Das Infohubbens!

I'll take a MOSS SPLAT! is it copy? hehe

A rolling stone gathers no moss?

The HUB has now been set to no rez. And the Grignano corner is also no script. Since then the HUB has become rather bare at least at night when I am usually here. Time to put some ideas on the board.

I'm certainly not the oldest resident of Nova Albion by a many years, but I've tried to get everything out of it that I could in the year and a half I've been in-world. It was by far my favourite place to socialize on the grid because of:

1. The quantity, quality, and diversity of the regular residents
2. The dynamic atmosphere -- something appeared to always be going on. Even if it was not always the most high-brow entertainment, there was definitely a feeling of community vigor.
3. The rich character, history, and mythology behind the city compared to other infohubs

It's been very difficult the last few weeks to adjust to the changes. I don't know all factors involved, but their does seem to be a steep decline in the first two points. There's unmistakably less people there now, and of the people that are there, there are less veterans and less diversity. The atmosphere also feels much more subdued and static.

I think some would point out, not without some merit, that a more subdued atmosphere may make for a better onboarding experience for some and less support costs for LL. However, to counter this one must consider that there are plenty of such largely static infohubs elsewhere, and adding Nova Albion to this lengthy list does may not make a noticable difference in the larger picture. On the contrary, reducing the unique dynamism and community character previously present in Nova takes something away from the grid that cannot be replaced. My own positive experience of finding mentors in the regular residents of Nova may have been a minority- I do not have data to say one way or the other- but it seems unlikely that my own inspiration for positive involvement in SL could have germinated along similar paths in a more controlled hub.

My first reaction to the recent changes was to do something about it myself, as much as I am able. The first idea I had was to acqire 'private' parcels as close to the social areas as possible in the crossroads at the city center and open them up for limited rez/script and socializing to encourage a more dynamic community, in addition to some social goods such as providing a gallery of pointers to non-profit, artistic builds. Indeed I exhausted hours canvasing the local landowners in Nova, but found no parcels for sale, at any price, close enough to the crossroads to be accessible to casual visitors without special knowledge.

My second idea was to hope that there is some crack still open in a door for a rez/script culture to come back, likely under some new kind of arrangement that may improve on past results. I am not an expert in these matters, but would be willing to help brainstorm ideas with others and facilitate communications between interested parties, should someone with decision-influencing power be willing to listen.

My third idea would simply be to find another place for myself to socialize and flex artistic inspiration. There are certainly private parcels and island available for this end, and I do make use of them. However, without a healthy, steady influx of new membership all communities wither and succumb to staleness. A social location as close to an infohub as possible has the best chance of sustaining a vibrant community, IMHO. I sincerely hope that it will be possible for one to exist, that is accessible and friendly to those of us that make full use of SL's rich capabilities with regard to scripts and content creation. As of the moment I have not been able to locate such a place.

Frequent resident of Nova Albion,
-Arrehn Oberlander

On release from orientation island to the SecondLife grid, Nova Albion became my birth place and the place I have always considered as home. In those 2+ years I have seen many changes, some might be considered for the better, some for the worse. The physical changes are a part of keeping any city alive. Social aspects can also change over time for various reasons.

Most of the infohubs/welcome areas have always enjoyed a rich diversity and I would agree with Arrehn's 3 points concerning Nova entirely. But as we all know, LL is currently implementing changes (possibly due to adverse publicity) to make the mainland more mainstream. This includes making infohubs/welcome areas exactly that... more welcome.

Although it is true that a part of Nova's diversity has existed because of build/script areas where people have been able to rez all manner of things, (vehicles, horses, popcorn dispensers etc.) it has also been grossly misused and I would have to admit that Nova has become an attraction for people whose only intent is to ruin the fun of others. According to the ToS/Community Standards, Arrehn should be able to invite his grandmother to Nova without her being offended by somebody rezzing a 30 meter penis, constant foul language in form of gestures, or by being subjected to attack with a scripted weapon for no other reason than being a “noob”. Unfortunately this has become more often the rule rather than the exception.

Nova needed cleaning up. What we are seeing now is the after effect of that clean-up. Other infohubs/welcome areas function fine with no-build/no-script restrictions and in time Nova will too. Give it time, all changes take a little getting used to. Gradually, Nova is healing.

Not sure this post belongs with this thread but here goes :-

I think I need to break this down into two parts.

First, Miramare as an infohub/welcome area.
The new resident arriving on the main grid enters a whole new world. They are like a small lost child, - “where do I go?”, “what can I do?” etc. A well meaning resident steps up and tells them they can get some freebies for their avatar, hands them a landmark and sends them on their way. Possibly never to return. Even if they do, they will probably repeat this scenario when they in turn help a “newbie”. I'm not suggesting there should be a massive freebie store at the hub or that it is anybody's responsibility to ensure that there are at least a few vendors but if on the spot help could be given, it might make the city feel more like home to the newcomer. Just a thought.

Second, Nova Albion as a city - the big picture.
Back when traffic made a difference to search placings, land close to infohubs was very desirable. It didn't matter that a high percentage of the traffic was new residents with little or no money. Traffic gave a better search placing creating therefore more traffic and business. With the introduction of classified ads, search results are no longer dependent on traffic and it doesn't matter where your business is based. And then of course there's the effect of xstreet on shop sales.
With land prices in Nova reflecting those earlier times, it might be said that the prices are being held artificially high by landowners quite rightly not willing to take loses. Adventurous new businesses can't afford such properties and open elsewhere. I can't help feeling that the actual city of Nova Albion seems to be disappearing with the current trend towards land speculation. For example, the Armidi group owns seven parcels, approximately 5,700 sqM all of which lay bare and not adding to the feeling of city life.
So, here's my suggestion. Liaison with major landowners to encourage some kind of development of empty parcels. This could be in the form of low prim buildings with textures (not all megaprims are lag monsters). These buildings could represent various civic buildings or even be sponsored by real life companies for example - a New York Times or a Sony Corporation building giving the landowner some extra income as a bonus. I have seen examples of this in operation where whole sims are financed in this way and it would certainly bring back the feeling of a city environment.

This meeting is to discuss the Nova Albion Infohub specifically.

1) It's development and original plan.

2) The current state of the hub.

3) Future direction - ideas, goals, solutions, etc.

We will meet Sunday, June 7th at 2:00pm SLT at Cafe Jack in the Grignano section of Nova Albion. Grignano (96, 116, 2

http://slurl.com/secondlife/Grignano/96/116/28

Great comments by Arrehn and Collie! It is obvious that Nova Albion, both the hub and the city, has made an impression on us all and that we care for it a great deal. I think we may be standing on the verge of a reawakening in the City that once was Lost.

/3/7c/11098/1.html

This thread is mainly about the infohub at Nova Albion. I made a separate thread a while back about the whole city in general, but it tends to disappear first as it has fewer posts made to it. You can find it here:

/252/96/309092/1.html

There is definitely crossover between the two which is to be expected as it's sometimes a gray area which comments go best where. As it should be I suppose, as the destinies for both are forever intertwined.

I believe the continuation of the Nova Albion Info Hub is best in this thread. Nova Albion is History and this thread shows that. Stick to the road, Stay off the Moores.

