Feedback on Ad Farm post

Apologies to everyone, for not responding to this post.. But I have this person muted due to their historic abusive behaviour towards me in the past.

It seems like a well intentioned idea, but doesn't address the real problems. You can create a ton of premium account alts (they're practically free at the yearly rate with stipend and tier factored in) and each alt have 1 ad plot. This is not covered by the policy as described on the blog. You can also build a one prim 4x4m microclub, add in a one prim dance ball, and still have a prim left over for an ad. This isn't covered by the policy either. With the club you could even offer the land for sale at a huge price.

This policy doesn't even come close to solving the problem. It only creates less competition for the people that are abusing the mainland. Nice attempt, but it's already a failure.

That doesn't even pretend to make sense. Create an alt, have it make an ad, have the ad banned.

The policy covers networked advertisers. It explicitly is against people that have a lot of adplots. It does not cover anyone that only has 1. It doesn't even cover people that only have a few.

"Neener neener."

Obviously the mute isn't working out too well, then.

Oh yes, I am sure that that would be a legitimate failsafe. I'm sure nobody has thought of that one.

That is my interpretation of his post as well, but I'd like to have that officially confirmed rather than go on that assumption and have it come back to bite me later.

The people writing the policy apparently haven't, which was my point.

Do you want to clarify that comment a bit more? I'm interested to know exactly what you mean by that comment.

Stop into "Healy" some time.. There's some quite legitimate uses of small plots there, and a legitimate advertising billboard as well.

I will not "forget" billboards. THIS POLICY IS ABOUT NETWORK ADVERTISING. This policy is not about land extortion. If a legitimate advertising business wishes to be in operation a month from now, they need a license.. That's what my post is about.. not about your personal griefing problems with areas full of floating cubes.. because as many others have pointed out, replace the ad with a smiley face, and it's no longer an "ad farm".



This license is for these people
http://world.secondlife.com/place/4e4b9e62-1a5f-85a0-f104-709dcb14c3d6
http://world.secondlife.com/place/6598c7b1-70ad-d7d5-e1a5-5157a95a6f6a
http://world.secondlife.com/place/7b564fe8-9fae-13f7-4ca7-e0e4df0a7bb0

Not these.

Okay, I've read all the comments so far - thank you for those. It's late for me here in the UK, but I'd like to add a few comments myself before I sign out.

Many of you have commented that the idea of licensing is perhaps a way for us to make money from advertising. That has not been the motivating factor here. I actually didn't state that we will charge licensees (this hasn't been decided), but the key point about licensing is control. In signing a license agreement, advertisers agree to follow a code of conduct and to follow specific rules about advert appearance and quantity. In addition, it potentially allows us to revoke a license if someone breaks those agreements.

From our side, detecting ad farm activity, ie. residents or groups with many small parcels across multiple regions, is straightforward. By it's nature it is a hard activity to hide. The Governance team are well equipped to handle this.

As for related forms of exploitation, yes we're aware of that problem. We've made a commitment to improve the Mainland and activities that clearly go against that will be dealt with too. Just as any resident estate owner makes choices about what they deem reasonable on their own estate, we will look at each situation and edge case and make the common sense decision. We have that discretion; if we believe a given activity is reasonable and a positive benefit for the Mainland then we can choose to allow it. Will people try to get around the rules? That seems likely, but again we can deal with that, particularly if we feel it is harmful to the health of the Mainland as a whole.

A couple have commented that we make things hard by not having the license model in place, and yes ideally we would have - but we also wanted your feedback on what you consider 'reasonable' advertising. Also, I suspect almost none of what I am referring to as Ad Farms would qualify for a license based on the content they have on those parcels at the moment, so that content would still need to be removed before they can apply.

I'll catch up on new posts tomorrow and comment further. Keep it coming.


Jack

Certainly; I mean that your comments here are specifically designed to promote the interests of ad griefers, and that you are an account specifically created to do that.

No light, no glow, no particles, please.

And apart from that I would say: put them all together in adfarm-area. Anyone who has the urge to see adfarms, can go visit them there.

Sure, and maybe tier fee zeroed for adfarmers ?
Come on, it's time to END this.

I just hope that linden licenses won't be just another way to raise money for them, leaving us with another way to send unanswered abuse reports.

Yeah! I'm so happy LL is taking action! This blight is the single worst thing about Mainland, a 'deal killer'. My appreciation is sincerely felt.

I know I'm not adding anything new to the thread, but I love it and had to say so.

To paraphase this, you admit that your solution does not solve the problem.

The alleged solution to adfarming is to force licenses on people that aren't adfarming?

How does that make any sense?

I honestly didn't read that particular post to mean quite that. It was very dismissive of the impact of the newly announced ad licensing policy, but I took it as a plea that the overall extortion problem--of which "advertising" is a small and thinly veiled subset--needs addressing. If I'm reading it correctly, the poster is expressing a real viewpoint.

OK, I came and saw the "legitimate" advertising billboard. So, outdoor advertising is OK, as long as it is "pretty-fied"? Would you want to see that out your front door, or your bedroom window?

What really distinguishes a "legitimate" advertiser from an "illegitimate" one, in my mind, is whether or not they realize that their advertising is harming/harassing other people. If that network stuck that "pretty" (and I use that term loosely; I think a mock-up of an ugly RL billboard in a virtual world looks ridiculous, personally) billboard in front of my house or even my place of business, I think I would take issue with it as well.

