theif application on the lose

She is obviously an alt, so I hope that vacation extends to the main account too, but judging by LL's response so far, I would be surprised.

I think whats most surprising here isnt that someone figured out how to do this, but the startling lack of communication from the Linden Gods.
Think Warner Bros, or Intel or Toyota or any of those companies are going to be amused with this little program? Think they'll want to spend resources to create content in a world where it can be copied and resold indiscriminately?
You've already pissed off your customer base, dear LL... let this go and you will scare off your big-money corporations.

yea yea yea...and they say condons provents you from gettig preggie.......WellI got preggie even after the lable says it "HELPS Provents one from becomeing preggie" WellI have a baby now.......Hence warnings and disclaimers are as worthless as some lindens on sl.

Throw a ball on to the freeway and let him follow it in traffic during rush hour! That will solve his problem!

As (at the moment) the byte-codes from the scripts cannot be replicated, nor can scripts. I forsee a lot more content creators using scripted behaviour to protect their content...

OMG SL is going to die now. All stores are going to have to close. All store owners are going to go broke. The only people in the game that will ever be able to make money anymore is scripters and land brokers. LibSL is a group of horrible, horrible people and they should all be shot. LL should be shot for allowing LibSL to do work that helps LL understand it's own creation better. LL should be shot for using OpenGL because anyone can copy anyones texture. OMG island prices are going up and now everyone is going to leave SL. I am leaving SL because the lag is so bad and everything is getting worse and they don't care about copy right protection.

YEAH YEAH YEAH, Have heard it all and more. But after every crisis there is always more people here, not less. Stores make more money not less.

IF you don't like how SL is, you just leave. If you don't like your job RL, you find another. JEEZ

I suppose they forgot about the GLinterecept freakout.

This CopyBot is nothing but the nail in SL's coffin.

It can only be used to "Steal" items instead of purchasing them, or to modify thier permissions beyond what the creator wished to allow.

I dare LL,or anyone, to name one legitimate use for this thing.

I also emplore LL to freeze sales on this item until a full investigation can be undertaken.

Faliure to do so will result in the collapse of the SL economy and SL as a whole. Not "may", will. Already content creators are speaking that there is no more reason to build. People are speaking of using it to "obtain" items without paying for them. No new products means SL stagnates, then crumbles as creators pull thier current works out, then dies when the numbers drop too low to sustain it.

If LL wants a way to destroy thier own product, you just found it.

Now, what is LL going to do about it?

~Jessy

edit:The difference between this and GLI is that with stolen textures you still had to create the item. This bypasses all that laziness.

lets hope things don`t reach this point

Jesse - Its the Internets... People always complain.
But people here do have a right to complain. This program is a real thorn in the side of content creators, and they are worried, with good cause.

I don't think this program will kill SL, probably won't change it much either.

But its the vanguard of something that will change SL forever, either for the better or the worse, and that something is the SL 3rd Party Client. Its also highlighting, again, the nature of SL, and its commercial ambitions, and that of the people who live and work in SL space.

Frankly, while the current situation is disturbing, and upsetting to some, its the start of something far more exciting. The virtual world is changing. I for one await the changes with eager anticipation.

Things sure have come a long way since CyberTown and its ilk.

My initial view on this whole endeavor is presented below in a little mental-visual thought -

"Check this out. I had this crazy idea, you know, right? About a little box you can talk into, and other people that have the box can hear it, and even talk back! I spent a lot of time working on it and I finally have something that works. I'm going to call it a 'Telephone'. And I can tell you, it's going to change the world. Plus, I'll be able to make back all the money I spent investing in this idea and support my family!"

"Cool. I'm going to copy your idea and freely distribute it. Don't quit your day job."

---

...

I never really got into economics, but, even I can understand that, if you steal something that is readily sold and distribute it freely, the original product loses all of its monetary worth.

Also, wtf? Linden Labs, I've always stood up for you, and have admired a lot of things you've done. But this little feat brings a pressing question to hand -

Who's going to buy Linden Dollars now?

Sure, you'll have a few hundred people tossing down money for this copybot thing, but once someone figures out how it works and starts freely distributing that, Residents won't be the only ones not making any money - at least when concerned with monetary input from Residents to Linden Labs via Linden Dollars, anyway.

