Upcoming Changes for Adult Content: Motivations and Goals

I am getting the feeling that the most important people in most of these posts are being talked of in the third person, so I was wondering if anyone has asked them their opinion?

Something just occured to me. I was going to posit it as a possible solution then it occured to me, maybe this is already going to happen and is part of the 'cleanup'.

Right now there are no third party ads. I was thinking how email places like yahoo offer unlimited storage and free usage. How? Ads. I don't mind ads (other than those annoying pop ups that won't go away and you can't scroll around) if the service is good product is good and content is free.

But then I had the sinking feeling - maybe we are *already* going to see a Coca-Cola ad when we log in and that might be what some of this is about?

(Reason I thought of it originally was, a way to bring LL more money, without thinking they have to 'clean up' the grids to attract squeaky clean investors)

I keep seeing mention of the teen grid and a future possible merger. I went and read the linked article where Philip Rosedale mentions he would like to bring the two grids together in the future.

I have to tell you, myself and so many other SL users come here because it is free of kids and teens. It is a community where we can enjoy the company of other adults, child free.

I have this horrible vision in my head of post merger, every time I try to go to a store or fun zone in a PG location, being surrounded by a bunch of teens and all their "It's the end of the world cuz Johnny dumped me, and we went steady for 2 whole weeks" drama. Ugh, it is giving me a headache even thinking about it. All that will lead to is adults having to deal with and constantly mute hormone fueled teenagers getting in their IM box to tell them "You're like, HOT". Not to mention how fast common areas would become preying grounds for pedafiles.


And even if this whole idea is not grid merger minded, it is something that is going to snowball out of control. Really, where will it stop, who's tastes and dislikes of what they may run into will get priority, who's won't?

There are lots of people who are offended by religion, and religions that are offended by other religions. People who are offended by same sex couples. People who are offended by other political groups. I mean the list of things people get offended by is never ending.

So what is the future of SL?
Christian content over here, muslim content over there, anything related to homosexuality over here. Before you know it, there is no more unique "world", but rather a bunch of safety zones so no one gets their fee fees hurt. Then instead of expanding and opening up our minds to those who are not like us, we are all hanging out with people just like us in a safe little huddle.

I fail to see how people are being forced to come across adult content anyway. If I am at my PC by myself and I am not worried about adult content, I check the little box that says "show mature content". If my kids are up and I do not want them to accidentally see anything I would not like them to see, I uncheck that box. Or I make sure to check the mature/pg status of a sim via the map before TP-ing or border crossing to that location. We are all responsible for where we choose to go, and to not go.

Responsibility for self, is that really that hard of a concept for adults to get?

As for kids who may sneak onto the main grid and see boobies, it is not LL's job to protect those kids. It is clearly warned before you enter that this is an 18 plus deal. It is those kids parents' jobs to know what their kids are doing, to be tuned into what they are doing when they are on the internet and keep them safe.

You are punishing the masses to benefit irresponsible, lazy parents and those adults too lazy to make sure that they know where they are going in SL.

You handed us SL and told us to make it our world, well, we made our world, now please just let us live in it.

who are these SOME tards who dont want to see adult content!
i for one aint settin foot on no adult continent!
we already have a means of filtering adult content in mature.
i'm alreadfy age verified/ identity verified so i dont care about that but every one who wishes to explore sexuality in sl gets BRANDED WITH A TAG (ADULT)
SEGRAGATED INTO A CONCENTRATION CAMP OF PRICE FIXED TURDY MAINLAND CRAP SIMS. i gotta waste time writin up that "i bend hoes over pink pose balls on my land"
Jumpy gonna lead the charge! alli gotta say! Sex built this dump (SL).

Great points Voodoo.



Thing is, if the teens are now NOT going to join the main grid any time soon, then what is all this 'adult segregation' and 'age verification' about? *The (SL) world is already adult* as so many keep pointing out.



In real life people who are mightily offended by anyone 'different' tend to stick to others just like themselves (at least outwardly so). SL is currently sort of free from that. People who might be 'offended' by various other people's values, appearance, etc. can solve this by not playing SL. For instance a man who thinks all women should be covered head to toe might be offended by SL fashion. Easily avoided. Don't play SL. Everyone else there should not have to conform or 'reform' themselves to fit such people's preferences.



Exactly and none of us who are *not there in person* can do this anyway.

its decided. why waste time in the forums? u do this caws of the open sim fiasco.

Idiot Linden who dreamed up this project get an A+ for spin.

