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Sex Beds Banned in PG land

Imnotgoing Sideways
Can't outlaw cute! =^-^=
Join date: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 4,694
06-04-2009 10:13
From: Amity Slade
How could Linden Lab possibly be making up these policies without doing any research as to how these policies affect the grid?

So, in that 2% - 4% number of those affected by the changes, I guess they forgot to calculate sex beds into the research?
Blondin asked that question because sex beds in (PG) have been against the rules all along. The concept of someone actually getting away with it is alien to someone who understands the rules as they are and always have been. (=_=)

If they're "Making up" these policies just now, why is it me and people like me have this awareness that the policy has been in place all along? (=_=)
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Marianne McCann
Feted Inner Child
Join date: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 7,145
06-04-2009 10:15
From: Avalon Asturias
I believe that such a group does indeed exist. Having an alt who has been in the sl kid & family community for 3 years I have seen such activities happening on an alarming frequency. Both from within the sl kid&family community and also against it. Where do they hide? I have no idea. But they definitely do exist and waste a great deal of time promoting their agenda. 2 groups I have heard of are religious in nature ( I won't state here which groups those are or name the religion). We have another group attacking sl kids and their sl parents stating that by having a child avatar you are causing real life pedophiles (who access sl in world) to act out their impulses and thus causing real life kids to be raped and brutalized! The things people will beleive still continues to astound me. :eek:


'tis true! I've come across some of 'em myself over the last three+ years, most recently about 5-6 months ago with one of their members who was attempting to entrap kid avvies with the old "come with me, I have some candy " line (no, really!). Trouble is, kid avvies network, so we all got to hear about it. He was trying to get them to go somewhere where he could somehow "prove" we were all bad and AR us. An they say I'm th weird one!

From: Imnotgoing Sideways
That's such an antibandwagonist thing to say. (^_^)

Bloody truth, though. (^_^)y


Indeed.
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"There's nothing objectionable nor illegal in having a child-like avatar in itself and we must assume innocence until proof of the contrary." - Lewis PR Linden
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Arcady Yue
Sex Kitten
Join date: 19 May 2009
Posts: 160
06-04-2009 10:19
From: Brenda Connolly
Those who were here may remember when "Broadly Offensive" became the SL buzzword, around the time Aristotle was trotted out. Robin talked about "building trust" while Daniel basically encouraged everyone to squeal on their neighbor when they saw Broadly Offensive material, Yet refuded to defing what Broadly Offensive was. Seems the wheel is coming round again.


People who are easily offended seem to have little trouble defining this. But people who are more open minded have a lot of trouble understanding terms like 'Broadly Offensive.' We need specific details because, well, if you can't manage to get offended by something, its hard to see why its going to offend anyone...

(I wanted to say, once you get open minded its hard to get so close minded, but I know a number of ex-hippy types who now live on the conservative right - which makes me have doubt about them ever having actually been liberal, but that might also be my own limited worldview failing to understand them.)

Of course, what is Broadly Offensive changes over time. Miscegenation for example - though its still 'patently offensive' among the far right, can no longer be called broadly offensive at least in the US. Likewise the list of what is Broadly Offensive gets larger every time a conservative faction gets into power.
Brenda Connolly
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06-04-2009 10:23
From: Imnotgoing Sideways
Blondin asked that question because sex beds in (PG) have been against the rules all along. The concept of someone actually getting away with it is alien to someone who understands the rules as they are and always have been. (=_=)


That's naivety, bordering on denial. Using your own analogy, that's like a cop being surprised people are speeding. Are Lindens all so binary in thought that they don't take into account human nature? A certain percentage of people will always flaunt rules and laws?
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Imnotgoing Sideways
Can't outlaw cute! =^-^=
Join date: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 4,694
06-04-2009 10:29
From: Brenda Connolly
That's naivety, bordering on denial. Using your own analogy, that's like a cop being surprised people are speeding. Are Lindens all so binary in thought that they don't take into account human nature? A certain percentage of people will always flaunt rules and laws?
To be honest? For some, "It's just a job." (^_^)y
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Brenda Connolly
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06-04-2009 10:30
From: Arcady Yue
People who are easily offended seem to have little trouble defining this. But people who are more open minded have a lot of trouble understanding terms like 'Broadly Offensive.' We need specific details because, well, if you can't manage to get offended by something, its hard to see why its going to offend anyone...

