ok. The end is nigh

Yes, I took the survey; everywhere it said "Other" I put "Do NOT turn SL into Facebook". It's clear this is the road they're taking. They have some support for this in-world: check out https://blogs.secondlife.com/community/technology/blog/2009/03/28/122-viewer-stability-123-and-viewer-2009#comment-763982. The person who posted that belongs to (created?) a group dedicated to that very end. He is involved in education so doubtless the Lab will listen to him.

I hate Facebook and sites like it: they overwhelm me. If people want a 3D Facebook, why don't they ask FB to set one up? Instead, they come to our beautiful world, and upon deciding it's not quite what they want, seek to change it instead of quietly leaving.

LL, I love SL - it has changed my life. Please don't take that away. Just for once, please listen to the poor bloody infantry: those of us who came, saw, and were conquered by this amazing creation. We put up with all the viewer imperfections, the crashes, the lag, because we love our world. We happily (well, maybe that's too strong a word) pay tier because we want to have a little piece of this enchanting realm where we can build our castles in the air.

We don't want to change the essence of SL - that's what drew us here; that's what keeps us here. We just want a stable viewer, and a company that listens to us and our concerns. If you look back at all the complaints through the years, you'll see that most of them boil down to that.

I could be flippant and ask why LL should be able to get it right when that is what currently happens when they leave people to their own devices, but . . .

. . . I have met eight sl friends in rl and they have all turned out to be not only female but even more attractive than their online claims - and this was after voice, not webcam.

Pep (Surprisingly enough, only one seemed disappointed in me; I wasn't rich enough, apparently.)

Good analysis, I think.

I also don't think that change, per se, is a bad thing. And I don't see the infusion of new blood, and new attitudes and approaches as necessarily evil. But supplementing in the interest of diversity is one thing; merely replacing the "old" with the "new" is quite another. I trust that you are right, however: that LL will bungle it badly enough that its impact upon the non social-networkers among us will be relatively minimal.

In the meantime, I'll just polish my standard lines. "No, I am not sending you an RL picture. No, I won't voice with you. No, I do not want to 'make the sex.'" Etc., etc., etc.

*sigh*

I think it is just the "Tao". Andrew had a "good idea" and set the "Tao" in motion.

(Should Andrew leave the company in the not too distant future this will be the proof of the Tao.)

But M has been crowing about profitability and being recession-proof

Why do they even need to do this survey? Can't they just look at people's profiles and SEE how many people leave the first life tab blank as it is?

They really do seem to be doing their utmost to nudge the "immersionists" (for want of a better term) off the grid. Just like voice, this will surely just drive a wedge through the community. Those who don't choose to share A/S/L info, or whatever, will be looked on with suspicion.

I know that whenever there's a big change, lots of people threaten to leave and then don't, but there's surely only so many times they can count on that. So they get hundreds of thousands of new sign-ups from the shiny SpaceFace crowd, but if all the creative people have left, who's going to make their stuff?

That's right on the nail!

LL is heading down in the direction of the lowest common denominator as fast as it can.


As in the past, LL will float something and engage with residents. They will 'listen carefully' and then do whatever they wanted to do in the first place.

People will point out that allowing a search on RL details amounts to a disclosure of those details.
Soooooo.. J.Random Avatar wants to find females under 30 in his RL geographic area. Use the dating facility and start to groom them.

LL will make inclusion in the search optional. They would have to or we'd be subject to a spam-like flood of "Hi"s from sad people.
They will screw that up so that everyone is searchable.

Well they are of REAL people.... just not the ones writing the personal ad.

I personally think there is a "core" group of people, that if a viable alternative to SL came along, they would be gone. Give me another option for a creative, immersive virtual world such as SL, and I would certainly investigate it. If it proved equal to SL in most areas and was just a little cheaper, more stable or had a better set of creator tools I’d certainly become involved. If it also started to attract a good number of users I’d kiss SL goodbye in a heart beat. Not because I detest SL but just the contrary.

I was attracted to SL because of what it promised back in mid 2006 when I joined. I’m far less attracted to what SL has become and if they move towards some abomination of an on line dating service then it has totally lost it’s appeal for me. The push towards the corporate and educational monstrosities is bad enough.

If I want to buy a car I’ll go to an automobile dealership... if I want to pursue another degree I’ll enroll in a real university and attend classes again... if I want to be spammed by commercials at every turn I’ll watch commercial television... if I want to embark on a new RL relationship I’ll start going out dating again (after a divorce that is). I come to SL to relax, to fantasize, to imagine, to escape from reality, to showcase my art and to create. If SL becomes an environment where I can’t do those things then there is no use in me being here and I’ll leave without an alternative.

My advice to LL is to remember where your bread is buttered and who buttered it.

When age verification was first introduced there was talk of your profiles showing your sex, age band and home city.

So female, 20 - 30, New York or Male, 40 - 50, Paris.

The suggestion wasn't popular but it would seem LL still want to use such details.

Who knew the targeted Corporate Accounts were eHarmony and match.com?

Interesting in the light of a discussion I had with a Linden the other day over adult content in profiles.