It all 'reads' good and 'sounds's good. but fiddling with something that isnt broke. sex sells. do these residents who want to enjoy sl with out encountering adult content even exist. will they log in a month from now. WILL THEY SPEND MONEY. take your so called hotspots. they are empty most of the time. define a hotspot for meh? some dump that "seems" interesting in the lab. I've had more fun in the sewers in hard Alley! than in any of ur hotspots. wanna fix something remove those. makes u all seem out of touch. Just a lil hint. if it aint broke dont fix it. if the feds aint at ur door with a capias or a subeona don't fiddle with ur customer base. F for FAIL. final grade.

As a lefty I find myself once again agreeing with the redneck. The left are no better on ridiculous sensitivities than the right.

I also agree with some of the above. Second Life has way too many problems right now. The lag is still bad. It crashes entirely too much. There will always need bugs hunted and dealt with. This should be Linden Labs focus.


This is just a bunch of busy work. Children should be no where near the adult grid. Children should not be watching the adult grid The parents activities may be suitable for a child to watch but not everyone's are. It's not up to everyone else to sanitize activities because a child may be watching.

We seriously need to kill this It takes a village to raise a child happy trap mentality and the Lindens need to do what they should be doing. That is keeping the grid stable the bugs down and the true griefers at bay. That is to say the racists, the homophobes the the people that launch people into the air for no reason etc. This is what needs focused on. Don't make it too difficult it's really quite simple.

Did not stop me from getting my age verified with a prepaid debit card I bought. Imagine all the 15 year olds that just can't wait to get online.

Still, it seems to me that it would be alot easier on everybody to just leave well enough alone before its broken beyond repair. How bout this, instead of the normal LL heavy handed solution, how bout they just leave it up to the residents and sim owners to regulate everything instead of forcing something on everyone like some Nazi gestapo.

If not, then put a bright star on and get rounded up, shipped off to Adult land, never to be heard from again.

Credit cards were not an option for getting age verified so me thinks you're not quite telling the truth, I am age verified, credit card was never an option.

I think this is a bad idea over all. I see what it's trying to accomplish but on the whole it's going to nto only eneffective, it'll upset alot of residents. I forsee a mass Exodus from SL over this. And true over time that exodus will be refilled by new people but it'll take some time. I remember when i first got Mmy SL accoutn i had to verify my age by deveral different Methods. Am I going to have to start paying money on Sl jsut so me and my Virtual lovers can do the naughty?

I am deeply saddened to see Linden Lab chasing its tail yet again at the policy level. We had hoped they'd learned their lesson in 2007 and would proceed thereafter with greater caution, but, alas, the executive is still run by engineers with little understanding of economics, economic history, jurisprudence, political philosophy or any of the other social sciences necessary to formulate policy at the executive level.

The pages of these blogs groan under the weight of hair-splitting detail concerning the best method of classifying the myriad forms of social interaction found within any given human society. All context and perspective is blown to the wind as the conversation ebbs and flows across a million grains of sand.

As usual, Linden Lab asks the wrong question. They begin with the ASSUMPTION that there is a problem with sexuality within SL. They then proceed to 'solve' this 'problem' by imposing restrictions on social interaction. They then ask the community how best to define and implement such restrictions - much like giving a condemned man the privelage of tying his own noose.

So, what is the right question? Let me recap:

The establishment of anonymous accounts in June 2006 opened the doors to underage players. This resulted in international legal scrutiny, increased exposure to legal liability and damaging media coverage. Linden Lab responded by intruding into residents' sexual relationships and expelling two consenting adults for underage roleplay - even though no underage players were involved. Refusal to close the anonymous accounts and dogged insistence on an ineffective and unsound ID-based age verification system cost Linden Lab considerable political capital with no benefit.

The right question, then, is a) how best to prevent underage players from mingling with adults and b) how best to zone the mainland in a tolerant and efficient manner?

By definition, Second Life is VIRTUAL, VOLUNTARY and ADULT. Eliminating anonymous accounts, therefore, solves the first part of the problem. Instead of creating a complicated system of filters to prevent kids accessing adult content, keep them out of SL altogether.

The second part of the problem. When constructing the mainland, Linden Lab established a patchwork of Mature and PG sims such that a loud BDSM club can open in a Mature sim next door to a quiet, residential home in a PG sim. The introduction of a third sim type, 'Adult', though badly named (all SL is adult by definition) - let us call it 'Xtreme' instead - makes good sense. Constructing an 'Xtreme' continent and patiently allowing residents to migrate there (at their choosing, at their own pace) also makes sense. It may take a year or two, but I believe most 'Xtreme' players will prefer to be free of the moral harassment they receive from PG residents.