City Slickers Meeting Chat Log - Nova Albion Infohub
7 June, 2009 @ 2:00pm SLT (14:00)

Those attending: Salazar Jack, Vampireratz Lupino, PrincessChilehead Masala, Joachim Waydelich, Collie Lindman, SparkleLabs Sideways, Marianne McCann, LisaHot Juran, Lorna Stratten, Mossant Paravane, Osprey Therian, Holocluck Henly and Galileo Moleno

[14:01] Salazar Jack: Welcome everyone!
[14:01] Vampireratz Lupino: thanks salazar..didnt want to intrude lol
[14:01] Salazar Jack: This meeting is probably long overdue.
[14:02] Salazar Jack: No worries. Very casual meeting.
[14:02] Salazar Jack: And I'm looking forward to hearing what folks think about the hub.
[14:02] Salazar Jack: First a bit of history...
[14:03] Salazar Jack: As some of you may know, the city of Nova Albion was discovered by Magellan Linden back in March of 2004.
[14:03] Salazar Jack: Not long after that the resident-owned portions of the city were put up for auction.
[14:03] Salazar Jack: And the first city land owners moved in.
[14:04] Salazar Jack: The city is defined by four main regions...
[14:04] Salazar Jack: Grignano, Sistiana, Barcola and Miramare.
[14:04] Salazar Jack: Two PG regions and two Mature regions.
[14:04] Salazar Jack: Sometimes Luna is considered part of Nova Albion...
[14:04] Salazar Jack: as well as parts of Bonaficio to the east.
[14:05] Salazar Jack: The City Slickers group was started long before the four region infohub area came into being.
[14:05] Salazar Jack: And was made up of city landowners and city dwellers to better Nova Albion.
[14:06] Salazar Jack: There is also a group called Nova Albion Citizens that was created around that time.
[14:06] Salazar Jack: And since then other city-related groups have started and flourished.
[14:06] Salazar Jack: Originally, the hub at Miramare was a small telehub.
[14:07] Salazar Jack: With a rooftop.
[14:07] PrincessChilehead Masala: lawd the tp nearly borked
[14:07] Joachim Waydelich: you ok mas? you are stuck in walking
[14:07] Salazar Jack: It was very small and was just a landing point.
[14:07] PrincessChilehead Masala: no i was stuck in a tp to know where
[14:07] PrincessChilehead Masala: NO
[14:07] PrincessChilehead Masala: haha
[14:07] PrincessChilehead Masala: lord my typonese is getting bad
[14:07] PrincessChilehead Masala: loading up still, love the lag
[14:07] Salazar Jack: When the Lindens decided to abandon the telehubs...
[14:08] Salazar Jack: some were turned into vacant land and auctioned off..
[14:08] Salazar Jack: and some were allowed to live on as Infohubs under resident-group care.
[14:08] Joachim Waydelich: sparkle and collie, loong time no see
[14:08] Salazar Jack: Some of us Nova Albion-ites asked to take on our hub area.
[14:09] Collie Lindman: hi big J
[14:09] SparkleLabs Sideways nods
[14:09] Salazar Jack: We expanded it from the small Miramare parcel to include four corner Linden-owned plots in the middle of the city.
[14:09] Salazar Jack: This was before the Lindens began sending new residents to some of the new infohubs.
[14:10] Salazar Jack: Our main goal was to better tie the city together with a central area.
[14:10] PrincessChilehead Masala: be right with you J, Im on the phone with my mom *sighs*
[14:10] Salazar Jack: And, since it is Linden-owned, provide a place to promote the Lindens info in a place that reflected the surrounding city.
[14:11] Salazar Jack: The hub area was very low key and quiet up to that point.
[14:11] Salazar Jack: It didn't get active until the Lindens started sending new residents there for their first landing point on the Mainland.
[14:11] Salazar Jack: That's when things got busy!
[14:12] Salazar Jack: lol
[14:12] Marianne McCann smiles
[14:12] Marianne McCann grins
[14:12] LisaHot Juran: hehe
[14:12] Salazar Jack: So that's where things started out and where we are now.
[14:12] Salazar Jack: The land is still owned by the Lindens.
[14:12] PrincessChilehead Masala: sparks
[14:12] Joachim Waydelich: thats where i was dumped too when i first started
[14:13] Joachim Waydelich: nova albion still has a special place in my SL heart
[14:13] Salazar Jack: And the City Slickers group takes care of the place, to our ability, at the pleasure of Governor Linden.
[14:13] PrincessChilehead Masala: lol J
[14:13] SparkleLabs Sideways: mas
[14:13] Salazar Jack: But that can all change in an instant.
[14:13] Collie Lindman: hi mas
[14:13] PrincessChilehead Masala: hellos
[14:13] PrincessChilehead Masala: one and all
[14:13] Salazar Jack: My family and I were some of the first land owners here. We won this parcel we're on in the first auctions in the city.
[14:13] PrincessChilehead Masala: sorry im rezzng at the speed of pond water
[14:14] Salazar Jack: And this building has been here ever since.
[14:14] Salazar Jack: How did you all come to be here?
[14:14] Salazar Jack: Collie?
[14:14] LisaHot Juran: REzzed here ...I think everyone here may have
[14:14] Collie Lindman: i was "born" here
[14:14] Lorna Stratten: This was my first place i came to as well
[14:14] PrincessChilehead Masala: I was dumped here as a noobetter, fun fun
[14:15] Mossant Paravane: I stumbled upon a little plot of land for sale - the cafe has been there ever since.
[14:15] SparkleLabs Sideways: if i told you i would have to kill you
[14:15] PrincessChilehead Masala grins at Sparks
[14:15] Salazar Jack: Duly noted!
[14:16] LisaHot Juran: I think though...no matter how we all got here...I think it safe to say everyone here cares for the future of Nova Albion
[14:16] Marianne McCann: I'm kinda an outsider, I s'pose. I started up the way in Ahern. Nova Albion is on my daily travels from my Bay City and Luna store to my home in Shermerville
[14:16] Mossant Paravane: True, Lisa.
[14:16] SparkleLabs Sideways nods in agreement with lisa
[14:16] Salazar Jack: There is a lot of speculation on what will be happening to infohubs from this point on.
[14:16] Salazar Jack: I've not heard much personally.. but have heard some of you voice concerns and imagined possibilities.
[14:17] Salazar Jack: Mari..
[14:17] Salazar Jack: what is happening with hubs in Bay City?
[14:17] Marianne McCann: Well, we have one now... Moose Beach. It just popped up one day, to everyone's surprise
[14:17] Collie Lindman: as there are so many new hubs opening it does spread the new residents
[14:17] Marianne McCann: An another is almost done with construction in Hau Koda. That is the Bay City hub
[14:18] Salazar Jack: So Bay City will have two infohubs?
[14:18] Marianne McCann nods
[14:18] Marianne McCann: The Moose Beach one has been very heavily hit with new folks, not even the Lindens are sure why so many are landing there
[14:18] Salazar Jack: Are they both full regions?
[14:18] Marianne McCann nods
[14:18] LisaHot Juran: Hey Os
[14:18] Mossant Paravane: Hi, Osprey
[14:18] Osprey Therian: phew
[14:18] Marianne McCann: Neither of them will be under the hand of the Bay City Alliance... each will be maintenances' doin
[14:18] Collie Lindman: hi osprey
[14:18] Salazar Jack: Collie, I have read that the spread of new residents at infohubs isn't necessarily so even...
[14:18] Osprey Therian: sorry I'm late
[14:18] LisaHot Juran: Ha ha ha ha - he he he!!! =D
