Four's Company, Five's a Crowd?

Prokofy,

Once again, the fact that you babble endlessly about controlled sectors where there is a top person in it, and then leave Anshe out of the discussions shows a bias that you can see from space.

The people who are the most vocal against you, myself included, are that way because youc onstantly attack our success as if it is somehow undeserved. You dismissed it all many times in this thread. According to you, it is not from hard work, creativity, innovation, perseverance and the quality of work, it is simply privilege and a network of insiders all protecting each other. Every one of your little tirades against us is insulting. I don't begrudge you your success in the land business, I am not sure why you are so fixated on bashing the success of others, but it is petty, obsessive and at this point, incredibly redundant.

As far as "all your friends who are in the clothing and skins business" that don't get attention because they don't post in the forums, do you ever actually look at the New Products forum? Probably not, you are too busy with your head up the land forum. There are many many people who post their content to the classifieds that never post in the general forum. People participate in the forums for visibility, especially in a virtual world that has grown as large as SL has with very few other outlets for mass visibility. There is no barrier of entry to posting here - and many many people across all aspects of SL do so. Try actually knowing what you are talking about instead of just blindly making baseless comments. Then again, you would not be you if you did that.

but we forgot one !!!


Top Forum Poster: Prokofy Neva


well sure thes epeoples deserve to stay at the top, BUT they have as everybody to fight and stay innovative to stay at the top.

Originally Posted by Prokofy NevaAll your friends who are clothign designers and skin makers ought to give some thought to this: they don't post in the forums. They have no influence on the ideological discussions about this game.


Prok, flip back through the forums... Many clothing designers, skin makers have commented to this post. ex. Chip, Mistress, Cristiano ( animation designer) ... Damn, you dont get out much.


Originally Posted by Prokofy Neva
They do not get attention from the Lindens, who regrettably pay far more attention to this forum (judging from their zeal to close threads) than they do to their own impartial inworld market and sociological research -- which, if conducted would yield a very different picture.

If the lindens do not pay attention to these Very talented people, then i really dont give a flying Cow what they pay attention to.



Originally Posted by Prokofy Neva
Malachi, that Russian you got off some Internet thing is horribly translated, BTW, filled with Angrusski, and makes no sense LOL.


No bad! *Doesn't make sense*... Shesh

* sits back and waits till he fixes it*

Prokofy, I find above comments highly ironic. I think you were the one who started this and other threads, specifically targetting the "top whatever" people, basically inviting them to fight you. Now you are complaining they are fighting back? Wouldn't singling out these people be harrasment on your part?

Also, I responded to your threads but I am "Top nothing" if that counts in your list I don't own a land, I have not produced or sold a single thing, all I want is to join Black Sun club someday However, I do want SL to be as free as possible. If few people becomes billionaires because they invent the Google of SL, or ebay of SL, more power to them. The drop out graduate students from Stanford and Harvard changed the world, they deserve to be on the top, until someone smarter comes and topples them.

The last sentence in above quote "...fascistic ideology of corporativism..." I think really sums up your agenda or hatred or subconcious illogical reasoning (whatever that means) for starting these arguments. You dismissed the business week article and my comment about collective power of people enabled by Internet technologies, because I think you were busy planning on an attack to the "corporate fascists" in SL, the idea of collective power would derail that plan.

All your arguments, which were ripped apart again and again by number of people, were very weak to start with but I respect ideas just for the sake of being devil's advocate. However, your aim is to promote your own ideology (socialistic ideology of anti-corporativism?) and that in my opinion completely shatters your credibility in these arguments. Your ideology did not work in real life, and won't work in second life. If you want to be a revolutionary I would suggest the following online worlds :

http://metaverse.sourceforge.net/
http://solipsis.netofpeers.net/wiki/HomePage

Snow, it's like talking to someone who has their fingers in their ears going "lalalalalala" when not ranting on their soap box. For every 1 thoughtful non-nasty post (like the initial meta/feta post before that thread went down the shitter -- in that particular case, not prok's fault at all), prok posts 10 nasty ones. But in his mind, he is always attacked, never the attacker.


Kudos to the innovators who made sluniverse, etc for their initiative, investment and hard work. Someone has to be first, though you probably won't be the last. I doubt that LL has granted Cristiano a perpetual and exclusive license.

The business opportunities within SL are really minor right now in the grand scheme of things. Who knows whether SL will really be the platform that is the winning (i.e. critical mass) metaverse. That some see the potential and are investing/risking their energy in hopes of a future -- that's called being an entrepreneur and i say "good for you!"

prok has his own ventures, but can't resist tearing everyone ELSE down and perpetually spewing venom masked in populist nonsense. Oh I'm sorry -- that's right, prok is really the victim here.

Once a metaverse really forms (whether it be SL or something else) and the economic opportunity become real, SO many people are going to pour in that there will be tons of competition. Some talented amateurs will able to compete but it will become much harder. To say that the field is getting locked up now is ridiculous. So there will be incumbants to beat. Big freaking deal -- that exists everywhere.

