Sl Land

Hello, new to this forum bit but here goes.

My partner and I brought land in sl. We put up a lovely little house and settled in to enjoy the quite life, away from buisness etc.
Then last week the peace was shattered.
The person who owned the sim went "bust" and "sold" the sim t oanother. who is redeveloping it and wants us out. we've paid the tier until the 15th adn would keep paying it, but they won't acept it and will kick us out for not paying. Basically they want us off the sim so they can redevelop it. GOR, nice. We are gettting none of our money back at all. LL have ignored our apeal. So here's a warning to all. SL land on nonmainland sims is a waste of you L$.
I think I may buy a sim, sell all the land go "bust" and "sell" it to someone. Possibly and ALT?
Easy L$!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and yes I am P**sed off.
Love you all. Well except the people stealing my land. I feel like and indian being given a bottle of fire water for new york.

Hello this happened to me also, I bought on a Private Island when I was a newbie, paid $800.00 US$
, and had paid two months tiers in advance. $100.00 US per month.

Then the Island was sold and then changed hands, and I was emotionally battered by the new owner, and then thrown out by the new owner
The emotional battering was as bad as the loss of money-

I was extremely upset and shocked, I could not believe this was allowed in SL, as in RL this would be so unacceptable.
I also came here to the forums to find out where I stood, and it was not good news.
The new owner can do anything they choose, at there discretion.

I picked myself up dusted myself off, and went to rent a lovely little home from the nicest most honorable, land baron in SL. You can IM me in world if you want his name

It was a really hard lesson to learn, I will never own in SL again.
But I moved on, as there is no other choice.
I'm so sorry this happened to you, and I know how you feel!

"Buying" land on a privately-owned estate for any sum more than $1 must be as big a scam as investing in "banks".

When you pay a large sum for a parcel on a private island, all you are doing is helping the owner recoup the purchase cost that much sooner, while you have no rights or recourse when they abandon.

There are plenty of great private islands doing pure rentals... many (most?) of which will happily assign the land to your name for the duration of the rental.... no up-front cost, no risk beyond the terms of your lease.

I don't think it's a scam (though I can see how easy it is to use the system to scam), I see it as more of a perception that has been created as a result of its popularity and mass acceptance over the years, and its promotion by intelligent respected individuals. I think most who offer these parcels are not only genuine in intent, but they are also capable of following out that intent. Other than that, I find it hard to disagree with you, though with the strong emphasis on what I have said above.

Hello Lotta
I'm sorry about your experience with the land.
Tell me, did you "Buy" anything or purely pay rent?

There are rental only islands out there, and I am considering starting one.

Sorry to hear about your experience Lotta. It is unfortunate your sim has been taken over by an impatient and inconsiderate person.

My partner and I are in the rental business and the only we land we purchase is the 'No Covenant' land so we pay tier directly to LL. This was at least an individual cannot rip us off and we can stay as long as we like!

Yes, I agree thats one option, but the bottom line is that if ANY resident rents to another, Linden will never intervene in a dispute, even if you pay L1Million for a plot one day and they disappear the next.

Therefore it's totally dependant on 2 things, 1) the honesty and integrity of the land owner and 2) the exposure of the tenant. This is really the same as buying mainland with Linden being the owner.

For example, if you bought 4k mainland (for whatever price from a resident) and you paid your monthly tier to Linden then the day after LL with bust, same situation.

If no price is charged for the ownership of the land in the first place then the tenants exposure is limited.

Sounds like you are completely ethical in your business - I hope you have and get the recognition for that

Someone go get Raymond..He has the ordained Official A-List Estate Owners Guide.
To the OP: I feel for you. And am sorry for the situation. This is a huge problem in SL and you will be getting a ton of information from this thread...As it is a weekly thread topic and so many have been screwed by Sim Owners.
You will be ok.. Keep your head up and move on ! Good Luck!

It's not the same though. If LL went bust, those who are 'buying' on estates would lose just as much as those who own land on the main grid. The difference is that those who have 'bought' land in another resident's sim also have to rely on that resident to stick around, something main grid land owners don't have to worry about.

and thats down to the same two points.

It's all about risk and trust as usual.

(checks the posts re SL banks lol)

If I start a "no purchase fee" island, then the only risk is outstanding rent, which could be paid in weekly installments.

Also, I'd be quite happy to agree to a written agreement where if I put the sim up for auction say, I'd pay back any rent if the tenant wanted to leave there and then or pass it to the new owner when sold as required.

Agreed, if you plan on staying in sl for years mainland could seem more stable but is it really? You're tied to a parcel that next week could be a mall or worse. There are so many Forum entried about "why cant I do anything about my neighbours ugly land" etc.

... and when all said and done, how many plan to stay for years and always have the same spot?

I dont disagree with your post as such, it's just that there are it seems to me, better and fairer ways to conduct business than what is seen in some of the horror stories here.

But importantly, those risks are additive. One model involves the risk of LL continuing to be around, and the other model involves not only the risk of LL being around, but also the risk associated with the resident who owns the sim sticking around.



That certainly lowers the amount a tenant could potentially lose. (This is what I did for several years btw).



I think you're touching on the main problem really - the agreements made in SL aren't really worth anything, everything is based on trust.



Some want zoning, some don't. Some prefer contiguous land, some don't. You could make a list of 'positives' and 'negatives' associated with living on land in both estates and on the main grid, but attributing which is which just comes down the personal preferences of the resident. The risk associated with each, on the other hand, though involving some speculative opinion, is more black and white.



