Consistency

I know that forum moderation is a thankless job, and a difficult task in any environment, especially one as diverse, passionate, and complicated as Second Life. A post by Cocoanut Koala in the Off Topic forum got me to thinking about the consistency of moderation, or lack thereof, and I have to say I agree with her. She started a thread today about not being able to rate threads any longer. Granted, arguably it could be said this is off topic - that forum discussion perhaps does not belong in general, though for the most part that is where it has always occured and remained. Her thread was subsequently moved, with a note from Jeska that "meta-discussions" belong in Off-Topic.

However, there are countless other threads exactly like it talking about the new resident moderator program, one asking about forum mods on Help Island, one discussing the way in which moderators were picked, one about necroposting, several more about moderators, and another about the star ratings being removed. Every single one of those threads falls under the same vague criteria for moving, yet they were left alone and only that single thread was moved. It is understandable why certain people feel singled out, or that others are given more leeway, when something as blatant as this occurs. While the answer may be "she hasn't gotten to the other threads yet", the lack of consistency is glaring, as some of those threads have been in general for a few days.

In the end, it doesn't matter ultimately where a thread is moved, I supposed, but singling out one person's thread for moving while leaving similar threads from others does give a bad impression. Perhaps this is what the ResMod program will help to address, though I am not sure how much consistency you will have with a different group of people every 2 weeks. I'm optimistic about its chances even as it already seems to have hit some snags, but this lack of consistency has nothing to do with that program - it has been going on for a very long time. One way or another, I hope it can be made clearer for all of us through example. It is hard to know where to post something sometimes - I don't think anyone would assume to post something about the forums in off topic.

I think it's important to read between the lines on this one, amigo. I think Cocoanut's thread got noticed/acted upon because of its shrill tone. All the other threads on the subject were sardonic, bemused or amused, but Cocoanut's was pretty shrill.

I think that consistency, while desirable, is also out of reach. So it helps to understand how to craft your message so as to stay out of the crosshairs.

Tone does not affect whether it is on topic or not - and actually, the thread was not shrill at all. Certainly the tone was no worse than asking LL if they know their arse from their elbow (a charming phrase nonetheless Moopf ).

i hadn't even realized that it was moved to OT, nor am i sure who moved it since there was no "this has been moved" announcement from Jeska. she simply alluded to the fact that it should be, not that it actually was. but i'd rather not speculate on that can of worms at the moment.

i'm of the mind that forum related threads are properly placed in General, but maybe we should think about having two General forums? one for "General: in-world" and one for "General: forums"?

You raise a very good point Cris. I too was confused as to why it was moved to OT as I feel it is something that should be discussed constructively in General. There are some that try to make certain post OT but as long as its not completely derailed and is still on the topic of SL/SLForums it should remain.

This is the first phase of the ResMods and there will be some things that will be learned through trial and error. Hopefully with patience and support/feedback from all of the residents we can get through this.

MJ

Personally, I think if a post is about SL and the forums then it should be considered NOT Off Topic. I don't understand why hers was deemed Off Topic for it was an SL related post.

If she had posted about chickens and chia pets invading her rl house or something, then that to me would be considered Off Topic. I really don't understand why some threads get moved and others are allowed to stay where they are...

SHRILL is the keyword here. From reading what was posted yesterday about 'shrill' I can see you are stirring the pot again Enabran. *rolls eyes*

I agree, Cris. Cocoa's thread regarding the SL Forums was no different than any of the other countless threads that have been started, and remained, in the General forum. I don't feel that discussing the forums is at all off-topic to SL. I don't believe the two are seperate entities, and never have.

If we cannot discuss the SL Forums in the General forum, then how about a specific area where we can discuss them? A Forvm Forum, maybe?

(As for Cocoa's post being 'shrill'.. I must have read it differently, because that wasn't the impression I picked up from it. Were you reading it in a high-pitched voice while doing jazz-hands, Enabran? )

That has to be one of the funniest things you have ever said, Jonquille

As a matter of fact!

Agree with Cris, that was very funny, but even more so for me because at this point, as a force of habit... that's basically true. That you can read my inner monologue better than I is a little creepy.

We might have very similar inner monologues.

I think it shouldn't have been moved at all - irrespective of tone... it was about SL and an observation about SL..

But then again the 'Real' forum mods just move crap around willy-nilly so I expect no less than the new hall monitors.

Consistency - hehehe - dream on - the only thing consistent around here is inconsistency..

Its somewhat an exercise in futility to try and prognosticate on which posts should be moved or not. And once they are, they are. So, to this end, its important to support our SL mods and trust in their judgement(s).

Ah... no it isn't

Thats like 'you have to support your President!' - newp don't have to do that either.

If I think a decision is boneheaded I'll say it is.

It's not about the thread being moved per se, which is fine. It is just that it was the only thread, out of an entire group of them that was moved. I trust in their judgement, I just question why a certain post is being singled out over others. Questioning is not providing lack of support - that is like the "you're either with us, or you're a terrorist" rhetoric of the Bush Administration. I fully support LL, but it doesn't mean everything they do is beyond reproach and should never be challenged.

Claps wildly, well said!

Cat

What is a meta-discussion?

coco

Well, when you have a forum to talk about a topic, like Second Life, and instead you are talking about the forum itself, it becomes a meta-discussion. It's kind of a grey area - but for example, if you are part of a Tivo forum, talking about your Tivo would be on topic - talking about not liking the way the threads sort in the Tivo forum would be a meta-discussion. Basically, it's all semantics. I suppose we need a forum forum, as these forums are a part of the SL experience for a lot of people.

I suggest we get a fourm to talk about the fourm which then discusses the forum thereby propigating the forums into sub sections a, b, c, d, e, f, and g. At which time we can start fourms about sub forums to include the master forum but not exclude the normal forums.

But that's just me

hehehe

I agree with your post Cris, and I do think consistancy is key. When Coco's thread was moved, I actually considered for a minute to move the other similar threads. But then realized that I would not have moved the first one. Moderating is a judgement call in a lot of ways (as you well know from your own forums Cris), but at the same time there are things that can be less grey. Such as: If I move this post that is about this topic, then all other posts about this topic must be moved as well.

Though if a lot of the same types of threads end up in one particular forum and not another, to me it is a good sign that the topic belongs in the forum that everyone thought to post it in. Gadz I hope that made sense! hehe

Anyway, this is one of those things that I'm hoping the ResMods can help with over time. Little things that we can see that the ultra busy Linden mods can't.

Well, in that case, I would like to point out that there is a meta-discussion now stickied to the top of this forum.

coco

I agree with this basically, however, I question the wisdom of stopping at level g when there are many more letters in the alphabet, numbers, international traffic symbols and other labels that could be easily be brought into use.

I noticed that too - the whole thing makes no sense. If they were going to move your thread, then all of them should be moved, honestly. That thread also in no way deserves to be stickied.

I want to see the ResMods battle with Jeska. Like, move threads she moves back where they started, that kind of stuff.

Would be fun drama.