[14:18] Salazar Jack: MAri, didn't you write something about that?
[14:19] Salazar Jack: Hi Osprey!
[14:19] Marianne McCann: Though the Alliance will be able to pass along things to go there at Blondin Lindens discretion
[14:19] Osprey Therian:
[14:19] Salazar Jack: I'll post a full transcript in the forums later...
[14:19] Osprey Therian: ty
[14:19] Marianne McCann: mhm, out in forum land
[14:19] Marianne McCann: Hi Ms Osprey
[14:19] Marianne McCann smiles
[14:19] Osprey Therian: Hello all
[14:19] Collie Lindman: with the way new residents choose where they arrive, i doesn't surprise me that it would be uneven
[14:20] Salazar Jack: Good point...
[14:20] LisaHot Juran: Mari...what are the other full sim hubs that went in?
[14:20] Salazar Jack: if they're choosing then some must be appearing more attractive to new residents over other ones.
[14:20] Marianne McCann: Castle Valeria, DeGrand, Hyannisport, Helfell, and Boardroom. The last of those might be temporary though
[14:20] Marianne McCann: An there's talk of one somewhere near Nautilus City
[14:21] LisaHot Juran: So basically 6 new full sim hubs
[14:21] Marianne McCann: Oh! An the "Safe Hub near Zindra, which is still bein gridded
[14:21] Salazar Jack: All managed by the LDPW?
[14:21] Marianne McCann nods
[14:21] Salazar Jack: Does anyone know for sure if any resident-managed hubs are closing or will be closed?
[14:22] Salazar Jack: Or has anyone heard anything related to that?
[14:22] Collie Lindman: nope
[14:22] Marianne McCann: I do not know for sure, nope. I've only heard rumor from some well-placed peoples
[14:22] Osprey Therian: I haven't heard anything - there are 2 or 3 with missing icons but that's prolly just a glitch.
[14:22] Salazar Jack: What sort of rumors?
[14:22] Marianne McCann: Oh, about Hanson an Bear
[14:23] Salazar Jack: Hmmm.. missing icons... could be.
[14:23] Salazar Jack: What about Hanson and Bear?
[14:23] Marianne McCann: I know Blondin Linden did say on th' forums about "Big Changes coming to Hanson"
[14:23] Salazar Jack: What discussion was that in?
[14:23] Salazar Jack: I'd like to look that up later.
[14:24] Marianne McCann: I wanna say the "Oh No, Infohubs"
[14:24] Salazar Jack: Okay.
[14:24] Salazar Jack: What does everyone think about the current Nova ALbion Infohub?
[14:25] Salazar Jack: Is it important? Is it needed? And why?
[14:25] Salazar Jack: why*
[14:25] Collie Lindman: even if some do close as official hubs, some may continue as NCI properties
[14:25] Salazar Jack: How so, Collie?
[14:25] Salazar Jack: Would the parcels get transferred to NCI?
[14:25] Collie Lindman: land tiers are donated
[14:26] Collie Lindman: so why would they close in places like bear?
[14:26] Salazar Jack: The parcel are Linden-owned right now.
[14:26] Salazar Jack: How do they become property of NCI?
[14:26] SparkleLabs Sideways: um what is nci
[14:26] LisaHot Juran: There is not much info for new residents there now. I would like there to be and have a bit better flow
[14:26] Salazar Jack: New Citizens, Inc.
[14:26] Collie Lindman: adjacent land is donated tier wise
[14:27] Salazar Jack: A resident created and owned group.
[14:27] Salazar Jack: Ah.. I see. They maintain their own land near Linden Infohub land.
[14:27] Osprey Therian: If it's useful for NCI it's useful as a hub.
[14:27] Collie Lindman: yes
[14:28] Salazar Jack: Having good info available for new residents makes it valuable to the Lindens.
[14:28] Marianne McCann slips a note with some URLs to Salazar
[14:28] Salazar Jack: Thanks, Mari.
[14:28] LisaHot Juran: I'd also like to go back to the infrastructure
[14:28] LisaHot Juran: The trolly
[14:28] LisaHot Juran: the canal walls
[14:29] Osprey Therian: I believe in variety - I think a range of sizes and styles is good across the new arrival sites.
[14:29] Collie Lindman: i've often taken new residents to nci properties because there is actually more info in them than at the larger info hubs
[14:29] Salazar Jack: I'd like to talk about the greater Nova ALbion needs at a later time if that is okay.
[14:29] Salazar Jack: I think we need to act on the Infohub issues more urgently.
[14:29] LisaHot Juran: sure
[14:30] Collie Lindman: yes two separate issues
[14:30] LisaHot Juran: Hey Holo
[14:30] Salazar Jack: The Nova Albion Infohub has definitely lacked good info for new residents.
[14:30] Marianne McCann: Hi Holo!
[14:30] Holocluck Henly: hello - people still rezzing.
[14:30] SparkleLabs Sideways raises her hand with a question
[14:30] Salazar Jack: Hit it Sparkle!
[14:31] Osprey Therian: I think a small amount of good info is best - ppl shouldn't use infohubs as a place to get everything
[14:31] SparkleLabs Sideways: do the residents want an info hub here
[14:31] SparkleLabs Sideways: who wants an info hub here
[14:31] Marianne McCann: This is one thing that is looking positive at the Bay City hub. new resources. A place for new folks to adjust appearance. Items to wear an attach, that sort of thing. Not a lot of text, but a lot of things to try
[14:31] Salazar Jack: Good question, Sparkle!
[14:32] Salazar Jack: Why have one?
[14:32] Holocluck Henly: There's also an area which features sights of the area.
[14:32] Holocluck Henly: i mean. you know
[14:32] Marianne McCann nods
[14:32] Galileo Moleno: Traffic there is too centralized and clogged up
[14:32] Galileo Moleno: No t enough people flow through
[14:32] Salazar Jack: Lots to consider.. especially when the hub land shares regions with other residents.
[14:32] Salazar Jack: We've seen what can happen at the Bear Hub.
[14:32] Osprey Therian: I like the life it brings to the city, even if it's chaotic
[14:32] Holocluck Henly: thats the greatest challenge. something like hau koda just isn't possible
[14:32] Collie Lindman: back when traffic meant something to search results sparkles, an info in the area was an attractive thing
[14:33] Salazar Jack: Lisa pointed out...
[14:33] Mossant Paravane: I agree with Osprey - I think it's important to the vitality of the area.
[14:33] Salazar Jack: that there is a void area just south of Grignano..
[14:33] Salazar Jack: that could be used for a full sim hub.
[14:33] Holocluck Henly: it's a pity there's no room for them to make an infohub close by which like hau koda displays info about the local area. unless Dore was intended for that
[14:33] Salazar Jack: Having the hub certainly gave a boost to Nova Albion's population!
[14:33] Salazar Jack: Which I think is a good thing.
[14:34] Osprey Therian: uncouth youth hanging about is TRADITIONAL for cities
[14:34] Salazar Jack: Well, we could do that at the current hub...
[14:34] Mossant Paravane: It also helps to have people there - not just static information.
[14:34] Holocluck Henly: has it impacted your businesses etc?
[14:34] Mossant Paravane: static
[14:34] Salazar Jack: we put in a small local area directory.
[14:34] Salazar Jack: But it is underused.
[14:34] Holocluck Henly: the group of kids hanging out in the same spot etc?
[14:34] Salazar Jack: Here is what each corner of the Nova Albion Infohub was originally made for...
[14:35] Salazar Jack: 1) Miramare - Official Hub Landing Point -- a good place to start when you're new to the city. Find Linden info, help and pointers here.