And so for the sake berevity... my thoughts:

Originally Posted by Snowcrash HoffmanProkofy, I find above comments highly ironic. I think you were the one who started this and other threads, specifically targetting the "top whatever" people, basically inviting them to fight you. Now you are complaining they are fighting back? Wouldn't singling out these people be harrasment on your part?

Originally Posted by Forseti Snow, it's like talking to someone who has their fingers in their ears going "lalalalalala" when not ranting on their soap box. For every 1 thoughtful non-nasty post (like the initial meta/feta post before that thread went down the shitter -- in that particular case, not prok's fault at all), prok posts 10 nasty ones. But in his mind, he is always attacked, never the attacker.


I agree with all three of you... Prok seems liek the kind of guy who puts down peopel for his own pleasure, then gets pissed when someone does it back to him. I agree he thinks he is the "attacked" and he is! but, If you do not want to be attacked, then Do not attack! It seems to me Prok, that you are jealious of the people who have a higher reputation.

I must say, I haven't heard much about you, but the stuff I have heard hasn't been pleasent. Let's take for example... My friend (who will remain un-named) Came to discuss with you a important matter, yet you Negatively rated her saying she was arogant? And I also *hear* that you will negatively rate someone just because they are more, let's just say More intelligent. I am not here to point fingers at you Prok, but you need a serious reality check if you are getting pissed because people are "attacking" you. And to me, "attacking" is hardly what were doing. I would say we are setting you straight.

and mine...

LOL I don't care if people criticize me and I didn't come to "fight" them but to discuss a generic problem, visible to all but those who are embedded in this game in the FIC, with terrible repercussions for any world.

When I see the touchy, angry, and even imbecilic reaction, that lets me know that I've been right to question the hold that certain companies get on our world. It might be benign now. It won't be down the road. It's all just a game, right? Except, it's not, and you get to run it LOL. Nice!

What I'd like to hear is some mature, thoughtful response about how areas of the game like communciations within and between this game and the Internet can remain open to others and not become the plaything of a few, with Linden blessing. You wonder why they even made their game public.

Why didn't they just take resumes to accept only the highest class people, and weed out the "feebs and choads" as Cory called them?

Armani, I have no idea of what you're talking about because you are relying on hearsay. Provide specifics, and I can respond. I don't neg people for merely coming to talk. I have a very specifica and detailed negrate policy you can read on my profile.

Nobody is going to be negrated for being "more intelligent", that's silly. If they are intelligent, they'll realize that negrates are just conversation openers and they can be reversed, or else they don't mean anything, they will be removed in six months' time.

What's the solution, did I miss it? Should no one ever make a successful company?

Forseti, the Metaverse is being capctured by a few, while you think I'm the problem. Look again. There are no people pouring in the door. They can't get to square one when they do pour.

I have no venom and no jealousy. I don't need to be or become any of the things these people are. I'm critiquing their hold on the world and asking them to justify it. That's all.

Cristiano, it's pointless to keep raising Anshe as some kind of "gotcha" with me. Because she may be a huge presence in the land market but she doesn't so control it that no one else can enter it. And there's plenty of Anshe-bashing in other threads, so I don't need to rehearse my critique or anyone's critique of Anshe here.

What can be see from outerspace, Cristiano, is your touchiness over this issue.

I never attacked your success, your hard work, your innovation. I criticised -- not attacked -- the idea of having only ONE of you monopolize the airwaves leading from the game, to the stop at the Linden's website, to your website. That's all. That's a reasonable issue to raise. As a generic issue. That doesn't denigrate what you do, but questions how others are going to get to have their hard work, innovation, and expertise count or have entree in his world that is getting sewn up -- and yes, with insiders' networks.

There is nothing petty about asking the biggest question there is to ask: how our Metaverse, our Virtual World, will get formed, since we will be spending so much more time in it in the next century. These are damned important questions. They're worth dropping everything to discuss and experience. I'm sorry you can't accept this world-historical debate for what it is, and have to obsess on the petty issues of your pride and your touchiness and "saving face".

I read New Products all the time. Some of these people are my tenants. And I buy the New Products myself.

Your prejudices are showing again, Cristiano.
__________________

The most ironic post in the history of the internet goes to:

*Drumroll*

Comrade Prokofy Neva!

Could I get some advice on this outfit?

Anshe is far more of a monopoly than any of the things you have named. Far and away, without contest. And even she isn't really a monopoly, just the proverbial 'biggest dog'.

Sorry Prok.

You still refuse to say what you would do about this supposed problem, by the way.

There has been quite a lot of off-topic posts made this thread lately, consider this a warning - further off topic posts will cause this thread to be moved or closed.

I still disagree with your "metaverse is being captured by a few" line.

First of all, the metaverse isn't here yet, not really. It's definitely not "captured".

Second, do you really think LL is signing perpetual, exclusive contracts here?

Third, competition hasn't even BEGUN. As I said, should the economic opportunity here become truly substantial, everyone who wants to maintain economic leadership will be fighting hard to maintain that position because competition will explode. That's what happens when people sniff real gold. Not only will competition increase, but the quality of resources thrown at the problem will increase as the market opportunity -- the ROI -- becomes more compelling.

