We need THREE types of Sim ? Rationale and suggestion

Your right.

And that absolutely wasn't my point.

It made it an issue. But it was happening already. Now that people know its profitable and a good arangement, they will keep doing it. It will just be more awkward to do now, not impossible. Pandora's box cannot be shut so easily.

I disagree. Sometimes markets, particularly those that have grown complacent and predictable need to be shaken up. Stagnation is death.

Well, it's not really profitable without the tools. The devil is in the details. It was too awkward before to be profitable or even desirable.

The problem with the latest functionality is that it makes it doable / profitable / desirable.

Perhaps in extreme cases, I really don't think SL is 'stagnating' though.

I disagree. It was. Starting to, that is.

Well, maybe you should check out the A'ksha sims.

If there are a better set of sims in all of SL that has a higher average set of quality content built by people who hardly know each other, I'd really like to see them.

I've seen them. I agree, they look nice.

Which has jack-all what to do with my point, Blaze? Hell, if anything it supports my point.

Well, I think its a sign that SL is not stagnating.

And perhaps you should ask yourself, why is Anshe advocating private sims going to auction?

The reason the Aksha sims came into being was because Anshe expected LL to play fair and not screw her over with sudden, random jolting changes.

A reasonable expectation.

After we explained to our tax advisor how land in Second Life works and what we do there he brought up the notion of a pyramid scheme. A pyramid scheme is when the first people who invest in something turn a profit, but those who come late and end up holding the bucket are bitten by the dogs. That made Anshe chew so hard on her pencil that now it looks as if it had encountered her tiger avatar.

Both of us didn't agree with the guy. But it stresses the point you are trying to make about reputation and trust surrounding Linden Lab and Second Life. It is vital stuff that a business like them has to be aware of.

In order.

SL isn't stagnating. I bought into your over-generalization, when I shouldn't have. Parts of it were, however. The land market being one of them.

Anshe advocates a situation that would increase land-sale profits. This doesn't surprise me in the least. She already HAS her private sims. A ton of them. Why should she care over-much if nobody else is allowed to get some? That helps her as much as it hurts her, if nothing else. And she can always go back to being a mainland baron.

The A'kasha sims are nice, but they aren't anything magical. They came about because of hard work of other people. Anshe was just a facilitator... If she wasn't there to do it, someone else would, eventually. Nor were they the first that had their level of quality.

Not, really, a resonable expectation for anyone who has any experience with online games.

Well, I was talking about the land market not stagnating and felt the aksha sims were an example of that. I don't think I was "over generalizing".

And yes, if SL is just another online game then you're quite right - an unreasonable expectation.

Yeah, you are absolutely right.

In every game I've been to exist a bunch of forum whiners who think the game is too hard. They lobby for more loot, more powerful weapons or cheaper land.

Once the game devs give in and give them all the stuff they begged for, the pitch of the whining changes. Now they whine about how boring the game is, that there is no more challenge and that the good old days are gone. This is the time they jump ship and move to the next cool game. Not long and there the same begging for easier levels, more loot and cheaper stuff starts all over.

SL is "just another" online thing. Game, no. But it's still an online environment. And the fact that SL isn't just an "online game" means you should expect this to be even more unstable. Because it's still being figured out, what works, what doesn't. You can't expect it to NOT be unstable.

Guni, this was never supposed to be "Land Grab 2000". It's not an economics game. It's not even a game , though most of us use that term to avoid having to call it a "thingy" or a "whatsit" or something. It has nothing to do with "the game being too hard". It has everything to do with the experience being ruined by a few people who think that their enjoyment of the economic game that they made SL into should override the concerns of the rest of the players. 99% of the people who came here did not come here for the land-buying 'game'. Said 'game' has cost more accounts than this change could ever hope to.

Interesting thought, but I might wonder if LL fully agrees, considering that "Land and Economy" is the topmost discussion forum, and not, say, "Design and Textures".

The forums get re-aranged constantly, Blaze. It's pretty well meaningless.