2) Barcola - City Directory. Research the city's history. Examine artifacts discovered by Magellan Linden. Explore the lost city ruins.

3) Sistiana - Activity Center. Go dumpster diving. Play a game of chess. Get the perfect shot for your profile & leave your mark on the city.

4) Grignano - City Happenings. Find out what's going on in and around the city -- art, culture, performances, special exhibits and events.
[14:35] Osprey Therian: I like it that they hang out - I don't like people targeting newbs tho which happens
[14:35] Salazar Jack: If we were to focus on those it would help make the hub more useful immediately.
[14:36] Marianne McCann: I agree, Osprey. Seems like it's part of city life
[14:36] Salazar Jack: The downside is that to keep the peace... someone needs to be there 24/7. And have the ability to boot really bad griefers.
[14:36] Salazar Jack: Only the Lindens can currently do that.
[14:36] Salazar Jack: Lindens*
[14:37] Salazar Jack: I have read that things are a bit different in the Blake Sea area...
[14:37] Osprey Therian: yup
[14:37] Salazar Jack: that the resident group there does have the ability to boot troublemakers from Linden-owned land.
[14:37] Salazar Jack: Is that true?
[14:38] Holocluck Henly: Well Blake Sea is a cooperative project between SL and a private enterprise
[14:38] Osprey Therian: I probably read what you read - no experience
[14:38] Salazar Jack: That's what we have at Nova ALbion as well...
[14:38] Salazar Jack: in fact this was one of the first cooperative experiments between the Lindens and the residents.
[14:39] SparkleLabs Sideways: there will always be trouble makers, i dont think we will get anywhere if we focus on them, instead why not focus on why that person is not engaged to do something else
[14:39] Salazar Jack: specifically the Nova Albion Infohub set up as being owned by Governor Linden but run by a resident group.
[14:40] Holocluck Henly: Your situation is unique. they didnt expect SL to grow the way it has then, and because it is an active community it isnt a simple matter of buying up land for a sim infohub like they did with Ross
[14:40] Salazar Jack: The City Slickers group does not even have the ability to return objects from the Hub area.
[14:40] Collie Lindman: i think that the miramare hub as a hub lacks anything of interest for new residents and that should be the focal point right now
[14:40] LisaHot Juran writes down that q for blondin
[14:41] Salazar Jack: Indeed Collie...
[14:41] SparkleLabs Sideways: agreed collie
[14:41] Osprey Therian: Blondin has said new abilities like freeze/eject will be forthcoming - maybe other things need to be requested
[14:41] Salazar Jack: That would go a long way to making the overall experience there more positive.
[14:41] Collie Lindman: yes
[14:41] Salazar Jack: What was that Osprey!
[14:41] Salazar Jack: New abilities coming?!?!?
[14:42] Holocluck Henly: I cant imagine that without some sort of training or orientation. still the demigod tools are nice either way
[14:42] Osprey Therian: Blondin said freeze/eject was coming (when I met with him about Ambat)
[14:42] Salazar Jack: Very interesting.
[14:42] Osprey Therian: not ban, but I never care about ban much anyway
[14:42] Salazar Jack: For those of you who don't know this...
[14:43] Salazar Jack: Osprey manages the Ambat Infohub area.
[14:43] Salazar Jack: Can you return objects from the Ambat Infohub area?
[14:43] Salazar Jack: Other than your own?
[14:43] Marianne McCann: Blondin had tried to get similar abilities for the Bay City Alliance or another specific group for the Bay City hub, but "lost that fight," he said.
[14:43] Osprey Therian: not much I can do there, but the griefer prob is not big these days - in the past I could get immediate help, but these days, no
[14:44] Osprey Therian: I had it set no build years ago
[14:44] Salazar Jack: Sounds like the best thing to focus on is along the lines of what Collie has mentioned.
[14:44] LisaHot Juran: I agree with Os that there should be new info at the hubs but not too much. Most people are not into reading as they just got done reading a bunch from help island
[14:44] Salazar Jack: Better more engaging content for residents...
[14:44] Osprey Therian: we had some nasty griefing at one time
[14:44] LisaHot Juran: I also like the hands on
[14:44] LisaHot Juran: interactive
[14:44] Marianne McCann: ya Lisa. An really, I tink folks learn more better by doing
[14:45] LisaHot Juran: Better than a NC
[14:45] Marianne McCann: what you said
[14:45] Salazar Jack: And better communication with the Lindens about their plans, our needs and the mutual interests we have.
[14:45] LisaHot Juran: Yes...And I asked Blondin about that
[14:45] LisaHot Juran: I think he will help us
[14:45] Salazar Jack: Sounds like he is the point person then.
[14:46] Osprey Therian: he is all things hubby at this time
[14:46] Salazar Jack: lol
[14:46] LisaHot Juran: What is his title specifically Mari?
[14:46] Salazar Jack: I never had a hubby before!
[14:46] Salazar Jack: lol
[14:46] Osprey Therian: Dr of Hubology
[14:46] LisaHot Juran: haha
[14:46] Osprey Therian: lol
[14:47] SparkleLabs Sideways: griefing will never stop, if griefing is your biggest concern, and you want tons of new people at the hud, give them easy to understand - interactive info on how to handle/deal with grief
[14:47] Salazar Jack: Currently our hub is managed by the City Slickers group, which is owned by Lisa and me.
[14:47] Salazar Jack: My question is, how should we proceed with managing hub content? And who does what, etc?
[14:47] Collie Lindman: the landing point in nova is very small and not much room for anything much in the way of info. new residents need to be lead away from there to where the info is
[14:48] Osprey Therian: Griefing isn't anyone's biggest concern, it's one of many
[14:48] Salazar Jack: And still respect everyone's contributions, etc.
[14:48] Osprey Therian: we can consider many aspects at once
[14:48] Salazar Jack nods
[14:48] SparkleLabs Sideways: the bots clog the hub, and i didnt know until a few moths ago they were bots
[14:49] Osprey Therian: that's why we are getting eject
[14:49] LisaHot Juran: An idea was put to me by taking the first set of stairs nearest the hub away...keep them from the street at that point
[14:49] Salazar Jack: As a whole I think the Hub should act as a way station, place of orientation and should encourage folks to get out into the city and beyond...
[14:49] Osprey Therian: to get bots out
[14:49] Holocluck Henly: maybe a no soliciting rule for infohubs. apply to have an LM poster in a billboard
[14:49] LisaHot Juran: Yes
[14:49] Osprey Therian: I agree S
[14:49] Collie Lindman: the plot immediately north of the hub (carolines old property) seems to be under nci management
[14:49] Salazar Jack: but still be welcoming and a place folks feel good about that they can meet, chat, sit, etc.
[14:50] Osprey Therian: I see it not as a place to linger but as a place to receive direction
[14:50] Osprey Therian: except for people who just like hanging out
[14:50] SparkleLabs Sideways: i see it as both
[14:50] Galileo Moleno: I think the problem with the hub is that you DO have content there. If you want people to come to the hub and move about the city, Move the content to the city and extend the travel infrastructure to the hub. When they get bored and know there is a way to get somewhere more interesting they will take what ever method of transportation that exists to get to it.
[14:50] Salazar Jack: After all, don't we really want folks to explore the rest of the city and see the rest of Nova Albion?
[14:50] Osprey Therian: I mean new ppl - it should encourage/help them to find what they want
[14:51] Salazar Jack: Good point Galileo.
[14:51] Holocluck Henly: While traffic is good, many times the regions are full. you want a happy medium
[14:51] Marianne McCann: People always hang out, either in a hub or at a First Life mall or wherever. But you can help direct them too. get them to look around a bit,
[14:51] Osprey Therian: and get out and explore, but if ppl want to sit, that's fine
[14:51] Collie Lindman: i think that's a good point too galileo
[14:51] Salazar Jack: What we do can address many things at once, as Osprey mentioned.
[14:51] Osprey Therian: I really don't like masses of freebies etc
[14:52] Holocluck Henly: consider they come from masses of freebies and HI
[14:52] Salazar Jack: HI = Help Island?
[14:52] Holocluck Henly: yes
[14:52] Salazar Jack nods
[14:52] Salazar Jack: Okay.
[14:53] Collie Lindman: possibly some kind of sign post is needed? or sign posts around the city?
[14:53] Salazar Jack: Let's draw this meeting to a close by 3:00...
[14:53] Salazar Jack: We can continue discussion in the Nova Albion group forum threads.
[14:53] Salazar Jack: Let's do this...
[14:54] Salazar Jack: 1) Find out what the immediate plans are for resident run infohubs so we can plan, make preparations, talk to the Lindens and try to see what our options are.
[14:54] Osprey Therian: I give out a n/c at Ambat with landmarks for noobie-helpful places and places of interest - but I read about a kind of random-fun-place lm giver Prokofy has that sounds like a good idea too
[14:55] Salazar Jack: 2) Draft a proposal for the Nova Albion Infohub and what we'd like to do with it.
[14:55] Salazar Jack: That we can present to the Lindens and get their blessing.
[14:55] Collie Lindman: there is an excellent picture LM giver at perriwinkle
[14:55] Holocluck Henly: Does Blondin follow your discussion in the forum?
[14:56] Holocluck Henly: if he doesnt someone should send an Email or notecard
[14:56] LisaHot Juran: so far no Linden has been there since Torley
[14:56] Salazar Jack: He has been participating on some things, but I don't know if he has been following the Nova Albion threads specifically.
[14:56] Holocluck Henly: Blondin would be your go to person
[14:56] Salazar Jack: Right.
[14:56] Holocluck Henly: his role among other things are special areas like NA
[14:56] Marianne McCann: Blondin has followed the "Oh No, Infohubs to some extent. but not much in the last couple
[14:56] Holocluck Henly: community events and such
[14:57] Salazar Jack: Lisa and I, as the City Slicker leaders, will present our proposal to Blondin then. after we formulate our plan in the forums.
[14:58] Salazar Jack: For those of you who haven't seen it, it is here...
[14:58] Salazar Jack: /252/1.html
[14:58] Osprey Therian: Yes better to winnow the ideas down to a concise list
[14:59] Salazar Jack: So everyone keep your antennas up and record any findings about Infohubs in that forum.
[14:59] SparkleLabs Sideways nods
[14:59] Salazar Jack: Also all ideas, opinions, etc.
[14:59] Salazar Jack: And we'll whittle them down.
[14:59] Marianne McCann grins
[14:59] LisaHot Juran: Land owner or not...If you care...then please state your opinion or idea
[15:00] Osprey Therian: I need to run will watch for the transcript
[15:00] Salazar Jack: Thanks everyone!
[15:00] LisaHot Juran: Byee Os
[15:00] Mossant Paravane: Bye, Osprey
[15:00] Osprey Therian: bye!
[15:00] Salazar Jack: Feel free to stay and chat if you like.
[15:00] Galileo Moleno: Bye