Now, if I talked to the owner, told him of my reservations, and he removed it happily, I would consider him a "legitimate" advertiser. That's where the line is drawn. Advertisers who respect the property rights as well as the aesthetic concerns of their neighbors are worthy of praise. Ones who don't, and ESPECIALLY ones who do it to SPITE their neighbors (usually to get them to buy their land or just to otherwise harass them) need to be wished into the cornfield.

So, while I can't determine whether or not I would consider that particular advertiser "legitimate", if he was both sensitive to the needs/desires of his neighbors, and kept the advertising on the positive side of things, I'd think I'd consider him so.

Like many people, I am extremely cautious with a wait and see view.

I have spent two weeks looking for decent and affordable mainland, and the two biggest deterrents were adfarms and banlines. If adfarms were nonexistent, I may have picked an older region. So many were decently priced but oddly shaped with a puzzle piece bitten into it for a 16sqm. Or were next to a grid of those parcels. Saw plenty of those extortionist squares as well.

I have a souvenir from my travels. I call it The Other Side of the Tracks:


This is opposite a residential area. The image brings to mind two other eyesores common to adfarms: Fullbright and particles.

Not even trees or your own build will serve to shield against the offset of light and shadow. Forget about mood or ambience with those in the vicinity.

In my travels I found many of the ads were not for inworld products or people. They were for websites, often porn videos for sale on DVD or site subscription. Or so-called legal gambling.

While land sale prims are not adfarms, the method of selling land really does need to be looked at. While flying around, I did take advantage of signs in the sky, but these were static and just fine. Then you have rotating cubes, which must be nauseating for anyone who's bought land and are trying to enjoy it among unsold plots with that junk on it.

Or the tall spinning for sale signs, which are usually in the air. These dont need to be in motion to work. As it was, someone I came across who just purchased a 1024 had problems setting up stuff because the same real estate entity had a large fullbright spinning for sale sign over a 512 next to her land - ON THE GROUND. It was encroaching on her land (spinning of course through her stuff), but fortunately an IM to them resolved it and the sign was placed higher within the day and over a touch (so I've noticed).



This doesn't help because many people who have group owned land have odd amounts like 51sqm, 102sqm, etc. they're entitled to in addition to their existing land (you can get another 10%'s worth of land based on how much was deeded to a group). There is a need for 400-something sqm.



Depends on whether it's just content or spinning, fullbright nuisances. Remember one av's sarcasm is another av's performance art. I think a small patch of kitty faces would be kinda neat.

Something which bugs me is the clustering of ads on the sides of roads. It's as though no one can guarantee themselves one side of their property without banlines or clashing alpha screens. Imagine if someone could actually incorporate a path or driveway from their property onto the road if they had the opportunity.

Where you'd zone these advertisements will be another cause for scrutiny. Personally I think a region set aside per continent, each with a clever cultural synonym for "hell" as the name, would be a good place for a sea of the things.

NCI uses adfarm towers? Really? I would think sticking to welcome centers and infohubs (which we need more of), help islands, resource locations such as IToP, voluntary postings in people's shops or galleries (offer boxed textures or ready ads with dimensions in their object names) so people can rez a landmark giver to your beach. Have a billboard arranged at all major Linden landmarks. Much of this is already happening, and I'd be surprised if those adfarm things didn't bring in the least number of your target audience. (note I said target audience. people who grab from your wall and resell freebies in shops wouldnt count)




I didnt read it that way at all, He said all adfarms would be removed. Period.

Legitimate presences - such as shops and services such as NCI could be eligible to acquire licenses for nonintrusive quality ads in zoned areas - no one said 16sqm ad towers would return. If they're like highway billboards in designated areas, that's the shape they'll take and not big barriers of eyesores.

That's how I read Jack's answer.

Without having read thru all the replies (and I apologise if someone has hit on this concept already)....

First, bravo for finally addressing this issue. It's one of the main reasons I looked elsewhere to buy land. I just couldn't stand the over-all chaos of the mainland....and a huge bit of that is add farms.

But the thing that immediately comes to mind to draw some kind of parallel to RL.....in most states in the USA......there's a limit to the amount of billboards that can be posted along a stretch of road. In others.....you get a sort of billboard fenzy where everyone and anyone has an add posted on the side of the highway and it's the most unattractive thing.

However, it occurs to me that perhaps.....SL's answer to rampant add-farming might be as simple as selling billboard space to legitimate advertisers. Billboards customarily set along highways or well traveled stretches of road......you get the idea. It might at least give some kind of order to the chaos.....structure....zoning, however you want to put it. It just seems like add space should be in very thoughtfully designated areas. And actually...I've seen some really cool billboards already in SL that would enhance certain cityscapes. Design is key.... there has to be a way to balance the issue. Advertising in and of itself is not a bad thing..... when properly done.... it adds to the surrounding ambiance.

So if ONE of your neighbours decides your house is ugly..will you take it down Talarus?

Just FYI, MGK Advertisement also did adfarming. Up until recently, he had several adfarm plots in Great Pubnico. I finally got one of them for a reasonable price, and he sold the other two to another adfarmer. His plots were right there in the middle of an adfarm with the rest of them, so I wouldn't polish his halo too much with the "legitimate" cloth.

Well, that is interesting; I have been treated to a display of some advertising in SL, half of which was perfectly fine, and the other I found rather annoying. (This is out of _two_ tries.)

Overall I am not sure that this was a suggestive discussion, but it does at least demonstrate that it is physically possible to have advertising in SL which is not appalling.

My HOUSE isn't an advertisement.

My HOUSE is necessary for me to live in.

Your advertisement is not.

Thus, I think the comparison MyHouse >>> YourAdSpam holds true.

And no, I do not want to be friends with your damned alts.