(I wanted to say, once you get open minded its hard to get so close minded, but I know a number of ex-hippy types who now live on the conservative right - which makes me have doubt about them ever having actually been liberal, but that might also be my own limited worldview failing to understand them.)

Of course, what is Broadly Offensive changes over time. Miscegenation for example - though its still 'patently offensive' among the far right, can no longer be called broadly offensive at least in the US. Likewise the list of what is Broadly Offensive gets larger every time a conservative faction gets into power.


Political Conservatism does not always equate close mindedness or being easily offended. I would be considered Conservative by most definitions, but I am almost impossible to offend. Meanwhile, there are those who call themselves Liberals who are the most whiney, Politically Correct people walking the planet.

The danger in not defining "Broadly Offensive" in the context here is that it is being used for essentially Law Enforcement in SL. How can a law be enforced when the parameters are undefined. Telling someone to report what they feel is offensive is one thing, but now what does the person reading the report do? Does he go by what he "feels"? There has to be consistency in definition and application.
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Bradley Bracken
Goodbye, Farewell, Amen
Join date: 2 Apr 2007
Posts: 3,856
06-04-2009 10:30
From: Imnotgoing Sideways
But-but-but... What about the international campaign against masturbation? We all have a responsibility to save people from themselves and the bad! bad! bad! things they do. (>_<;)

=^-^=


I don't want my av to go blind so I'm going to let him jerk off just long enough that he needs glasses.
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Milla Janick
Empress Of The Universe
Join date: 2 Jan 2008
Posts: 3,075
06-04-2009 10:38
From: Brenda Connolly
That's naivety, bordering on denial. Using your own analogy, that's like a cop being surprised people are speeding. Are Lindens all so binary in thought that they don't take into account human nature? A certain percentage of people will always flaunt rules and laws?

I wonder how much time Lindens spend in-world on average.
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Imnotgoing Sideways
Can't outlaw cute! =^-^=
Join date: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 4,694
06-04-2009 10:43
From: Milla Janick
I wonder how much time Lindens spend in-world on average.
Add: For the time they ARE in-world, how much time do they spend on the open grid at-large and not in their protected shut-in sims? (=_=)
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Amity Slade
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Join date: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 2,183
06-04-2009 10:47
From: Imnotgoing Sideways
Blondin asked that question because sex beds in (PG) have been against the rules all along. The concept of someone actually getting away with it is alien to someone who understands the rules as they are and always have been. (=_=)

If they're "Making up" these policies just now, why is it me and people like me have this awareness that the policy has been in place all along? (=_=)


What I was criticizing was not the fact that sex beds were not and would continue to not be allowed on PG land.

What I was criticizing was that Blondin had to ask if people used/sold sex beds on PG land currently.

If Linden Lab doesn't know anything about whether its current policies are enforced, then that shows they have absolutely no plan to enforce a new policy.

If Linden Lab isn't aware that sex beds are on PG land now, that is another fact pointing to the fact that the "research" Linden Lab did, to discover how many people would be affected by the new Adult policies, was never done.

If Blondin has to ask the question, it shows both that Blondin doesn't spend a lot of time on the grid.

And it shows that, again, Linden Lab is not serious about follow-through with the policy if no one at Linden Lab can spend the ten minutes (or less) to confirm that there are sex beds all over PG land now.