[15:00] Salazar Jack: Any questions or comments?
[15:00] Marianne McCann: Glad to see this sorta discussion happenin
[15:00] SparkleLabs Sideways: i am happy to help out with anything
[15:01] Collie Lindman: the forum url if anyone needs it is /252/1.html
[15:01] Marianne McCann: An good to see, as a Bay Citizen
[15:01] Holocluck Henly: Yes.
[15:01] Salazar Jack: The more we know about the Lindens think about Infohubs the better.
[15:01] Salazar Jack: We need the facts.
[15:01] Salazar Jack: And we need to present a plan to them that they can get behind.
[15:01] LisaHot Juran: yes...I'm gonna try and pin Blondin down on that
[15:02] Galileo Moleno: I new and don;t know a lot of this area but it seems to me that because land value here is so high concentrating on newbies for commerce and population is almost limited to those who skyrocket to the upper echelon of SL
[15:02] Galileo Moleno: Not going to be a high percentage
[15:02] SparkleLabs Sideways: gotta run, nice to see you all
[15:02] Salazar Jack: Are you calling me a "blue blood!!?!?!?!??!"
[15:02] Salazar Jack: lol
[15:02] Galileo Moleno: Maybe focus needs to be changed
[15:02] Collie Lindman: lol salazar
[15:02] Salazar Jack: Indeed.
[15:02] Mossant Paravane: I get a lot of newbies at the cafe.
[15:03] Salazar Jack: We have a lot of interesting history that we can present to new residents.
[15:03] Galileo Moleno: I have a moderate amount of land and even if I liquidated all of it I couldn't move here
[15:03] Salazar Jack: residents*
[15:03] Mossant Paravane: They are just glad to have someone to talk with and a place to do things and get info.
[15:03] Salazar Jack: And connections to other areas of the Grid that they might find useful.
[15:03] Mossant Paravane: But now, I'm surrounded by vast tracts of empty land.
[15:03] Galileo Moleno: Because of the price
[15:03] Marianne McCann nods
[15:03] Mossant Paravane: People don't want to hang around the city if nothings there
[15:03] Salazar Jack: Well.. something's gotta give.
[15:04] Galileo Moleno: Hold
[15:04] LisaHot Juran: Yes Mossant...That is what I get when you get a little further away from the hub itself
[15:04] Salazar Jack: That land just can't stay empty for very long.
[15:04] Marianne McCann: This is an issue we've has in Bay City and Shermerville too, to a lesser extent
[15:04] Galileo Moleno: There is plenty here and its beautiful but
[15:04] Mossant Paravane: It will, though, Sal
[15:04] LisaHot Juran: they are more into knowledge than just hanging out
[15:04] Holocluck Henly: New residents fly far. I often get passersby in BC Falconmoon - wherever they see a dot away from the crowd but in frame.
[15:04] Salazar Jack: Or should I say forever.
[15:04] Mossant Paravane: He priced it out of anyone's reach
[15:04] Galileo Moleno: This area is being undercut by comparative value from other sims
[15:04] Holocluck Henly: thats several regions from moosehead beach
[15:05] Mossant Paravane: I'd love to see a vibrant, diverse city centre
[15:05] Holocluck Henly: my own experience next to the infohub yesterday explained why theyd feel more comfortable away from the hub LOL griefers in a rezz zone
[15:05] Salazar Jack: At some point one would think that whoever selling it would have to get tired and move on. Are they all willing to just hang on to it for eternity?
[15:05] LisaHot Juran: hehe...That is what I would like to see once again too Mossant
[15:06] Holocluck Henly: if they want to get rid of it, why do they price it US$1000
[15:06] LisaHot Juran: I think Friday just may have the nack for eternity
[15:06] LisaHot Juran: He seems rather spiteful
[15:06] Collie Lindman: i think so salazar. tier prices mean nothing compared with land value
[15:06] Salazar Jack: Friday's situation is a bit different..
[15:06] Marianne McCann: I know f'r some of us in the younger city to your west, we look to Nova Albion - and the 'slickers - as a model for what we do
[15:06] Salazar Jack: Friday was one of the first Nova Albion land owners.
[15:06] LisaHot Juran: yup
[15:06] Salazar Jack: As was the Clover park group here in Grignano.
[15:07] Holocluck Henly nods. your area was the first mainland with a character from my view. not a rules thing like luskwood but from residents by and for
[15:07] Salazar Jack: They had a vested interest in Nova Albion and we're just land flippers.
[15:07] Mossant Paravane: Well, I'm not going anywhere.
[15:07] Mossant Paravane: I like it here.
[15:07] LisaHot Juran: =D Good to hear!
[15:08] Salazar Jack: It was interesting as we were all mostly strangers when we won our auction plots here.
[15:08] Salazar Jack: There was no cohesive reason for us to do anything together.
[15:08] Holocluck Henly: wow Jack you tilled virgin land?
[15:08] Salazar Jack: Pretty much. It was divided up by the Linden roads and canals...
[15:09] Salazar Jack: so we had to "color within the lines" so to speak.
[15:09] Marianne McCann smiles
[15:09] Salazar Jack: But, unlike Bay City... we can subdivide and join our parcels if we want.
[15:09] Salazar Jack: They are still separated by Linden land though.
[15:09] Holocluck Henly: we cant?
[15:10] Marianne McCann: Nope, Holo
[15:10] Holocluck Henly: I never tried but LOL
[15:10] Salazar Jack: I don't think you can in Bay City.
[15:10] LisaHot Juran: Ha ha ha ha - he he he!!! =D
[15:10] Holocluck Henly: if i wanted different media on my land i would need to make a ticket? meh
[15:10] Salazar Jack: And we also can't terraform city land.. although one seemed to accomplish that in Miramare a while back... he lowered his land with the help of a Linden I think.
[15:11] LisaHot Juran: mmm...I tink I know
[15:11] Holocluck Henly: i never tried in shermerville but seeing how consistent it is i'll assume suburban land too
[15:11] Salazar Jack: Just east of the landing point parcel.
[15:11] LisaHot Juran: ya huh
[15:11] Marianne McCann: I tried Holo. No diggin there neither
[15:11] LisaHot Juran: wink
[15:11] Salazar Jack: I think Shermerville is no terraform also.
[15:11] Holocluck Henly: thats ok
[15:11] Salazar Jack: lol
[15:11] Mossant Paravane: True. I own in Shermerville Central - no terraforming.
[15:12] Holocluck Henly: just wished theyd return the griefer prims littering the neighbors
[15:12] LisaHot Juran: Sal I will get with you and try to formulate an outline...things we need to know for the HUB..
[15:12] Marianne McCann is in Shermerville NW
[15:12] Collie Lindman: what IS a city? a centre for thriving commerce? a gathering of a high population? the two things are dependent on one another. since we don't yet know what the linden plans are hubwise and as businesses seem to be disappearing, it's time to look into new approaches to bring back city life
[15:12] Mossant Paravane: I agree,Collie
[15:12] Holocluck Henly: ironic i escape the city to be here
[15:12] Holocluck Henly: heh!
[15:13] Salazar Jack: Now.. THAT is something I think we should have the ability to do. All city land owners should be able to return non-linden objects from Linden-owned land.
[15:13] Holocluck Henly: it's cleaner in NA
[15:13] Galileo Moleno: Bay City has transformed into Upper class suburban sleep community because of the land costs
[15:13] LisaHot Juran am tired of all that vacuuming i did at the parade
[15:13] Salazar Jack: Okay, Lisa.
[15:13] LisaHot Juran: TY Holo
[15:13] Holocluck Henly: that wont happen but with an organized group a focus of several ARs brings results
[15:13] Holocluck Henly: lol lisahot re vacuuming
[15:13] Marianne McCann: Suburban sleep?
[15:13] Marianne McCann giggles
[15:13] Salazar Jack: Collie, maybe it's having events?
[15:14] Salazar Jack: Maybe that's part of it.
[15:14] LisaHot Juran: AR's get heard within a few minutes for me here
[15:14] Salazar Jack: Like the parade.
[15:14] Collie Lindman: i agree salazar
[15:14] LisaHot Juran: Like the Music festival I HOPE to have
[15:14] Holocluck Henly: i ARed an encroaching prim twice for shermerville and no one's taken it away
[15:14] LisaHot Juran: onto who's land
[15:14] Holocluck Henly: the crossmarks must be RIGHT on the other border
[15:14] Collie Lindman: the 5th anniversary showed that events are supported
[15:15] Salazar Jack nods
[15:15] Marianne McCann: yup. Same with the 1st in Bay City
[15:15] Holocluck Henly: it also shows you're not just a random bunch of residents in some regions
[15:15] Salazar Jack: The current limit is what.. 30 avatars in a region at once?
[15:15] Salazar Jack: So the most Nova Albion can support at any given time is about 140 souls.
[15:15] LisaHot Juran: appears that Moose can handle 50
[15:15] Galileo Moleno: Question?
[15:16] Holocluck Henly: and it's still full
[15:16] Salazar Jack: Galileo?
[15:16] Holocluck Henly: moose is info only of course
[15:16] Galileo Moleno: Are there public rez zones to be able to drive the drre cars or boats here?
[15:16] Galileo Moleno: the free cars and boats
[15:16] Salazar Jack: There used to be at the Infohub.
[15:16] LisaHot Juran: Barcola roads are rezzable
[15:16] LisaHot Juran: but not in the hub itself
[15:16] Galileo Moleno: You need to get them around the city
[15:16] Salazar Jack: But build was turned off there by the Lindens to help with griefers.
[15:16] Galileo Moleno: People need to come here to sight see
[15:17] Salazar Jack: This building has a vehicle rez strip next to the street.
[15:17] Salazar Jack: So it depends on city landowners to provide those it seems.
[15:17] Galileo Moleno: The routes in Heterocera have then and they are not crowded of griefedas far as I can tell
[15:17] Salazar Jack: That's the easiest way for us to provide them without depending on the Lindens.
[15:17] LisaHot Juran: I think that can be part of the Nova Albion proposal once we get there
[15:17] Marianne McCann: Galileo - those aren't infohubs either, are they?
[15:18] Galileo Moleno: I came here my self sight seeing
[15:18] Galileo Moleno: No
[15:18] Collie Lindman: i have a suggestion there galileo. in wonderful denmark, they have placed a bicycle stand for free cycles that you wear. no need to rez. mas and joachim will remember, lol