BUT...LL is now creating a new problem.

As has been known since the dawn of time - articulated again recently by the US Supreme Court - one man's obscenity is another man's beauty. To attempt to codify the wide range of human social norms into a regulatory system is counterproductive. At best, it will generate high monitoring and enforcement costs; at worst, it will lead to confusion and conflict within the SL community.

It bears repeating that Second Life is VIRTUAL, VOLUNTARY and ADULT. There is a huge difference between SL and RL. Seeking to apply RL standards to a virtual world is silly.

VIRTUAL: There is no safer place on Earth than the privacy of your RL home. In SL you can:

- live without fear of physical injury
- retain complete RL personal privacy
- mute an avatar or an object
- teleport to a different location
- fly to a different location
- build house in the sky
- disable particle rendering
- log out

VOLUNTARY: One must sign up for an account.

ADULT: No kids allowed.

By definition, everyone in SL is an adult. That means one has passed through puberty, has learned to relate to people and become responsible for one's decisions - including the decision to be in a virtual world with other adults. As an adult, one recognizes and accepts that people have different styles and tastes and that rudeness or harassment should not be confused with sexuality.

In summary, I implore Linden Lab to note the howls of protest against this new policy drowning out those voices raised surreptitiously beforehand in its favor. Please reflect on the nature of the world you have created - that became a wonder BEFORE you began meddling with it. Please remember that Second Life is VIRTUAL, VOLUNTARY and ADULT and understand that Disneyfication will buy you at best a temporary advantage before the whole edifice slides gently into banality.

As for ban lines, I would prefer to see them go away entirely in exchange for the sentries or something that protects the building/skybox. 4k banlines protect nothing and interfere with flight of planes etc.

So NO! to banlines that high. As for the verification, I want everyone who is screaming about this to stop and ask a question. Would where you live in RL, allow you to do what you are doing in SL right now and why. If you are a furry assume you are dressed up in a costume. If you are selling genitals, then assume you are selling those rubber ones that are stocked in shops.

The other problem I am seeing is one of obligation. To the furnation guy, you were abusing the openspaces. So you and everyone else was charged for that. LL is not obligated to do anything. They are offering a service for a fee designed to entertain you, allow business to be conducted and make a profit. Things change as the wont do and now this comes.
The preception is that SL is alot of sex and emptiness to corporations. But to those involved we know better and we are the ones that are changing that preception. Yet there are those who choose to engage in lifestyle choices as a form of relaxation they know would not be allowed to display in open public (expect in San francisco)And even there, there are limits.
Since LL is in the business to make a profit, they want people to pay. And people do, but it seems from the angry comments from our furnation people they are allowed to do anything they want once they do.
All of us rent a space on a blade or a blade server. IT isn't yours to do with what you want. Its theres. They have a right to ban anything they want for any reason they want. Is this counter to their goal of making a profit? Probably but as we in the US have seen, that hasn't stopped other bigger more involved companies in other industries from doing the same thing.
However, it appears they Linden lab a) want consensus on what we the people who have accounts believe is adult material [easy: porn, bdsm, open gorean activitites (not selling of gorean wears)] b)want to move the people who engage in these activities to a new location so as they dont have a hodge podge of sites to deal with because ligitation is a real threat and us who like the system, don't want to see it go away.
People need to accept 3 things: 1)SL is not going away. Far from it. It will either be integrated into some other companies more RESTRICTED enviroment (ie, there, keneva, home etc), or it will be bought out and become more RESTRICTED. It will not get more open because bandwidth is expensive and there are too many freebies around. Yet freebies are good. They simulate the economy. They rent. And eventually they buy land.
2) Privacy is a mirage. The only way your personal, private information isn't available to anyone with either enough access or money is if the country doesn't put it online. That statement eliminates almost the entire world. So if you are in Darfur, Mogidshu, Tehren or North Korea, yes you are safe from information theft. Otherwise, especially the EU and US, its out there. Anyone can get it. Usually within 1 hour including detailed medical history. However, I do support attempts at lessening the amount avail able but I make no mistake that isn't available to someone who wants it.
Therefore I see no problem with want is going on now. Those of you who own land on the mainland who engage in the aforementioned activites are already verified. Have you considered moving to open spaces? Or buying your own island?
Those who rent, this also a perfect time to own. Its a new land.
But assuming you deserve compensation because you spent your time and they are evil for telling you no you can't do that now is as silly as me expecting compensation from my cable provider when a channel goes under.
Also, calling the most open virtual world provider in the most liberal and tolerant city in the world intolerant is as funny as me suing the televison manufactorer because I can't pick up analog signals no longer being broadcasted.