But, let's break it down a bit further. Let's say that I've created something all on my own, which I don't intend on selling, due to it's personal value - and then it is stolen, and distributed. Then, it starts happening to all of the content creators in Second Life. Lots of people get very, very angry and leave - combine this with the problem of items being sold being stolen and then distributed freely and soon, several thousands more will follow suit. Your big-money-paying corperations begin to realize the sudden lack of people to push their product on, probably around the same time they discover the extent of your platform's limiations. And then one day, an idea -

"Hey, we can do this better."

I suggest someone who has a name in SL start an organization that scans SL and reports _every_ bad use (am i right with this term?) of CopyBot.

Maybe if Lindens get enough documented reports how much damage this stuff does they would reconsider removing it (and the possibility of recreating it) from SL.

Myself, as a n00b can only ask everyone to do the same: report _every_ violation of copyright you happen by as a result of this thing.

People who buy it are encouraged to do so. In the FAQ notecard it has links to file a DMCA report and the Linden blog.

Speaking of the Lindens where are they?

Ok, everyone, take a deep breath, and repeat after me.

"Its impossible to secure any content."

Impossible, LL can not, sercure your content, period. Its fundimentally impossible, because copying data is the very fundimental bedrock principle of how the internet works.

Again repeat after me.

"The internet works by copying data"

Your and my content, is simply that. Data. That data has to be copied to anyones machine, in order to display it. Once it is there, a talented coder, or a warez'ed up script kiddie, can intercept and store your data.

Its sucks, but that is simply how the internet works, not SL, the internet.

Given the US-$/L$-ratio they are probably more interrested in the promotional value of their products and in SL as a marketing platform ( aside from the communications-aspect ). I am not sure whether copying of a real world corporations virtual goods is that unwelcome to most of them.

I'm a content creator. In common with many content creators, I have to buy scripts if I want to use them - or induce a scripter to provide one for me.

I have no hope of using these simple scripts for copying material unless someone packages it up in a box for me to use. I wouldn't, because I can't think of one legitimate use for such a thing as CopyBot.

The problem with what GeForce is doing, is that he/she is providing a tool for people to rip off content without a conscience. They aren't ripping off content, just making a fast buck out of all those people who want to.

These are people too lazy, or too stupid to make their own content -- the only way they are going to get their hands on other people's content is if libSL and GeForce make it EASY.

That isn't the internet's fault. That isn't the platform's fault. That's the creators of CopyBot, fair and square.
Cali

CopyBot wasn't intended as a tool to steal content. It was intended as a tool to test uploading of content from a custom client. The simplest way to get content to upload was to replicate data coming down from the server. (The next step would be to create the content from scratch).

If someone IS using it to steal content, I hope they get banned. However, painting all of the libSL team with one brush isn't fair: most, if not all, of them never intended for anything like this to happen.

There was a big stink, a few years ago, when some people.. for reasons I never understood, would clone websites. They'd download all your pics, and all your html, and all your active scripted content that they could reach. Anything that was "downloaded to the browser" for display purposes. Web designers were freaking out left and right.. and then everyone just forgot about it for the most part. Server side includes, and PHP based websites, with dynamic content became the rage. You could copy the end result, but you couldn't copy the dynamism. And then.. someone flipped the whole thing on it's head and started offering RSS feeds for free.. allowing people to display your dynamic content on their own site.

The web design industry evolved. from a static publishing medium, to something more fluid.

LL seems to be attempting to evolve their service into a "world wide Web" of sorts.. and they're leaving policing to the individual web page providers. You create your own products.. your own scripts.. no biggie. You rip that code off and spawn your own version of someone else's site.. you may get away with it, or you may not.

Linden Labs doesn't want to get into the business of policing the actions of millions of users.. and really, can you blame them? They have at least agreed to assist you in filing proceedings through established digital media protection groups. How that works.. I frankly don't know, or much care.

There was a rule of thumb we web designers picked up.. back in the mid nineties.. perhaps it's useful to reiterate it here.

If you don't want your artwork stolen. Don't put it online.