The mantra is "profiles must be PG!" ...even to the extent that avatar names with the filtered keywords are now invisible in the All search tab unless you are account verified and search with Adult checked.

So my suggestion has been to add an adult content tab to the profiles where all that stuff can be stashed away and the tab only be visible to other residents that have verified. Then at least everyone will have a visible profile and we, the adult perverts, get to see the pervy side of our fellow residents.

The response from Linden Lab was basically "NO, we will not add another tab to the profiles. That defeats the purpose of having them PG." oooooooook?

So where does this (surveyed) initiative fit into such a picture?

----

At the moment Linden Lab looks a bit like Apple Computer did in the nineties when the suits moved in and pulled the company in all kinds of directions where the company was pretty close to end in the history books as a result.

Catering to the Facebook crowd is not even technically possible on a (current) platform that chokes on 80.000 concurrent users.

The corporate crowd that someone in the Lab is desperately twittering about may attract some niche players, but to make a corporation productive in here, you have to be able to tie back to corporate messaging, document stores, calendars and databases. Shhhs, we can't even programmatically edit a notecard in here. But hey, back to the typewriters!

----

A dating service, eh?
I'd say 73% of SL is already a dating service without the commitment of RL identities.

Oh, and for real corporations operating in here, you'd need the RL user directory. But I doubt those companies would like their employees to mix too much of their "desires" into the equation.

Well said Francesca. Facebook, Myspace, I avoid them like the plague. SL is a creative environment, full of creative folks.

Don't water it down LL, don't present it as something it is not and was never meant to be. As a content creator and builder in SL, the last thing I want is to be hounded by LOLcat, leet-speaking, a/s/l hornball blingtards dropping in on me while I'm exploring or building and trying to 'do t3h s3x' with me.

As far as dating? Yes, I've met someone special in SL, yes we're taking it to the next level. But we did it by making a connection first, then *choosing* to share our RL identities with each other. We didn't need to have our RL broadcasted to do that. If there is truely a connection to be made, let it be done naturally. Do you walk around in RL with your age, location, interests, phone #, etc hovering over your head? No. Don't bring a bunch of desperate date-seekers into my creative outlet. Doing so will drive away the creators. Then what would the daters do? SL currently is unique. Try to compete with the existing trend sites and it'll vanish in the mediocratic blur. Stick with what you have and improve it: Stable viewers, smoother simcrossings (I got logged out tonight just walking into another sim!), stable windlight, and maybe even megasims or some of the other ideas being presented by SL-like applications.

Clearly I'm in the minority here. If implimented properly, this might be a good thing. There's plenty of room on the grid for more users. So many places are empty after all.

If everyone is given the option to opt-in/out, then this may not have much of an affect on those who want nothing to do with it. But, if it does generate an influx of paying users, it could potentially speed up bug-fixing productivity and added bells and whistles.

Then again, I'm not entirely secretive with my personal information, either. If I wanted to be, I just wouldn't fill out my personal information, though.

1. they've never implemented anything properly yet
2. the influx in 2006/7 actually slowed down bug fixing as they were more focussed on managing the uptime and putting in shinies. Nothing has changed.
3. you won't have any choice re the personal info I suspect. Where you may have a choice is in what is displayed - but then again their past performance on delivering things that work as originally promised is pretty non existent.

I say bring on the shallow end of the internet genepool. they'll want to shop, dance and bump pixels. It can only be good for the economy and as long as I don't have to talk to them.

I'm in your camp, but, and it's a big but, it must be a choice for people. That's where the fears come from, people who don't want to be involved being railroaded in.

I feel they're going for a more social networking angle because it's the only way of fixing their group limit limitations. Group limits do hamper the social networking angle here.

working in adult off SL, we have been moving to dating sites in a big way for a long time out of neccesity. They are gold if done right.
Now... SL as a dating site just doesnt sit right. BUT if it (LL) was commited to such a line of action as a dating site it would be very very interseting if set up correctly.

I mean... you could have 50 islands for 50 states (if you live in the states) and to find others like you, you would simply find your state sim or providence and go hang out in a plaza. Then once youve met someone, you go epxlore sl togeher (spend cash) then maybe do some pixel sex to see if your brains are compatible, and finally meat and greet.

Done right it would be a big hit. done wrong and it will make sl a ghost town.
From a content creators point of view its a win situation. I mean frankly. Its fresh meat to sell to, most older avs dont really purchase a lot anyways unless its a fashion item or so Im betting. Your sales are in NEW people. And your new dater is going to want to LOOK good. Got to think positive here.

From my perspective, I've been in and out of SL since 2006.

I always create a new account and cancel it when my little excursion is over.

Many people find this behaviour odd, if not suspect. My interest however is, for the most part, professional and this approach helps a little to ensure I experience the nuts and bolts of SL through a fresh pair of eyes every time.

My visits are normally prompted by a new PR or news item, so it may be only a matter of weeks between visits or in one instance over a year.

This dubious behaviour has allowed me to take an objective(ish) view of SL's evolution over the past few years.

My perspective, as someone with no emotional investment in the environment, is that LL has squandered the early promise of SL.

I'll admit that I might be considered a "suit". I accept that I look at SL through the eyes of a business traveller rather than someone who is on a voyage of self discovery.