So what will happen? Some will move. Some will leave. SL will lose more walled garden oldbies to Openspaces or just gone. But others will arrive. They will build. They will thrive. They will create. SL will continue.

(and for the record, US law caused the casinos to go away. Senator Barney Frank has introduced Legislation to eliminate the block to online casinos. If it passes, casinos will be allowed to return to SL)

My bullshit detector just went off bigstyle..... and I think I've had a major epiphany.

Age verification, Adult areas, and the possible merging of the teen and main grid that it seems to be paving the way for are absolute lunacy.

first off... ADULTS DONT NEED PROTECTED FROM ADULT MATERIAL.

So whats all this really about... protecting kids from it.

Fair enough, but they shouldn't be here anyway, and theyre gonna find ways to verify anyway... so, why bother we all agreed we were over 18 when we signed up.

If LL find an under 18 on the grid.. kick their sorry ass out, and if theyve used Mummy or Daddys credit card to verify... inform the parents their kid has used their info to acess a service for adults.

Now heres the scary bit.

I've seen and heard people talk about the spectre of Paedophilia over the past few days.

Just think for a minute.

SL as an ostensibly over 18 environment holds ABSOLUTELY NO APPEAL to a paedophile.

But if it becomes clear some members ie: unverifieds, might just be kids, and god forbid, they merge the grids... SL will be flooded with paedophiles, and they wont be picking up kids in the adult areas... itll be the PG and "safe" areas.

This course of action if followed will make SL a feeding ground for paedophiles.

Thunderclap, abuse of openspaces implies that there were at any point prior to the unsubstantiated and deliberate price jacking, actual terms of service to be abused. Never were, and still aren't any concrete guidelines. We'll face the same uncertainty here enforced by the whim of the Linden Of The Day. And lately, they've had a turnover higher than bank execs.

Lindens, if you're actually listening (Show it! You haven't thusfar), we residents, will set the guidelines; Not just the adult content sellers or the namby-pamby "Raise my baby! I'm not responsible for it!" crowd, but everyone. Throw it to a referendum. Seriously. We residents are ostensibly all adults. How about letting us set the guidelines for 'Our World'. Or was the 'Your world, your imagination!' slogan tossed by the wayside when you ousted your founders?

Don't lay this at the feet of the engineers and the REAL hard-working people that make SL work. They don't have time for this BS.

No, this is solely the invention from the "the devil makes work for idle hands" PHB-types, who don't really feel like they are doing anything worthwhile (and, ostensibly, they usually don't) unless they do what they are best at: screwing things up with wide, sweeping mandates, action lists, TPS reports and who-the-hell-knows-what-else.

Here's basically what happened:

Someone "important" (or a group of "important someones" came to one of the executive PHBs and wrung his/her/their hands over the apparent newsflash they had just come across that SL is full of sexual deviants (OHNOES!), and that something really must be done to contain them in their own districts so that the rest of the grid is safe from pixel-peens. As such, the mandate came down from the Pinnacle of the Ivory Tower to the lower choirs of PHBs that it WILL BE DONE. So, the lower choirs find a way to sing along with the hymn, producing this batch of toadstool-fodder and, in classic Linden fashion, they come up with the normal plan of "let's make the residents think it was THEIR idea! Yeah! We'll ask their "input" on the unimportant aspects of the implementation, then steamroll it right on through! HIGH FIVE!".

I would say I am sorry for being such a cynical bastard, but when they behave in a way which makes the scenario seem more real than farce, they justify and reinforce that point-of-view.

I can't really see much else coming of this other than to simply say:

Expect Massive Fail.

was banning gambling a success...well nobody@ the lab went to jail.

fiddlin with the price of land (Jumpy got a cheap open sim )

will the new drive to hide sex from edu tards and corp noobs work! doubt it caws inna end. They. Still. Gonna. Know. My. Name. Jumpman Lane.

They gonna IM me. edu tards gonna wanna hop on pink pose balls for meh in between classes! i'm gonna have them ball room dancers in the buck all across the web full bright in windlight. corp noobs gonna im me wantin to get denoobyfied im gonna tell em wtf to do then they aint gonna do it an lose EXACTLY 50,000usd (caws that's wtf it cawst to get swagger like gold that keeps them groupies bobbin jigglin on they toes )

I think you misunderstand me. I am saying that engineers make bad executives.