By it's very nature, the information MUST be transmitted to the user's computer. GLIntercept worked in a similar fashion.. interpreting, and archiving the data being sent to the OpenGL renderer by the client software. So someone has now taken to scripting a program that will intercept the model data that is sent, along with the textures.. and had a way to compile them (fairly quickly if the video is to be beleived) in very nearly real time.

That's an amazing piece of technical wizardry.. given it takes the SL client far longer to render that data in the first place... at least on my system (giggle).

Does it have "legitimate" uses? maybe.. One thing I can think of, is the oft maligned inability to change one's name, or share items between alts. This program gives a limited ability to at least transfer the physical forms of some items to another user, regardless of transfer rights. Does that fall within fair use? it's edgey.. but I'd say so. Most in the content sales industry would disagree with me.. that's your right... but I personally feel, if *I* bought it with money from *MY* RL bank account, I should be able to equip it on any alt I own.

Reading what has been written about it, the program does seem to have to "ask permission" to copy an avatar, so there goes the argument about "someone might steal MY AVATAR"... The main concern is about it's ignoring permissions.. but this was an early iteration of the program.. and from what I've heard, development has ceased due to all the drama.. which is kind of a pity. From what I gather, an old version of the "Prim Mirroring Script" could be used to riip off others work.. but when the developer realized this, he pulled his code, and repaired the flaw. If development had continued, perhaps it would have been corrected to respect the permissions settings.

I am involved in a gaming community that is constantly playing cat and mouse with various "hack programs".. aimbots, cheats, macros.. things like that. They've adde4d extensive amounts of code to the client software, to check the current processes running on the user's machine.. and if program X is found, the game terminates. Like I said, this becomes a game of cat and mouse, where the hackers try to mimic the IDs of legitimate programs.. in an attempt to hide from the cat.. and the cat finds some other behaviour to key off of.

The fact is.. these are crowbars and lockpicks. Neither of which are illegal to own or purchase.. or in fact, to use. Having them on you may be regulated in some places.. but the tool is not, in and of itself, a crime. The hackneyed old saying. "guns don't kill people" rings true here.

Intellectual Property theft is a civil matter, not a criminal one. In the real world, the government won't arrest someone who rips off an idea.. and you must bear all the costs of pursuing them yourself. Linden Labs is treating you just like the police or the government would..

"They could violate your copy rights in this matter.. that's true.. if you think your copy rights have been violated.. here's the number for the courthouse.. where you can file an action against them. This is a civil matter, not a criminal one. Sorry."

Be advised though.. protecting your content with legal copyright protection is not automatic. Just because you did something first does NOT mean you own an idea. Try filing for a patent sometime.. or a trademark. And remember most of all.. $L300 = $1. IN order to file a case in small claims court, in the state of California.. I beleive the case must be over a matter in excess of $20. That's $L6000.

Of course.. you try explaining to a small claims judge, that by having this content stolen, you were deprived of potentially exchanging that content for temporary liscence tokens which have no real value unto themselves, yet can be exchanged with other users for real sums of money, for whatever another user is willing to pay for them.. averaging approximately 1/300 of a dollar each.

"I could have traded copies of my drawing for 600 bottlecaps each! and as you know judge.. you CAN sell bottlecaps to collectors!"

Ethan Linden was at my shop. People were harassing me as he watched and did nothing. The only thing he said was: "http://blog.secondlife.com/2006/11/13/copyrights-and-content-creation-in-second-life/"

Partial inventory back-up seems to be the most obvious. If it can make in-world copies of shapes, textures, prims and animations of what it sees then it could save most of everything to disk just as easily and could be used to restore copies when people loose inventory.

Good point, Kitty. People have been asking for THAT forever!

How hard would it have been to include code that checked permissions & ownership before duplicating something ?

I've had it with this generation of lazy, morally stunted apologists we call programmers. I do not have a problem with the libSL program, if anything it is to be applauded, but the people involved and their careless attitude to the effect of their work on others are another thing entirely.

Yeh, we really need more assets in SL So where would these copies be stored, Kitty?

The creator of this object is fully aware what her market is.

It would have been very easy to include that code.

Unfortunately it would also have been very easy for an unscrupulous program to remove it.