adults, playing children, in mature sims

I have ran across a "family" with 3 "children" living in a mature sim. from what i can tell, non of the "Children" have payment info on file, they are all boys, and all state "I am 18+"

is this allowed?

oh jesus here we go you F**** busy bodies mind your own F**** business and leave other grown adults alone. who the hell do you think you are anyway? be really really glad im not in charge because i would skin you alive and hang you from a post to bleed the EVIL SHEER AUDACITY MENTAL ILLNESS you sick judgemental arrogant pompous tyrant wanna be who has no control over your own psychological well being let alone another grown adults pixels in a virtual world you make me f**** vomit my brains out all over this forum


bool the end.

eerUH, How do you really feel?

well, that was quite uncalled for. All i asked was if this was ok, no need to be an a$$hole to me

As long as you don't see the child avs engaging in any 'adult' activities, it's fine.

thank you.

Yes it is allowed. Just grown ups role playing as kids... I am no age play fan myself but if it is just role play from adults then there is no crime involved to any kids. Just ignore it and move on.

http://secondlife.com/corporate/cs.php
http://secondlife.com/corporate/tos.php

Also according to the links above it is not against the rules to have sexual activities going on either if it is on private owned land....

"Indecency
Second Life is an adult community, but Mature material is not necessarily appropriate in all areas (see Global Standards below). Content, communication, or behavior which involves intense language or expletives, nudity or sexual content, the depiction of sex or violence, or anything else broadly offensive must be contained within private land in areas rated Mature (M). Names of Residents, objects, places and groups are broadly viewable in Second Life directories and on the Second Life website, and must adhere to PG guidelines. "

Wow quite a mature response from poster number 2. *rolls eyes*

Honestly I think what grown adults do is there own business. I will admit The family set ups freak me out a little though beyond boyfriends girlfriends/partners. I logged onto a "will You be my mommy" offline yesterday, and although my first response thoughts were, "Who the hell is this" and "Why the hell would I want an adult doing baby talk around me", I thought a moment before I responded, and then replied with a "I appreciate You considering Me, but sl family's just aren't my thing". I guess ultimately getting asked was a compliant, it's just not my thing personally. What other adults do is non of my business though.

You are out of date Jaydee - Sexual Age Play was banned Via a Blog post.

No Avatars depicting minors are allowed to be depicting/engaging in sexual activity.

Non sexual activities on any rated land involving Avatars that Depict minors is fine.

Blog post is irrelevant if it is not in the TOS or Community Standards. I am not out of date if this is the case. Linden Lab is if it is not added to those. How is a new player or old player not reading the blogs supposed to know? It must be in the TOS or Community Standards as those are the rules for SL. A blog post will not hold up in any court.

EDIT: I may have missed it in the TOS but don't think so.

not my piece of pie and aslong it isn`t forced on my in any kind of way u won`t hear me say a word about it

what gets on my nerves tho is the entire family thing going on and on and on and on in public to a point i`ll just "stfu and take it to IM" (only happend once so far tho wich was annoying as hell)

aslong it isn`t in the TOS it`s slegal

Its not named specifically in the TOS.

Well its been shown that the TOS will not necessarily hold up in court ..

But it just fits in there can deny you service for any reason part of the TOS.

The TOS was not changed to spell out Sexual Ageplay as an banned activity. However it is banned. If Sexual Ageplay is reported and investigated and discovered to exist material will be delted and players banned.

I dont think that Nazi Iconography is mentioned by name in the Intolerance cluase either.

While I personally agree they should spell out what things are not allowed and what youll get banned for - that is not how LL does things anymore. (If they ever did)

Well, why wouldn't it be allowed? Do you mean that you suspect sexual activity? You don't SAY that though. Therefore I incline to think that you have no concrete reason to suspect it.

There are many in SL who live within family structures, and in some of these the players are actually related RL ... and in others not. In some, people are playing children BECAUSE they do not want to be in any sexual situation at all. In others, people enjoy playing child roles just because of the general charm it gives to a group of people who share a sim or parcel .. and they may have alts for more adult activities.

A lot of people are freaked out by child AVs, and I was initially too, and then I decided that its no more freaky than any other character role. I mean, if you want to see freaky, check out the familial structure of a Vampire tribe.

It's not against the TOS for adults with child avs to be in Mature areas. Most of the Mature sims don't even have a lot of explicitly adult content so "Mature" in that context doesn't mean a lot. As was already pointed out, it's sexual ageplay that is banned.

I'd be far more worried about all the children who have adult avs on the grid.....

As part of a family of three SL children living in a mature sim (although not all boys), I can tell you dat yes it is allowed. As has been addresseed in these forums numerous times, SL's policies on child avatars break down as follows:

Child avatars are in themselves allowed. Child avatars in sexual situations (sexual congress obviously, though it is unclear beyond this) are not allowed and ARable. Public promotion (classified listing, profile, etc.) of sexual situations with child avatars is not allowed and ARable. Indicating that the *real age* of a child avatar (as opposed to a stated SL/role playing age) is below main grid age is not allowed and ARable.

That the land is set to mature does not indicate that the child avatars are engaging in unseemly acts. It may simply be the land they had, or dat their parents had before they had the kids about. It could also be a convenience for the adult avatars when the children are away/asleep/etc. There is nothign to prevent a child avatar from being on mature land.