I agree with blaze that A'ksha is awesome. I hope to buy in there soon, too. First I just have to sell my Purina, though ROFL, and my somewhat highly priced prime mainland waterfront with view LOL. THEN if all goes well I will move into Ak'sha if there is anything left.

I don't understand Reitsuki's nasty comments about Ak'sha. What blaze was pointing out was something that is really worth replicating in SL: people who don't know each other, getting together, and making a sim better.

Not by being feted inner core. Not by being Lindens-in-the-making, old players on their way to becoming liaisons. Not by being Photoshop jockeys. Not by banding together fiercely with the attitude of "we are the intelligent ones and we are surrounded by idiots," not by going on some Quest Adventure Together Hanging Together Against All Evil Especiall Prok, and not by leveling, beating bosses, finding treasures etc. (in the metaphorical sense of course).

But just by getting together, sharing, parceling, counting prims, cooperating a bit, making a bit of a structure, a bit of a sketch, maybe hiring some good architects. Everybody gets paid, everybody gets a nicer life, you don't have to be frigging blood brothers in a cult ritual, you just have to be a good neighbour.

That's what I am committed to. And I think it is still possible on the primo mainland, and even in Purina. In fact, in Purina, is where it is most fun and most challenging to try! (OK, I confess to selilng some Purina the other night but as soon as the market picks up a bit I'll go back into trying to reclaim some Purina again LOL.0

To pout at something new and organized coming along and say it is derivative, or sub-optimal, or prone toward authoritiarianism -- well, even if it is true, is it the end of the world? Join it, and make it none of those things. Or do your own thing. As Jacek Kuron used to day, "Don't burn down Party Committees; build your own."

I still am trying to grok Reitsuki's politics on the land issue. There seems to be still a tropism toward a regulatory hand, and an aversion to "land barons" and "middle men" and all manner of ebil people. But as I've argued, any anyone can see inworld, the middle men keep the land liquid and keep it available "just in time" and keep flexibility "just in time". "Just in time" is an important feature for any free market.

There are so many forces from above and pressure from below on land barons that I honestly think none of them can really get that far ahead. The kind of people doing big-time and long-term land barony are the kind of people who have a vision and an idealism and a dedication to doing this really picky and thankless task, not people who can actually make that fast a buck here by being charlatans.

Whatever the experiences of August 2004 or August 1914, for that matter, it's time to move on. SL changes constantly. One thing is certain: people value land. They will value it more if net nannies screaming about rapacious land barons and gougers will simmer down.

What nasty comment about A'kasha? Singular, even, much less plural.

hey where' s buster, he's suspicously silent

The group deeding tool has made life easier for private island owners and their residents. As a landlord, I no longer have to set certain permissions for the tenant, and the tenant no longer has to rely on me to do so. Private island rental plots have been around for a long while. I have been running sim communities for months, and there are others who have been doing it longer, Schwanson Schlegal to name but one.

The only reason this has blown up the way it has is due to the misuse of an excellent additional land management tool. Halt the abuse and I don't see any further issues.

I still fail to see how LL have done that. They have been very clear that parcels within private sims cannot be resold. Although it has to be said, using the word 'deed' for the additional land management tools is perhaps not the best, as it implies ownership.

Well, you're coming into the middle of a conversation without first getting context. So I won't address your misunderstanding of what I'm saying, but I will address what I think are your misunderstanding of what LL is trying to do.



They haven't made this clear at all. In fact, I even suspect they want parcels within private sims to be resold. They just don't want users to be confused that they're the ones doing the selling.



I see no misuse and I don't really think LL sees a misuse either. However, I do agree that we shouldn't be confusing LL land selling and non LL land selling, for a lot of reasons.

<cough>

Blaze, everytime you purchase a private island, you're reminded that at no time can you resell parcels.

It's misuse because of LL's above position.

Hands Buster a Kleenex..

ahahah. Well, you got me there.

Is that in an email or something? How exactly are you 'reminded'?