[15:18] LisaHot Juran: do you own here now Galileo?
[15:18] Galileo Moleno: Rely on the search tool for info
[15:18] Salazar Jack: The Lindens have made rez zones next to roads in the past. That aren't necessarily part of an infohub.
[15:18] Galileo Moleno: I was trying to buy but can't afford the astronomical prices
[15:18] Salazar Jack: There is one in Noyo at the end of the highway.
[15:19] LisaHot Juran: and one just on the other side of the bridge to BC
[15:19] Galileo Moleno: My point is there are many ways to de-centralize incoming population bet there has to be a reason for experienced residents to return
[15:19] Holocluck Henly: as long as a rez zone has a return timer it should still keep griefing to a minimum shouldnt it?
[15:19] Galileo Moleno: Not just learn and leave
[15:20] Salazar Jack: It would help if they were more intuitive... you should be able to rez a boat at a dock, right?
[15:20] Collie Lindman: good point galileo
[15:20] Galileo Moleno: Yes
[15:20] Galileo Moleno: The boat yard would be ideal
[15:20] LisaHot Juran: yes...1 min rez should be enough to sit in it
[15:20] Galileo Moleno: Same with the airport
[15:21] Galileo Moleno: a parking garage that doubles as a car rez point
[15:21] Galileo Moleno: You want it to be Fun!
[15:21] Salazar Jack: Well, the other side of that coin is that a lot of damage can be done in less that a minute if one knows what they are doing.
[15:21] Galileo Moleno: and they will come back
[15:21] Salazar Jack: But that is just part of city life!
[15:21] Holocluck Henly looks outside
[15:21] LisaHot Juran: YES! and that is what I would like to see. City life back here
[15:21] Holocluck Henly: hope not!
[15:21] Galileo Moleno: The rez points in Heterocera were install by the lindens
[15:22] Galileo Moleno: They put a link to the railway station here for me
[15:22] Galileo Moleno: That is how I originally got here
[15:22] LisaHot Juran: events I hope can happen.
[15:22] Salazar Jack: Galileo, so there is a link at a railway station on the Heterocera continent for Nova Albion?
[15:23] Salazar Jack: continent*
[15:23] Galileo Moleno: There are sim owners that are providing low cost housing all over the grid
[15:23] Galileo Moleno: One is offering rezzed sky boxes that are full featured and transformable into 8 different themes
[15:24] Galileo Moleno: No premium account needed
[15:24] Galileo Moleno: price 800 L per week
[15:24] Galileo Moleno: 1 week free when you pay for 4
[15:24] Galileo Moleno: Tough to support high land prices against that
[15:24] Holocluck Henly: tier is cheaper for 512
[15:24] Holocluck Henly: esp with getting 1200 back
[15:25] Galileo Moleno: But you get now where near the place
[15:25] Salazar Jack: There have been efforts to rent housing and shops in Nova ALbion in the past.. not so much lately it seems.
[15:25] Galileo Moleno: Fully furnished
[15:25] Galileo Moleno: No need to buy anything nut your clothes
[15:25] Salazar Jack: There used to be large apartment complexes here in Grignano and in Miramare.
[15:25] Salazar Jack: And Barcola.
[15:25] Salazar Jack: Tiger's Towers
[15:26] Galileo Moleno: I am not saying it has to be done here
[15:26] Salazar Jack: Catherine Cotton's Apartments
[15:26] LisaHot Juran: well...I think the lag from being the busiest HUB in Sl halted that ..but now it could work again. Too bad Armidi doesn't see they could be making money
[15:26] Galileo Moleno: I am just telling you what you are up against
[15:26] Salazar Jack: Right.. I was just being nostalgic.
[15:26] Collie Lindman: peanuts to armidi though
[15:27] LisaHot Juran: peanuts maybe...but a good deed by them if they did.
[15:27] Galileo Moleno: I was buying to develop and flip but the market everywhere has imploded
[15:27] Galileo Moleno: Not here, but everywhere else
[15:28] Galileo Moleno: The big land brokers are struggling to support prices
[15:28] Salazar Jack: I see Nova Albion as a very historical area with a lot of name recognition. A place that could showcase the Grid's history and provide info to visitors on the city and connecting points to other areas across the Mainland, especially given it's connection to Magellan Linden.
[15:28] Galileo Moleno: often if they are not minding the store prices go as low as 2.8L / sqM
[15:29] Salazar Jack: Hold events here.
[15:29] Galileo Moleno: They only offer 2? /sqM
[15:29] Mossant Paravane: I like the idea, Sal
[15:29] LisaHot Juran: yes...that is the best path Sal.. Use what NA is known for
[15:29] Marianne McCann: I definitely agree!
[15:29] Holocluck Henly: you know, a vast majority of Sl dont know about this area - BC, NA, Suburbs, etc.
[15:29] Salazar Jack: A mix of stores, homes, entertainment venues
[15:29] Salazar Jack: Exactly Holocluck!
[15:30] Collie Lindman: again, i'd like to mention the wonderful denmark sim as an example. there are no residential plots there and commerce is not in the form of shops. buildings are sponsored by RL companies. it has a real feeling of a town. that idea could be used with some of the empty land that seems to be the trend in nova atm
[15:30] Salazar Jack: This could be a very dense and interesting place with a lot of depth if we were to capitalize on it.
[15:30] Holocluck Henly: if i could afford land i'd love to put something down of interest. lol that wont happen
[15:31] Salazar Jack: I'll have to check out denmark.
[15:31] Holocluck Henly: it seems theres people who want big money, people who want to make bigger money most likely to buy them
[15:32] Salazar Jack: It's a very interesting challenge to build a city on the Mainland with a bunch of strangers...
[15:32] Galileo Moleno: Are you just looking for traffic for traffic's sake or are you looking for commerce? Commerce will only come from those who are stake holders here. Items for sale here need to be competitively prices with other regions but discounted for the bay City "stakeholder", other wise there is no incentive to become one.
[15:32] Salazar Jack: The process goes much faster in a private estate.
[15:33] Salazar Jack: I think you will find that questioned answered a bit differently by each city resident you ask.
[15:33] Holocluck Henly: was thinking about galileo's statement and along those lines: the pitch is "it's near an infohub" well new residents wont be big spenders for such a pitch and will people have something for their use? the whole infohub proximity pitch for luxury land seems an illusion
[15:33] Salazar Jack: Personally, I've no need for traffic or commerce.
[15:33] Galileo Moleno: Maybe, and if that is the case then It is time to build a consensus one way or the other
[15:34] Mossant Paravane: I give everything away for free; I just like the idea of a community with some vitality.
[15:34] Salazar Jack: But I would like to see Nova Albion become a vibrant area of the Mainland.
[15:34] Salazar Jack: I want to see it continue to exist and have meaning.
[15:34] LisaHot Juran: yup. A venue even for different events
[15:35] Salazar Jack: I mean, this was the lost city discovered by Magellan Linden.
[15:35] Salazar Jack: What does that mean?
[15:35] Holocluck Henly: as someone who's looked from the outside and felt a special affinity, it says to me a modern downtown area, large modern structures, some shorter with character like these brownstones hinting a backstory.
[15:35] Galileo Moleno: I am being called away
[15:36] Galileo Moleno: be right back, I think
[15:36] Salazar Jack: And what does that mean for the rest of the Mainland and the Grid as a whole.
[15:36] LisaHot Juran: haha
[15:36] Collie Lindman: i think "community" is the way to go. events etc. if an area is popular, commerce will exist creating more popularity. a snowball effect
[15:36] LisaHot Juran: yes...
[15:36] Holocluck Henly: what i liked was even before october there was a minimum of adfarm presence here
[15:36] Marianne McCann: I look at Nova Albion, as well as its neighbors, ads a very special part of the Grid. Not exactly the cradle of civilization that is Da Boom, but a place with a rich and vibrant history
[15:37] Salazar Jack: Here in Nova Albion specifically?
[15:37] Holocluck Henly: i dont know daboom
[15:37] Marianne McCann: With both older established and historical places, and younger, growing locations
[15:37] Holocluck Henly: private islands dont count if it is one
[15:37] LisaHot Juran: Some parcels in Sistiana had big ones and Dotcom had his stuff
[15:37] Salazar Jack: lol
[15:37] Marianne McCann: Da Boom - the first region on the grid
[15:37] Salazar Jack: DaBoom was the ULTIMATE private island!
[15:38] Marianne McCann giggles
[15:38] Mossant Paravane: Gentrified. I see this area as the core of the city...a little seedy, a little run-down, but where the heart of the community is.
[15:38] Holocluck Henly: i thought it was a color one?
[15:38] Holocluck Henly: like mauve or something
[15:38] Salazar Jack: It was the first region the Lindens' gridded.
[15:38] Marianne McCann: Nope. SF sims came first
[15:38] Marianne McCann: Then the color regions
[15:38] Salazar Jack: It's the oldest region on the Mainland.
[15:38] Marianne McCann: Learned that in history class
[15:38] Marianne McCann grins
[15:38] Collie Lindman:
[15:39] Holocluck Henly: where it says web page? looks like a lot of open spaces
[15:39] Salazar Jack: It's.. the place my family fled to when the Great Erase hit.
[15:39] Marianne McCann: Ya, that's where Web lives
[15:39] Holocluck Henly: great erase?
[15:39] Collie Lindman: history classes holo
[15:40] Salazar Jack: It was a big disaster that happened about 40 years before the Lindens arrived here.
[15:40] Holocluck Henly: yeh i'll speak with marianne later LOL
[15:40] Salazar Jack nods
[15:40] LisaHot Juran: ok
[15:40] Salazar Jack: Well, lots to think about!
[15:40] Collie Lindman: indeed
[15:40] LisaHot Juran: the plan here is to gather ideas...and form a plan of action
[15:40] Salazar Jack: I'll post this chat log to the forums in a few minutes.

