Thanks ACLU: War Memorial To Be Torn Down

I don't hate them. They hold no DEEP cultural value for me as a symbol.

Do I need to explain DEEP culture to you, or do you think you could manage to educate yourself?

I am sure that Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, et al, both inside and outside the US would disagree, not to mention atheists.

Well, in the movie "Supersize Me" when a series of school kids are asked to identify famous figures in the some photos Spurlock holds, more kids recognize Ronald McDonald than Jesus.

Go figure.

American Commericalism at it's best.

(sorry for the diversion, couldn't help but sticking that in there)

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The cross holds no deep cultural value for me. How about a giant bronze of a helmet on the butt of a rifle --That would seem more fitting to me.

Now you're getting it

I said the symbols of the Christian Tradition are a part of American culture. Then I added "powerful and important". I never said that it was to the exclusion of any other traditions or non-traditions.

I'm surprised you responded, but glad you did.

aren't you clever?

You know exactly what I meant yet you want to distort it to avoid the discussion.

sure kendra whatever you want.

Fair and true enough. I suppose one had to be made an issue of - there are literally 100s if not 1000s of memorials around the country, on state and federal properties, that have the cross as part of the display. Some national cemeteries have giant stone crosses right in the entrance.

Will be interesting to see what happens to all of those after this all shakes out with the one in SD.

.Champie nadu

I was responding to the portion I bolded, because I think it's untrue.

That doesn't mean they should get top billing, or be used in an unconstitutional manner.

And I am not sure why you felt it necessary to add the stuff about being surprised. Maybe you could elaborate.

sorry for cross posting this one but some arent looking at both !!!!

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,195244,00.html

Plus this is kinda refers to both posts ...


http://www.ushistory.org/declaration/document/index.htm

When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's (GOD )entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation

To go off on a slightly related tangent, I heard something I found hilarious on a documentary on the history channel this morning. All those ten commandments that were put up in courthouses in the 50's that were donated by the fraternal order of eagles were actually paid for by Cecil B. Demille and were sent out to coincide with the release of his ten commandments movie. There's your deep cultural significance for ya!

God does not imply Christian.

What ever read this
http://www.allaboutreligion.org/church-history.htm

Whatever - Christ is where the term Christian came from - God is a Judeo-Christian term (Allah means God also)


(OK "God" may not just be Judeo-Christian, but you get the idea)

http://cbn.com/spirituallife/onlinediscipleship/understandingislam/are_allah_and_god_the_same.asp

Hence, others (Muslims included) are equally adamant in affirming that the Allah of Islam is NOT the God of the Bible.

http://cbn.com/spirituallife/onlinediscipleship/understandingislam/what_is_islamic_jihad.asp


http://cbn.com/cbnnews/world/israel/051122a.asp



Allah =God= Distuction

If 80% of the country is Christian, then it stands to reason that your odds of hiring a Christian are very great. Doesn't mean it was intentional.

-Kiamat Dusk

Ok, this thread is falling apart faster than Clinton's defense.

But, seriously this is what I was talking about. Rather than seeking a common understanding everyone is retreating farther and farther into their prospective wings. So allow me to try to inject some calm here.

This cross is merely a memorial to the dead. A place marker. No one is being forced to worship it. There's no church there. No religion is being endorsed. It has sat there, not bothering anyone all these years. The only reason this guy wants to tear it down is spite-and that is wrong.

As for the separation of church and state-I think we can all agree that theocracies, no matter the religion-are bad.

So just take a deep breath and look at the real issue here. This guy wants this memorial dow for no other reason than simple spite. What's next? The national cathedral? The White House Christmas tree?

-Kiamat Dusk

17 years is a long time for "simple spite." How do you come to that conclusion?

Uhm --nobody ever claimed Allah was Jesus Christ or the trinity. Allah is the same as God --ya know from the Bible --or what you geretics refer to as the "Old" Testemant.

Jews dont accept your Christ as God either. (Hence my distate for your blasphenic crucifix)

Bush called it the White House Holiday Tree.

just sayin'

Personally... I'll be glad when it's gone, not because I dislike what it represents... but because it is just an embarassingly cheap looking 'monument', and as tacky as the thick cluster of radio towers that sit next to it.. (I drive past mt. soledad daily)

I'm not going to lend much credence to the CBN version of Allah... I'd rather go to Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allah