... on second thought, why don't you go back and read it again.

No, Linden Lab is.