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New blog post on LL's Content Management Roadmap

Ryanna Enfield
Registered User
Join date: 26 Dec 2005
Posts: 225
08-04-2009 22:49
From: Anti Antonelli
You may remember, we already had sort of the inverse situation and it was badly botched.

A person was allegedly distributing stolen animations in a device also containing copies of the open-source MLP script package (at least one of which had been copy/pasted to a fresh script, thereby showing the person in question as the creator). Being open-source, those particular scripts spread virally just as copies of the original have done, and made their way into the hands of legitimate content creators and their customers. Linden Lab's response to the IP theft was to remove from their servers all related stuff that showed this person as creator, and managed to break lots and lots of perfectly legal MLP devices as a particular script showed up missing when these devices were started, or restarted, or rezzed.

So yeah I'm not terribly confident in future error-proofness.


This situation seems like the test case for LL's proposed content management. Items that were restored never worked properly again. Broken content might just remain broken permanently.
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Dain Shan
Registered User
Join date: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 32
08-05-2009 00:16
I skimmed over the blog regarding the content seller programm.

Im somewhat terrified at the first moment.
The rules they try to implement for this are, in my eyes, a bit far off and i have to agree with the concerns about the treshhold and good standing part.

Althought i never had a suspension i know about 2 cases where a false AR lead to a suspension. All that because the the ARed Person was not able to understand what was going on ( language problem). Both are content creators and accordingly to the plan it seems that they will be left out from the programm.

I also have a very small shop that i share with a scripter, we both sell very specialised products and are in the progress to expand buiseness as we see there is a demand.
But then im very concerned about the so called teshhold you have to pass to be part of the programm. It seems that this may be able to stop us right in our tracks.

Somehow ... and thats my Impression it nearly looks like as the established Content Creators might have found a way to finally stop newcommers and eleminate them from the general market. Also i think cause its in their best interest to get this rule on the way, we might see only a few leftovers after the impact.

Im really start to think that investing into SL was a bad desicion.
TundraFire Nightfire
Permafrostbilly
Join date: 5 Apr 2008
Posts: 532
08-05-2009 00:45
I wonder if this will open up the way for LL to charge fees on what we are selling inworld much like XStreet does on that website?
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Brieanne Bomazi
Don't forget the *E*
Join date: 29 Jan 2005
Posts: 383
08-05-2009 01:06
From: Lyla Tunwarm
The real Greenlife Emerald viewer isn't capable of ripping content (I am using it right now and the options to rip are not there). Only hacked versions of it can. That also goes for hacked version of the standard SL viewer and hacked versions of ANY viewer.


QTF! I use Emerald also... and its got great features.. and no, i can't seem to find the copy code either. Another witch hunt for alternate viewers. I suppose They should ban the RLV also, since the Master/Mistresses can block im's to their subs? Get a grip. The people that take the time to write alternate viewers more often then not end up making that patches that fix the screwed up regular viewers. They fix issues that normally take forever.... were you around for the shoes/hair in the ASS on every tp you made? A patch was made in the Nich viewers thats now mainstream code. You should be GRATEFUL that people are making alternate viewers to make life easier, and fix the bugs that LL is too busy doing other things *read Adult content shifts & now the content management* to work on real issues.. TP's, disappearing avatars, LAG, failed border crossings... the list goes on and on. When the code gets updated for those things, You can normally thank alternate source viewer coders for fixing the worst of it.

This is the SECOND time i have seen someone call for a ban of alternate viewers, with out ever stopping to see why they REALLY are popular... great customer support being a #1 reason. Try Imming someone from LL cause their viewer has an issue. See how fast you get a response... then try Imming LGG about Emerald.. fixed, announced, updated, normally in 24 hours or less.

I'm just sayin :)

~Brie
Marianne McCann
Feted Inner Child
Join date: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 7,145
08-05-2009 01:23
From: Imnotgoing Sideways
Item 3 scares the poop out of me. (>_<;)

Does this mean, since my little store of doll keys and glasses barely turns L$400 a month, I will be operating in the same class of content creation as copybot running thieves? (T_T)


I'm not *yet* scared -- but I too would love to know just what this threshold is. I don't sell a whole lot of stuff (My big content creation work is paid for outside of SL, using US$). The toy store and the plant stand are most definitely cottage businesses. While I make a bit more than Immy does, it's still not a huuuuge amount. So would I be out of this loop, too?
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Conifer Dada
Hiya m'dooks!
Join date: 6 Oct 2006
Posts: 3,716
08-05-2009 01:33
From: someone
I wonder if this will open up the way for LL to charge fees on what we are selling inworld much like XStreet does on that website?
I could live with that, it would be a legitimate way for LL to raise income, as long as the 'sales tax' is low and it is only collected when items actually sell.
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LordGregGreg Back
Code
Join date: 9 Mar 2008
Posts: 16
08-05-2009 02:14
From: Angela Talamasca
What I find to be rather appalling however is that LordGregGreg brazenly announced he would be incorporating that copybot code in the next Greenlife Emerald viewer.