Ok…I am hoping we can start the plan for the Nova Albion Info hub with a simple outline. Please feel free to suggest ideas or comment on one of the topics below. How to make them better. Things to add things to remove. The full idea here is to provide an easily learnable environment for new residents.
So the following are the original plans for the 4 corners of the HUB.

Miramare…The official landing point of the HUB and a good place to start when you are new to the city. Find Linden info, help and pointers here.

Barcola…City Directory. Research the cities history, examine artifacts discovered by Magellan Linden. Explore the lost city ruins.

Sistiana…Activity Center. Go Dumpster diving. Play a game of chess. Get the perfect shot for your profile and leave your mark on the city graffiti wall.

Grignano…City Happenings and events. Find out what is going on around the city. Art, Culture, performances or special exhibits.

What can be made different using these definitions?

One of the original ideas of the NA hub was to have each corner be an actual entry point. That never occured as Miramare has always been the entry. What if we set something that will direct residents to "set home here" to one of the other Pergolitas? That way you will have more experienced residents coming into the Hub and not clogging up Miramare.

This is not accurate. The Miramare landing point was always planned as the only landing point and that folks would proceed from there to other parts of the Hub. That being said, it is an interesting idea to spread the landings among the other four sections of the hub. What are the benefits and drawbacks (if any) of that type of routing?

Oh you know... the more that I think about that, it's possible that it was floated to have landing points at all four region corner parcels. It does make sense to do that in some scenarios. G'al! this discussion sure does bring back the memories!

HAHA...you told me that yrself Sal. In anycase I think it would first help in the distribution of traffic. In each pergolita there can be further info...idk...more expanded info to take them around the city and beyond.

Sorry I missed the meeting. I confused a cancelled meeting at BC with the NA meeting, so thought the NA meeting was cancelled. Bah.

Since I see NA as the capital city of Second Life and the infohub as a major subway station, I'm not sure whether to make comments here or in the other forum (NA present and future).