First mover advantage does not mean victory.... not by a longshot.

The answer is simple. Those that have risen to the top in communications and other areas of SL are not using anything proprietary except their ingenuity. The same tools that make Nexcom work are available to anyone else with the knowledge to make use of them. It's quite beyond me why you fail to grasp that very simple concept.

The question is simple. Those that have risen to the top in communications and other areas of SL may use their ingenuity, but once they occupy the space available for their ingenity to fill, it's filled. The same tools that make Nexcom work may be available to anyone else with the knowledge to make use of them, but the space available in the market is taken. It's quite beyond me why you fail to grasp this very basic princple of the non-market corporatist state in a closed society.

Forseti, for a long time, there was only one Bell Telephone. Remember? Then it was forced to make Baby Bells and also to let others compete. You could say that they just used their ingenuity and the tools were open to anyone, but they saturated and kept the market monopolized. And ditto on Microsoft and other similar companies.

The metaverse IS here. You're soaking in it, dahling.

Yes, I think LL is capable of signing exclusive contracts -- they essentially have already done so.

Competition has TOO begun. Why do you think there is such fierce posturing and positioning on these forums?

Bell owned the wires.

In SL, there are no wires to own. Everyone has the same exact resources at their fingertips.

What is your solution to this perceived "problem"? How would you fix it?

There's only one "wire" going to LL's front page visible area. I doubt they will supply *two wires*. There's only one "wire" in other respects of the game too, and that's what my point is.

On the contrary, they have not signed any contracts. I have no contract with them, no deal, no relationship. Again, once the UI is updated with a privacy option for snapshots, ALL POSTCARDS coming out of SL that originated from a PG sim will be fair game for the front page. Who knows, LL may take away the photos on the home page altogether, it was just a marketing experiment of their own chosing and doing.

SLExchange has no contract with them, Nexcom has no contract with them, Gigas has no contract with them. Anshe has no contract with them. They have not done anything of the sort, essentially or otherwise. That is why your wild proclamations about the doling out of the precious airwaves holds no weight. Nothing has been doled out. You could make your own cell phone network in SL - all the pieces and tools are there, the exact same ones Nexcom used. You could make your own shopping site - Adam and Flipper and Edkc56 Gardner all have, without LL's help or blessing.

You could make your own snapshot processing site - here's a good angle for you, since Snapzilla doesn't allow porn, you could certainly have a guaranteed audience if you built an adult snapshot site. Not what you want to do? Fine. You could do a standard site like mine - duplicate it feature for feature. Would it be a success? Probably not, because it offered nothing new - but if you offered something compelling that Snapzilla didn't and took the effort to market it, you could build an audience. All without any Linden involvement, or contract - simply hard work and innovaction.

The generic points about your question on the future of the metaverse is that I agree with you that we are in the early days of the metaverse. I also agree with you that openness is important. However, where I disagree with you and think you have shown nothing to remotely back your claims is that the existence of any business right now in any of the sectors that you mentioned (sectors I also think you are giving way too much importance to) prevents any other business from being there.

To play devil's advocate though, I will say ok - what if I shut Snapzilla down and backed out completely. What argument would you use against the next person who did the same thing and their site was a success? It's kind of a catch 22. Their presence is supposedly blocking anyone new, but yet you are blaming them for there not being other people doing it. You can't have it both ways. What would your solution be?

I fail to grasp it because it's a ridiculous premise as has been pointed out in this thread to you over and over again with numerous examples. If your theory was true then Gigas and SLboutique would not exist. Why bother since there was already SLexchange? I would be the only person making skins and yet there are now dozens, some of whom have surpassed me in sales and profit. There would be no SLpics since there was already 2ndLook. There would be no vehicles besides those made by Cubey and yet there are dozens of vehicle makers doing very well for themselves. You haven't shown a single concrete example of how successful ventures hamper further development, and every example you actually have offered has been shown to be false.

Your doubt and reality are two different things, as usual. First of all, you are talking about something that has existed for one month. How in the hell did we ever get by without it, and now it is the most important thing that must be protected at all costs? When they launched the marketing site, the pictures going to my site were already for public consumption so they figured it was fine to use those (I suppose, I had no part in it so you would have to ask them).

They did not use all outgoing pictures because pictures not destined for my site may have been private. By adding a privacy checkbox to the UI, they will get that permission. This is at least what I understand their plans to be - again, it is their site, not mine, so you would have to ask them.

There were Land Barons before you got here, and yet, you somehow managed to break into the business, even when many claimed that Anshe had a monopoly going there. They, like you, obviously don't know what Monopoly means.

I've seen many people in this thread ask you what your solution would be to the problem of someone cornering a market. So... What is your solution? Do you have one?

I imagine actually the reason Nexcom has no competition is because it is a niche concept to begin with. The market isn't large enough to support fractured communication systems that don't interoperate - it is too small, and it would be like the cell phone market in RL only allowing you to call people on the same service - it would be stupid. That is the part you fail to mention or grasp. That is why that one single sector has no competition, along with the fact that once the coolness factor of a cell phone in SL wears off, you realize it's a pain in the ass, insecure, and you go back to using IMs.