Well I wasn't stating any opinion in that post (unlike this one), only fact, and so I don't think there was anything to disagree on

And of course there are fairer ways, but like most things, it all comes down to the people - some are more ethically challenged than others.

If you buy an island plot you can be scammed. If you buy a product it may not be delivered. I'd love to see the combined amount of money people lose to non-delivery of goods when the store owner won't provide a replacement product or refund.

Personally I think there should be a contract on estate land, covenants are one way deals (although so is the TOS). When buying an Island from another resident, if the existing tenants have purchased plots the value of that should be paid to the existing tenants, the remainder goes to the person selling the island. That in reality is what the island is worth.

If it's a pure rental then again, outstanding tier fees should be deducted if you're planning on evicting them and paid to the tenants.

Really, if I was buying a second hand island I'd want all of these figures in front of me before I went ahead with the purchase.

Now if an island is abandoned, then that's different and falls into bankruptcy territory really.

All these points are quite valid.

But in a scenario whare you walk up to an empty plot, pay nothing but a weeks rent or maybe 2, then your risk is low and after a few days almost zero as you have "received your goods" as it were. The only way to reduce it more would be daily billing which is probably more trouble than its worth.

All in all, if no estate owner ever ripped off a tenant, even paying up front for some ethereal deed would not be an issue.

As is it, at least by minimising tenant risk (by not profiteering) I just felt that some fairness and credibility could be injected back in to the system (I know thare are some estate owners already doing this).

I am still considering doing this. I'd be happy to break even and have a little play space for myself and possibly use space for some of the charitable groups in sl.

So, without wishing to hijack the OP's thread, let me know if this is a good idea - maybe I can even stretch to a few weeks free for Lotta as a gesture

If you decide to go with it Sparkz, I hope all goes well for you. You seem like a genuinely decent person, so I'm sure you would have no problems finding tenants.

Thats very kind of you Hiro.

Thank you

Thanks Sparkz - I agree, that thanks to LL not intervening with residential disputes, people who rent are abosultely reliant on the honesty of the people they rent from.

I don't ever want to be tarred with the same brush as those who rip people off and steal their money. I take the line that I would never do it in RL and certainly see no reason to do it in SL.

I hope that these theives can live with thier consciences.

I suspect, based on rl experiences also, that the only sleep they lose is when they have nightmares involving a world where they cant scam anyone lol

Yes, we can live in a world where the fastest gun wins or the hardest hitter, but we dont have to.

Yes by all means make a profit and get rich if it makes you happy, I have no issue with that.

"Other products are available" as they say

So sorry for your bad experience, OP! And VERY sorry for the person who purchased $800 of rental land and lost it!

Because resident-resident interactions are all trust-based, buying vs. renting in SL is very much a risk/reward decision. The platform instability adds another level of risk. Personally, when buying from a resident, I never pay more than I can afford to lose.

There is even an element of risk when buying from the Lindens on mainland, because you are implicitly trusting your current and future neighbors not to drive you out and devalue your land. On an estate, when you buy you are trusting that your estate owner will not desert you.

The lowest risk investment is pure rental, with no upfront fee. Sparkz, if you make an attractive sim with good policies, it should be quite possible to make tier. It will be a lot of work until you get a reputation, though - I would think you should prepare yourself for a few months of *not* making enough money to cover tier when you start. Just in case.

Myself, I "bought" land on an island, but only a 4K. I'm paying rent which is slightly lower than LL tier for an equivalent plot, and have been very happy. It is lovely mountainous land, and the estate owner was very responsive during a recent very difficult neighbor situation. He also made it snow over Christmas *S*!

Count me in as a satisfied Island "renter" I paid an upfront fee too, but I have a beautiful plot on an island with a nice prim multiplier. My landlord is a dear, the covenant is very light, mainly just be nice and considerate, and I do have the ability to sell my plot. We too have Snow this year and it really is nice. There is an available plot next to mine, and although I have no need for the land, I'm tempted to grab it anyway. So Island living has it's own set of risks, but in my case the rewards outweigh them.

This is all very encouraging, both in terms of what I'd like to do and also because people ARE having better experiences than the OP.

It may be seen by the "barons" that I am undercutting their efforts, I suppose thats true, but my intention is not to have an array of 80 islands, rather to have a small amount of desirable places, always full of happy people (I know- impossible lol).

I'd like to have a start at this soon, anyone wanting to know more please IM me in world.

I would also like to be able to provide free buildings where needed and also home security (so there is less temptation for ban lines).

Anyone with with advice / suggestions always welcome.

Good for you Sparkz, I am a believer in Private estates, and it's always nice o see a principled owner. Although I'm happy where I am, I'll be interested to take a look at your place once it is up, "just in case". I think a lot of good estate Owners get tarred with a very broad brush thanks to the crooks out there, especially since some of the best ones are right here. Good Luck.

/me looks at my latest build and calculates that it won't take me too much longer - might be able to lend my monkey hand to a build if you need help from a fellow UK type person ...

Oh yeah. The thread lol. I have a FANTASTIC estate owner for my beach land, I could not ask for more, she is even handed and fair and will bend over backwards to help. As a result she has a swathe of loyal and retained custom and keeps on adding new islands which fill fill fill as a result.

Sorry to hear you had that experience and glad you got sorted - but as to naming names here no one minds if it's not for defamatory reasons ... recommending someone personally as being pretty damned good never was a problem

Great, his name is Raymond Figtree