For now, let me simply say that NA without an infohub is like Chicago without an airport. Take away the infohub and NA becomes Gary, Indiana. The core issue, therefore, is not whether NA should have an infohub but what can be done to revitalize NA in general.

Needless to say, moving the infohub in its entirety to another location would cause a massive change in land values, which, as a major investor in NA, would knock me clean out of the city. Alternatively, I know of a potential investor who might be willing to buy all the Clover Boardwalk land (though not at its current price of 2x market value) if the infohub were improved.

That's a nice perspective, Deltango. Nova Albion as the capitol city of Second Life. It certainly paints a picture of what Nova Albion could be to the residents of the Grid. I would like to see the central four corner hub stay as an official infohub and do all that we can to improve it and make it valuable to land owners and visitors alike. I think your comments here are fine, as they relate more to the hub. But please expand on your thoughts for all of Nova Albion in the other thread as I'd be most interested in hearing about them.

Nova Albion - The City
What is it and why is it important?

General info about the city and how that can relate to what we use the current infohub area for in the future.

1) The Lost City was discovered by the explorer Magellan Linden on March 23, 2004. Magellan was last seen in Nova Albion at the 2nd Anniversary ceremony on 23 March, 2006. Many locations across the Mainland are associated with him, either indirectly or as a direct result of his ongoing exploration of the SL Grid. We could expand on records concerning his travels in the Barcola section of the Hub, close to the exhibits of his photos and the ruins from the previous Nova Albion.

2) Comprised of four main neighborhoods; Barcola (Mature), Miramare (PG), Grignano (PG) and Sistiana (Mature). Also includes the Luna Oaks Galleria shopping center (Luna), western Bonaficio and the Orientation Stations - in the Castle (western Dore). We could take advantage of the proximity to the Orientation Stations in Dore and direct folks there, instead of trying to provide that type of content at the Nova Albion Infohub itself. The Nova Albion Infohub area is pretty unique for a resident-run infohub. It sits on the four corners of Nova Albion and contains a parcel in each one. This is similar to the setup at the Ahern Welcome Area. The current hub was designed to visibly tie the four main regions of the city together and serve as a unique and distinguishing landmark.

3) Bordered by 6 full regions of navigable water. The city proper has many canals and small bridges. A large bridge connects Nova Albion to Bay City to the west, another connects the city to Shermerville to the north and a third connects it to a road in Dore that leads directly to the Ahern Welcome Area. The large amount of local waterways could be possible locations for boat races, regattas, merfolk events?

4) An electric trolley normally runs between the Luna Oaks Galleria in Luna to the Ahern Welcome Area in Dore on a rail line. The trolley has been disabled of late and it's unclear whether repairs are being made or not. JIRA entry here:
http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/MISC-1836

(Just added my vote to this one. Thanks for opening the issue, Mari!)

4) One ungridded void region south of Grignano. Possible expansion? Site for full region infohub? A unexplored southeast water passage to the rest of the Mainland? The use for this space may be open to negotiation with the Lindens. It looks like Bay City will have two infohub area (Moose Beach and Hau Koda). Both are full region areas. Hau Koda is being built as an airport with obvious opportunity for ties to travel to other parts of the Mainland. Perhaps it will be patterned on the Abbotts Aerodrome with it's automated aircraft trips to other areas of the Grid. Nova Albion could have a similar set up south of Grignano, but as a maritime port of call instead of an airport. My vote for the area south of Grignano would be for simply open water, similar to those regions above Miramare and Barcola, that would somehow connect with the inland seas of Murray and Smith or Kapor and Rosedale.

5) Was one of the first cities on the Mainland. Was the first city on the Mainalnd where the Lindens offered twice the normal number of prims for the same tier. That and it's history/name recognition are one of the reasons that land is so expensive here. Even with the addition of Bay City and Nautilus, there are not a lot of places like that on the Mainland.

6) Local neighbors; Ahern Welcome Area to the east, Shermerville suburbs to the north, Channel Island Asylum and Bay City to the west, Luna Oaks Galleria to the south. Nexus Prime to the southeast and DarkWood to the northeast. These areas are all noteworthy and some have quite a history going back to the earliest days of the SL Grid. Perhaps a cooperative project or series of events that highlight each region and the relationship between them? We have done things with Bay City and Shermerville in the past.

Connections with other places. Connections with other people. Connections with things that interest them. Forming a connection with Nova Albion. Those who first rez here already have a connection... it's their "home." But where do they go from here? The City is a good place to start. Get them familiar with the City and the surrounding area and then they can be pointed to other points on the Grid that have a connection to Nova Albion.

Thank Salazar for posting these transcripts. I'm encouraged that our signal to noise ratio is still high enough that the discussion can be public.

A few of the discussion topics resonated with me:

- What is an SL city?
=============

There are many answers, but for me it is simply a localized concentration of diverse culture and opportunities, with enough regular residents to feel stable, but enough visitors and turnover of content to feel alive. To me this means taking care not to exclude within city limits the very possibilities that SL makes available, but instead embracing and encouraging ideas to incubate further.

- What can a citizen run group do?
=====================

From a "Keep our city clean" perspective, being able to return objects would appear to be important low hanging fruit. In Nova there are coins and globes stuck up in the air at parcel borders right now in Sistina for a week+. It is already demonstrably slipping between cracks, and residents, visitors, and lindens would each be well served if litter could be addressed quickly and cheaply.

Lisa keyed on the same observation I did: Salazar's sketch of categories is interesting!
Condensed even further they might be:

1) New vistor content and information
2) History, Mythology, Conservation
3) Persistent Interactive activities
4) Rotating events, news portals

When I read this I tend to draw comparison to government-run National Historical Parks in urban cities, as I have some experience with this. I can mentally envision a safe visitor center, with various kinds of media available, coupled with a variety of methods to transport visitors out into the surrounding city:

-smart maps/ locator HUDs

- a colored path on the sidewalks to follow, marked with things of interest with different media - written, audio, visual

- teleporters, canal boats, bus/train/trolly as resources permit to allow access both to destinations, but also tell the story of the city on the way.


Keep the content flowing
===============

Easy public rezzing did provide a key resource necessary for a living city - a source of constantly new, updating content that new residents and vistors could feel a part of. Nova doesn't have this with static shops, or with most static land parcels. With less opportunities now for public rezzing, it may be helpful to look at other ways to provide some feeling of dynamism:

- Running contests , competitions, or simply accepting proposals for temporary (weeks-long) build ideas, where selected projects can recruit interested people into temporary build groups specifically for this purpose. This could be similar in purpose to some of the cool things the city slickers do for the park in grigano, but ideally would be open to wider participation. Parks, galleries, art, stores, almost anything could be done this way.

- Allowing responsible community leaders the ability to enable or disable build areas for limited times (scripted timer?), when they choose to be in the area and feel willing to keep an eye on things.


PrivateLand
=========

The private land *is* overpriced now and in some cases frustratingly dull, but I don't think its a cause for concern yet. As we've seen in recent weeks with the number of parcels for sale, a number of parcel owners do have an awareness of changes in the city and are reacting to it. This can only lead to further changes.



Hope this helps,
-Arrehn

The infohub has a dock area under the bridge that goes to Barcola. We could create an automated City Slickers City Tour boat that starts and ends at the hub dock.

The hub land belongs to Governor Linden.

All the Nova Albion land owners share the resources with the hub land.

The City Slicker group has the ability to manage aspects of the hub at the pleasure of the Lindens. It is not our right and the situation could change at a moment's notice (or with no notice at all). What we do there should benefit the Lindens, Nova Albion's residents and the folks who visit.

How do we do that?

What are the benefits to the Lindens?

How does what we do at the hub benefit Nova Albion land owners?

What should/do the visitors get out of it?

Sal I love the idea of possible boat races. There is alot of space. But the waters are openspace sims and may get complicated...But I LIKE IT!
And the tour boat is also a great idea. Would get them to the places you mentioned for further reference...have an LM giver at the highlights.