Don't you get it Linden Lab? These people are thumbing their nose at you.

I'm convinced you see the world in a twisted reality. Perhaps its fear that drives you there, perhaps its popularity, im not sure, but let me set things straight here.Let me set things straight here.

We are NOT (duh) thumbing our nose at linden labs, we work COOPERATIVELY with them, that is the entire idea about this being OPEN SOURCE.

We implemented it (a while ago) with a permission check in it, to help guide people on how it should be used.Content Backup code has been available before the viewer even went open source, and its features are a necessity for many builders. This is why we put it in greenlife, for goodness sakes.


We also put in incompatability with other object exports, to help keep greenlife away from this whole mess.


Why keep content backup code only to people who abuse it? This lets legit users benifit from the good code that it is.

And if you noticed, the blog post by LL mentions the legitimate uses of such patch. As i mentioned before, you need to be focusing your yelling and hate at the people who steal items, not people who try to help.

((why is it so hard to make a good viewer these days?))
LordGregGreg Back
Code
Join date: 9 Mar 2008
Posts: 16
08-05-2009 02:17
to help people who are just skimming

NO EMERALD DOES NOT HAVE COPYBOT IN IT

it lets you export full permission items. that is all.
Couldbe Yue
one unhappy customer
Join date: 30 Mar 2008
Posts: 1,532
08-05-2009 02:40
From: LordGregGreg Back
to help people who are just skimming

NO EMERALD DOES NOT HAVE COPYBOT IN IT

it lets you export full permission items. that is all.


and import or is that the preserve of SI?
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LordGregGreg Back
Code
Join date: 9 Mar 2008
Posts: 16
08-05-2009 02:44
Import has no permission checks. This is partially because we are unable to set the permissions we have when we import (it will always be full perm).
Only full perm items are exported, so anyone who imports it, will also have it full perm. One feature of this, is that it makes it easy for me to deliver my work to my boss, another alt, or another grid.
Couldbe Yue
one unhappy customer
Join date: 30 Mar 2008
Posts: 1,532
08-05-2009 02:56
From: LordGregGreg Back
Import has no permission checks. This is partially because we are unable to set the permissions we have when we import (it will always be full perm).
Only full perm items are exported, so anyone who imports it, will also have it full perm. One feature of this, is that it makes it easy for me to deliver my work to my boss, another alt, or another grid.



That's what I was interested in. It means I can fire up an alt, build in peace and quiet and then when finished move it over to couldbe to set up for sale. At the moment I have to make everything full perm by hand then move it (don't trust bulk perms in 1.23), then reset and test the settings and it doesn't always have couldbe's name as the creator if I've not used her created prims. Time consuming to the point of horrible.

ok I'm sold. Where's the download link and the page on how to do this - I need to start to get to grips with this marvel of technology :)
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LordGregGreg Back
Code
Join date: 9 Mar 2008
Posts: 16
08-05-2009 03:00
From: Couldbe Yue
That's what I was interested in. It means I can fire up an alt, build in peace and quiet and then when finished move it over to couldbe to set up for sale. At the moment I have to make everything full perm by hand then move it (don't trust bulk perms in 1.23), then reset and test the settings and it doesn't always have couldbe's name as the creator if I've not used her created prims. Time consuming to the point of horrible.

ok I'm sold. Where's the download link and the page on how to do this - I need to start to get to grips with this marvel of technology :)

We also made our importer be incompatible with known xml formats of illigal viewers that do not have perm checks, just to help keep Greenlife out of that mess. But yes, there is lots of potential here, eventually (and it has already been done in a fashon before) you will be able to export your build, import it in a maya environment (where the tools may be more to your liking) and them import it back in.

http://tr.im/EmeraldDL
Nuno McCullough
PixelDolls' wholesaler
Join date: 28 Dec 2007
Posts: 275
08-05-2009 03:01
After reading the huge post from LL (for non English speakers too huge to understand everything that implies) I found myself not knowing what will be my future, I have a reseller from PixelDolls and a shop with cloth created by one of my alts – in both businesses I receive items full perm to sell (from PixelDolls and from my alt)… so now what? I need to apply to continue selling? Need to send any kind of form, or the form online is only to DMCA? I need to reveal my sales to LL? What are the next steps? And no, although I have those two businesses I don’t do much
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Couldbe Yue
one unhappy customer
Join date: 30 Mar 2008
Posts: 1,532
08-05-2009 03:07
From: LordGregGreg Back
We also made our importer be incompatible with known xml formats of illigal viewers that do not have perm checks, just to help keep Greenlife out of that mess. But yes, there is lots of potential here, eventually (and it has already been done in a fashon before) you will be able to export your build, import it in a maya environment (where the tools may be more to your liking) and them import it back in.