Anyone serving as a Linden Lab spokesperson probably needs training on what to do with a question to which the spokesperson doesn't know the answer. Responding with surprise that there are sex beds on PG land looks foolish. Responding that one doesn't know how pervasive sex beds are on PG land, but one will look into it immediately, is at least responsible and professional.
Imnotgoing Sideways
Can't outlaw cute! =^-^=
Join date: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 4,694
06-04-2009 10:51
From: Amity Slade
...If Linden Lab doesn't know anything about whether its current policies are enforced, then that shows they have absolutely no plan to enforce a new policy...
In regards to PG...
From: https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2009/06/01/adult-content-changes-in-summary
Enforcement will not change.
... the Lindens will agree with you there. (^_^)
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Ian Nider
Seeds
Join date: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 1,011
06-04-2009 10:52
What I don't get is that the sex pose balls are very cartoonish, they aren't really porn at all. I can't see they would get people off like porn might.

I mean if people were showing xxx porn all over SL then maybe there'd be a validity to all this whoo haa.
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Brenda Connolly
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06-04-2009 10:56
From: Milla Janick
I wonder how much time Lindens spend in-world on average.


They pretty much are the equivalent of the idiots in DC who don't know what's going on outside the Beltway, aren't they?
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Imnotgoing Sideways
Can't outlaw cute! =^-^=
Join date: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 4,694
06-04-2009 10:57
From: Ian Nider
What I don't get is that the sex pose balls are very cartoonish, they aren't really porn at all. I can't see they would get people off like porn might.

I mean if people were showing xxx porn all over SL then maybe there'd be a validity to all this whoo haa.
Google: Hentai Anime. (^_^)
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Ian Nider
Seeds
Join date: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 1,011
06-04-2009 11:06
From: Imnotgoing Sideways
Google: Hentai Anime. (^_^)


Yeh I had a mate into that, it's kind of lush art.

To me it's the cartoonish aspect of it that makes it verge on un-sexual.

I guess some poses are symbolic of a sentiment the avatars may have to ech other. But yeh, it's not like it is pornography.
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Amity Slade
Registered User
Join date: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 2,183
06-04-2009 11:44
From: Ian Nider


To me it's the cartoonish aspect of it that makes it verge on un-sexual.

I guess some poses are symbolic of a sentiment the avatars may have to ech other. But yeh, it's not like it is pornography.


This is why it has always violated my intuition that minors who wanted to look at "dirty" material would go to Second Life to find it.

In Second Life, it takes a lot of work to find low-quality pornography.

On the world-wide-web, one can find high-quality, free pornography that is very easy to access.

I just have to believe that the kids looking for porn are going the easiest route with the quickest and most satisfying payoff.
Ian Nider
Seeds
Join date: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 1,011
06-04-2009 11:50
From: Amity Slade
This is why it has always violated my intuition that minors who wanted to look at "dirty" material would go to Second Life to find it.

In Second Life, it takes a lot of work to find low-quality pornography.

On the world-wide-web, one can find high-quality, free pornography that is very easy to access.

I just have to believe that the kids looking for porn are going the easiest route with the quickest and most satisfying payoff.


SL is to adult in its concepts for children full stop. "Broadly" so.

I think children would come to Sl for sure, but yeh, I agree, watching adults tud tud away in cartoon form and not that good a cartoon form at that wouldn't hold them.

That said, LL should fire up the teen grid a bit for them, there'd be heaps of scripting talent among their generation.
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Ceka Cianci
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Join date: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 4,489
06-04-2009 12:06
From: Milla Janick
Good.

I'm not going to be terribly sympathetic towards PG users when they get what they asked for.
This ^^
=================
people complained enough over the past few years about the mature sims and things on them..but didn't realize when theyask for one thing they may get exactly that and everything that comes with it..LL is only doing what the residents were asking for..just like with bots and camping..

so where is the problem? lol :D
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Viciously Llewellyn
Not Really Vicious ;-)
Join date: 27 Sep 2007
Posts: 332
06-04-2009 12:24
From: Milla Janick

I don't see why anyone on PG land would be upset by this if LL actually follows through and enforces their definition of PG land. You'll be getting the land you thought you were buying in the first place.