What originally drew me to SL however, and what keeps me coming back, is the hope that SL might be the first steps in the development of a new paradigm for business, economics, society.. yes I'll say it.. humanity even.

All I find increasingly is a place where the same old behaviours and values are replicated and reinforced but at a price we can all afford.

Worse though is the tacit acceptance, not of our best and most inspiring traits, but of our lowest.

"Be all you can be" at first read seems to be an invitation to reach above ourselves, to aspire and be inspired, however with every visit it seems more accurately to be an invitation to wallow in the mire of every sordid little activity which might flit darkly across our imaginations.

I'm certainly not someone in a position to take the moral highground on anything, and I can see that, for people constrained by circumstance, SL does provide an environment to explore who they are and find some level of fulfillment.

Unfortunately, for many people, the fulfillment they seek seems to revolve around the less attractive human traits and vices.

I apologise for the diatribe, but to be honest, I think LL know where their little experiment is going and have decided to take advantage of the niche market/demographic they have, rather than aim for one they repeatedly fail to attract.

I therefore expect to find LL marketing many new ways for people to cheat, lie, and pander under the nice warm blanket of anonymity.

All at an affordable price, but one which keeps the revenue flowing for LL nevertheless.

Bit of a shame really.

If LL do introduce a FaceBook-type thingie, then it should maybe replace Profiles and Groups.

It could be useful for a parcel to have a 'facebook'.
The current About Land data fields are totally inadequate for describing the aims and activites of a parcels in detail.
Perhaps a parcel could use a 'group facebook' for that.

Whatever comes along, I want to be able to feed a load of customised crap into the Real Life section.
If I want anyone to know about my RL, I'll tell them.

Here again is the picture from the RL tab of my Profile:


I know people who's Profile RL photo, age and personal circumstances have changed over time. I don't believe anything in there.
I prefer to concentrate on what people are doing in SL and how they behave towards other people. If I like a person's mind, then I don't care where they are from or what they are.

While I can understand your frustration with LL's performance over the years, you are quite right on an economic standpoint. Especially since all of those shallow, worthless people that you have no time for, are the exact demograph for your business.

Them dirty, unimaginative folks do like their kink, after all. With all do respect, I'd think twice before biting the hand that feeds, though.

SL is already full of shallow people who don't create in this environment. I, for one, am said person. While I'm not here for any kink or pixel bumping, I sure do socialize a little and shop a lot!

While many, many people use SL as a creative outlet, many others use it to purchase those creations.

This perception that worth is determined by shop owner vs. customer is dangerous ground.

I think it would work if it were separated....completely....you would have a tough time "selling" the concept to the current dating site participants who want REAL....or as close as you can get....kind of difficult on the Internet as a whole, anyway...no matter how you do it.

It would have to be a separate continent....major task....as you can see the immersionists are not going to like mingling with these people at all.....and the people who want RL simulated are not going to be happy about running across an immersionist, and falling in love with someone who is playing around for kicks. Oh wait.....that already happens.

But if you look at the numbers using the dating sites, and you've got a tool like SL that adds another dimension....the virtual dating setting, with your persona walking about and mingling....with pleasing visual settings and props.....you would be a FOOL not to mix the two and take advantage of it. I'm surprised it has not been attempted yet, by one of the larger sites....or at least some kind of collaboration in the works.

As for your businesses, and concerning the "separation".....you could simply have a separate store like you would on Zindra. Go take a look at the numbers using misMatch and eHarm, and you will get a little giddy about the potential.

These people are spending a fair amount of money on the match service...a fair amount of money on the meetings....and a fair amount of money on plane tickets.....not to mention a fair amount of TIME on it.

Let's not confuse "shallow" with "selective."

In the end, I don't think it'll change the dynamics of SL. You'll still get the immersionists and those looking for "realistic" aspects from this new venue. I can't imagine that dating sites have managed to weed out those who pretend vs. those who don't.

Put me on this bus as well. I'm emphatically not here to date, but the one thing that has cropped up time and time again is that what gets someone to STAY in SL is friends. New users must be able to find a friend or two ASAP. Humans are a very social species and we always tend to gravitate towards other people because that has meant survival.

I would imagine that participation in this dating thing will be voluntary, as will revealing RL age, gender and location. I wouldn't be at all surprised if profiles in the future can link directly to Facebook or Twitter if the user chooses.

You are correct. The dating sites have not managed to weed those out.....it's impossible. All the more reason that SL is not a bad idea for it. A good portion of the SL population is already using it for that purpose, specifically.

But probably 95% of the dating site people do not have a clue that SL exists, and could add another dimension.

My previous diatribe aside, I'm wondering exactly how a "dating" function would work within the current SL culture.

As far as I'm aware, the mainstream dating sites have the aim of bringing people together with a view to initiating RL relationships.

Most SL relationships are sought out and developed with the understanding that "What happens in SL, stays in SL".

Are we talking about an RL dating agency where RL details will almost certainly become available within SL (either directly or indirectly), or are we simply talking about a more efficient method of finding a new cybersex buddy?

Given the current culture within SL, I guess the latter.