I should also add for you, as a point of note, dat not all -- very few, by any indication -- of child avatars are involved in any sort of adult/child or child/child sexual situations with their avatars, and not simply because such is ARable and quite potentially illegal. Most who are playing kids in SL are doing it for a number of other reasons, and the idea of such acts would be at least as abhorrent to them as to you. I know you did not ascribe any actions to the avatars in question, but I felt it valid to note that, just in case anyone was.

If you find yourself with any other questiosn abotu child avatars, hey, feel free t'look me up!

Mari

This has been a long-time issue on this: the first prohibition was not even discussed on the blog, but was enforced via inworld notecard. I believe it is assumed to fall under the "broadly offensive" category, in an implied manner.

Mari
(Who has had to learn way, way too much about the TOS and CS)

Well you are correct about the termination. However there is no indication you will get terminated by age play. That is what the TOS and Community standards are for. Making you aware of what they will terminate you for. The current Community Standards is worded to imply sexual age play is fine on private land. If that is not the case they need to make it very clear. Especially if their is no RL law about it in the USA.

As for the termination part in the TOS I find it pretty absurd. It is one of the reason I stopped any investment in SL. Just knowing at anytime all the stuff I made and bought that has monetary value could be gone without reimbursement is completely unacceptable. Also for them to state I have copyrights but not on anything on their servers is also absurd. Everything in SL is on their servers so no one has any copyrights or intellectual property in SL?

"2.6 Linden Lab may suspend or terminate your account at any time, without refund or obligation to you.

Linden Lab has the right at any time for any reason or no reason to suspend or terminate your Account, terminate this Agreement, and/or refuse any and all current or future use of the Service without notice or liability to you. In the event that Linden Lab suspends or terminates your Account or this Agreement, you understand and agree that you shall receive no refund or exchange for any unused time on a subscription, any license or subscription fees, any content or data associated with your Account, or for anything else."

also this:

"
3.3 Linden Lab retains ownership of the account and related data, regardless of intellectual property rights you may have in content you create or otherwise own.

You agree that even though you may retain certain copyright or other intellectual property rights with respect to Content you create while using the Service, you do not own the account you use to access the Service, nor do you own any data Linden Lab stores on Linden Lab servers (including without limitation any data representing or embodying any or all of your Content). Your intellectual property rights do not confer any rights of access to the Service or any rights to data stored by or on behalf of Linden Lab. "


But anyway I digress. So many reason not to get into any type of business or any type of investment in SL. Hell you can't even walk around anymore with worrying if you are going to get AR'ed by some bothered person. ..

Specifically says broadly offensive stuff is fine on private land.

"Second Life is an adult community, but Mature material is not necessarily appropriate in all areas (see Global Standards below). Content, communication, or behavior which involves intense language or expletives, nudity or sexual content, the depiction of sex or violence, or anything else broadly offensive must be contained within private land in areas rated Mature (M)."

Yeah they play fast and loose with that definition though.

I had a thread on this a while back.

Seems Danny Linden is just enamored witht he term Broadly Offesnsive. And on the one hand uses it in the Community Standards (he had a hand in writing them evidently) as allowed on Mature parcels -

On the other in the infamous turn-in-your neighbor "Broadly Offensive" Blog post - that Broadly Offensive matierial is never allowed in Second Life at all - he goes on to use simulated Rape as an example of an activity that is never allowed. This one has not been enforced to the level of the Sexual Age Play ban,

Basically the Community Standards are not of the same importance as the TOS - in fact they were basically put together by someone that has stated publically they all will eventually all go away except for the intolerance clause.

From the first paragraph of the TOS:



The blog is one of the written contact methods they have established with us.

Previous discussion on this subject.

Didnt ammount to anything, of course. As you mention tonight - a definite disconect.

LOL But JayDee has a point - what happens when they change stuff but dont even bother to ammend the TOS and the Community Standards.



On certain things though such as what breaks some censorship rule - they will remain mum as long as Blogtastically possible.

They should definitely rewrite the TOS to reflect all significant changes, but you know that's the line they'd point at if someone complained about it. "We blogged it, and that counts..."

The blog cannot be a contact method unless everyone is forced to read or can easily find it from a link on the main website. Neither is possible. You have to do an in depth search to find the blog posts. I did that and still didn't find the threads. Bad search terms I guess.. Most players don't even know the blog exists.

I also play Entropia Universe. How they get around this is you are required to agree to the TOS EVERY time you log on.

However the age play thing is nothing compared to the parts I posted from the TOS about the copyrights and intellectual property. According to those non of your stuff on the SL servers have any copyright or intellectual property rights by you.

So if I were to rip skins textures (easily done no matter what permissions are, you can rip any texture right out of your video cards buffers!) and re-upload them to SL and sell them or give them away the original skin designer has no recourse because they are on SL's server which clearly states you have no copyright or intellectual rights on anything on the servers even if you made it..... The only thing keeping people from doing that is the majority of people don't know about the FREEWARE program available to do this not only in SL but any game that uses OpenGL.

Then of course if your inventory gets deleted and you loose thousands of USD worth of stuff and can't be restored you are just out that money.... Or if your account gets disabled or banned you are out that money....

Everyone is just going on blind hope they don't loose their investment but things like SL get unpluged when they stop making profit.

The current blog posts appear on the viewer log in screen, meaning the information is easily available at the time it's announced. In any case, you'd have to take the distinction up with LL....they DO seem to view the blog as sufficient official communication on these topics.

http://blog.secondlife.com/2007/05/09/accusations-regarding-child-pornography-in-second-life/

http://blog.secondlife.com/2007/05/31/keeping-second-life-safe-together/