I'm certainly not upset, although I have my doubts as to how well this will be enforced. My guess is very poorly.

I was really just on my anti-BS campaign again. ;) Not you, or anyone else, has even a shred of evidence that any of this came about, do to any actions by PG landholders.
Ceka Cianci
SuperPremiumExcaliburAcc#
Join date: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 4,489
06-04-2009 12:38
it really doesn't matter how it came about..
people were asking for this and people are getting a full version of what they were asking for and not liking that it is including their area as well..

a lot of people were saying to them..be careful what you ask for because you may just get it..

here we are today..
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Imnotgoing Sideways
Can't outlaw cute! =^-^=
Join date: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 4,694
06-04-2009 12:43
From: Ceka Cianci
it really doesn't matter how it came about..
people were asking for this and people are getting a full version of what they were asking for and not liking that it is including their area as well..

a lot of people were saying to them..be careful what you ask for because you may just get it..

here we are today..
I, for one, am asking for a complete eradication of PG sims and PG sim rules. Parcel owners get to make their own rules anyway. All I wanna do is casually wear a sheer shirt or some cute pasties once in a while. =^-^=
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Viciously Llewellyn
Not Really Vicious ;-)
Join date: 27 Sep 2007
Posts: 332
06-04-2009 12:53
From: Ceka Cianci
it really doesn't matter how it came about...


If it doesn't matter how it came about, why did you "This" to someone that insinuated that if was caused by PG landholders?
DanielRavenNest Noe
Registered User
Join date: 26 Oct 2006
Posts: 1,076
06-04-2009 15:37
From: Marianne McCann
Um, wasn't that *always* the rule? That's why it's *called* PG land. Presumably why there is so little of it, too.


There is lots of it, thousands of search results when I look for sexbed and adult animations on PG land, read my post #2 in this thread.
LittleMe Jewell
...........
Join date: 8 Oct 2007
Posts: 11,319
06-04-2009 15:37
From: Marcush Nemeth
It's a bit greyer in a closed house with locked doors and a good roof over it, but then you have to remind yourself: why did I choose a PG area to place my house, when I obviously AM interrested in having mature content?

1) I actually know a few people that rent or own on PG land and never ever considered what happened in the privacy of their bedroom to be a violation of the PG rating.

2) So in our new PG Disneyland world, parents are no longer allowed, in the privacy of their own bedroom, to do the very activity that created their children? Hmm, so the parents in SL Families have to now have 2 homes -- one where they live with their kids and one where they can make more kids.

This goes more overboard every day.
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Tarina Sewell
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Join date: 20 Jul 2007
Posts: 2,180
06-04-2009 15:39
From: DanielRavenNest Noe
The final "maturity ratings" have been posted to the Knowledge Base:

https://support.secondlife.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=4417&task=knowledge&questionID=6010?

It not only defines the new adult category, it changes what is allowed on Mature and PG land. In particular for PG:

"A Region may be designated PG if it does not advertise or make available content or activity that's sexually explicit, violent or depicts nudity. Likewise, sexually-oriented objects such as "sex beds" or poseballs may not be located or sold in PG regions."

So any of you that have private homes on PG land with sex furniture or poseballs are in violation of the new ratings. Likewise any stores that sell such things on PG land are in violation.

There are 1422 mainland and 3422 estate PG regions. The Linden staff obviously do not have time to visit that many places looking for sex furniture, but the new rules *do* place you at risk for an abuse report for violating the policy.


my personal opinion, and it is just that... Mine... They should have never been in a PG sim anyway.... BUT

Are kissing poseballs alowed? What about close dancing? Can we hold hands and cuddle?

Well. Im not in a PG sim and usually dont go unless its to a class and honestly there is no place for them there, unless you are building... I guess they wont be having a make a dildo class at the edu sims anymore..... "sigh"
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