I will ban them on site, and abuse report them for being in my areas, and anytime I see children in PG areas I will tell treat them like garbage.....Linden labs can steamroll this change but they can't force me to treat them like human beings. I'l make sure that if they are around me they will wish they had their own grid back.

Same goes for Lindens from here forward, no respect for you lindens and your fail, do not talk to me or be around me, I don't like you and I don't want to be infected with your fail.

kids suck! they would copy meh! follow me around and stuff! i'd have to put "u cant be meh!" back on my profile and what not! pg gals would say they love meh but its just the jewelreh! multicolored carots got pg gals kinda curious! hehehehee! Yung Jumpman still gonna ge t them d@m funds! and i'm still d@m boomin slut mag I_N_C stilla major movement!

OK, and what good does any of that crap prove other than who you really are? And to out right say you are gonna treat children like garbage, wtf? It isn't the child's fault, this is a corp decision that might or is gonna happen. I do however hope you get banned for making open threats against other residents in a public forum. Have a nice night!

I agree with Deltango Vale that this problem - and IMHO many others - started in 0606 with the allowance of anonymous accounts. In addition to the lack of verification of identity (and age, at least theoretically), it created huge problems with griefing. Many, many problems could be solved by reinstituting the credit card requirement (though it might reduce LL's stats).

LL says "Over the past year or so we have been hearing from a growing number of you that the experience in Second Life needed to change."

Really? How many? And what part of the experience? Interminable lag? Lost inventory?

Any customer service professional - or person with common sense - will tell you that unhappy people complain, while those who are satisfied never say a word. The so-called "moral majority" was actually a very small number of very loud people with an agenda. I wonder - have they now come to SL? So . . . how about conducting a REAL customer satisfaction survey? There are several companies that conduct professional and scientific surveys in SL. Contract with one of them - if this is really about customer dissatisfaction. Hell - one of them might even do it for free as a service to the SL community.

LL says "We gathering (sic) a great deal of feedback and data, . . . "

How? Using what methods? From what sources? (See my comments above) I'm a SL Mentor, and don't ever remember being given an opportunity to give "feedback." I don't know anyone who was given such an opportunity.

LL says " . . . and then sat down and tried to imagine how we could serve most needs best."

Nothing personal, but given LL's history, perhaps this is not the best problem-solving team. The first step in any such process is defining the problem. I don't think that has happened yet. I'm not even sure there is a problem - at least one LL's interested in solving.

LL says "What we came to is that we didn't need to change very much about Second Life to meet the majority of those needs."

There is an excellent possibility that these changes, if they are handled the way many have been in the past, will be HUGE, and truly destructive. I believe that 3-D virtual worlds with users represented by Avatars are the future of the Internet, but these kinds of decisions give me every reason to fear that Linden Labs will NOT be part of that future.

Not In My Back Yard Policies Are an attempt to hide the truth about the scope of what this forum is suggesting. How we deal with human sexuality on a Virtual World Platform, and why on earth rattle the hive?.
What a pleasure it is to listen to the radio lay back and create something of value for another. Self-fulfilling, but not predatory behavior that brings fear into the limitless possibilities equation, so what is the real issue here? Is it a examination of repairing a failing system, or is it a exploration into solvable issues through effective communication among our peers?
It really is nice to see these brilliant posts, because I too sometime feel like a complete idiot for taking matter's far to seriously; hindering my enjoyment of creation.

I work security in mature areas, I wont have myself, my friends or associates arrested as sex offenders when kids invariably come into sims they arent supposed to.

Nobody asked for them to be allowed into SL, and I feel that Linden Lab has now exposed me to a huge legal threat..... people have their lives ruined over parents who dont watch thier kids, and then when they find out what their kids are doing want to go on a witchhunt to "find out who was responsible for all this".....and SL is the perfect accident waiting to happen for just this scenario- I can't for the life of me understand how the Lindens could possibly be dumb enough to suggest it, let alone try to do it.

And as a resident of three years, I feel disrespected by the lindens at this time....I will not make them or children feel very welcome around me from here forward.

I was toying with the idea of having Linden place an option that , for anyone to access adult servers, they have to enter a passcode only their parents know. That way everyone can keep their adult stuff where it is, no one's censored, and there's a chance the children are kept away from the bad stuff. Let the PARENTS take responsibility for what their kids are being exposed to. Linden Labs is NOT RESPONSIBLE for seeing to the welfare of OTHER people's children. That's why they have parents. You know, like Parental Control for your cable box? Parental Control for Second Life.