http://tr.im/EmeraldDL



That would almost make it worth buying and learning maya :) I like building in SL but the ability to clean it up to maya standards would be a godsend.
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Nina Stepford
was lied to by LL
Join date: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 3,373
08-05-2009 03:17
anymore... i just dont care.
ll already know what they will force upon us, and any talk of 'resident input' is the same old pony show.
i suspect they are trying to emulate the bluemars system, but 6 years too late.
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Deira Llanfair
Deira to rhyme with Myra
Join date: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 2,315
08-05-2009 03:23
From: LordGregGreg Back
Import has no permission checks. This is partially because we are unable to set the permissions we have when we import (it will always be full perm).
Only full perm items are exported, so anyone who imports it, will also have it full perm. One feature of this, is that it makes it easy for me to deliver my work to my boss, another alt, or another grid.



Is the original creator's name kept after import?
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LordGregGreg Back
Code
Join date: 9 Mar 2008
Posts: 16
08-05-2009 03:41
From: Deira Llanfair
Is the original creator's name kept after import?

Nope, there is really no way for us to set a creator name in the LL protocol. Not to mention that this puts a funny looking twist on sim to sim exporting.. so we just let the creator decide what they want to do.
Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
08-05-2009 04:22
From: Briana Dawson
Well...After Argent's post, i will admit i am a little worried. And ~everywhere~ i go, i see Emerald users.
After my post? About what? :eek:
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
08-05-2009 04:24
From: SuezanneC Baskerville
I wonder how error proof the code that deletes things from inventory will be.
The demonstrated that when they disabled half the sex beds in SL by mistake, and left it up to the creators to fix them.
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
08-05-2009 04:28
From: Lyla Tunwarm

But seriously the viewer isn't the issue, it is the ability to hack a viewer to be able to rip content that is the problem.
There's no way to eliminate that ability, even by eliminating the open source viewer. People rip and cheat on all the big MMOs even though they run rootkits on your computer to try and block you.
From: someone
The only thing I can think of that may really help is server side rendering and using a web browser for the UI. That way the the content is all rendered on LL servers (or whoever they contract with) and not by your computer where it is intercepted. http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/07/09/otoy-developing-server-side-3d-rendering-technology/
The increase in bandwidth requirements and server cost that would be required for even a minimal quality version of this make it laughable.
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
08-05-2009 04:32
From: Nina Stepford

i suspect they are trying to emulate the bluemars system, but 6 years too late.
If they want to emulate Blue Mars, they're nuts. Blue Mars is made of FUD.
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Katiri Hynes
Registered User
Join date: 15 Sep 2008
Posts: 3
08-05-2009 04:57
I'm very excited to read LL is finally going to start removing all copies of the infringing goods. I am a bit curious about what will happen when valve submits a DMCA for all of their halflife textures. Seems like 1/4 of the grid will become "missing texture" but this is a good thing I suppose.

Right now though a copybotter has nothing to lose except whatever item they botted. Anyone who they give it to gets a free lunch. I really applaud LL for taking this stance. I'm sure the added user tickets from people wondering where their knockoff skins and clothing went will be worth it though in retaining some of the great content creators who were very disappointed with the old system.

Any sort of timeline or roadmap on when these things will be implimented?
Jesse Barnett
500,000 scoville units
Join date: 21 May 2006
Posts: 4,160
08-05-2009 05:07
From: Katiri Hynes
Any sort of timeline or roadmap on when these things will be implimented?

Sometime after the forum is upgraded/replaced. Seriously, I am not saying this in jest. Linden Labs is great at posturing but now we have come to see that this is all most of their BS is. There is absolutely no logical reason that they were not removing stolen content before.

And speaking of the forum. Blue sure seemed kind of haughty when he announced that he was in charge of replacing the forum and we gave some feedback to the effect of "Show us, Don't tell us". Has anybody heard anything else from him lately?
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From: someone
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Skell Dagger
Smitten
Join date: 26 Jun 2007
Posts: 1,885
08-05-2009 05:24
From: Katiri Hynes
I am a bit curious about what will happen when valve submits a DMCA for all of their halflife textures. Seems like 1/4 of the grid will become "missing texture" but this is a good thing I suppose.
I can tell you what will probably happen. Many of the smaller creators who bought textures in good faith from the large stores that sell them as their own creations will probably go out of business, as the items *they* have created will become "missing texture" and they will be bombarded with complaints from unhappy customers.

To those of us that are small content creators, unsurprisingly, this is NOT "a good thing".
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
08-05-2009 05:25
From: Skell Dagger

To those of us that are small content creators, unsurprisingly, this is NOT "a good thing".
Where in this grand roadmap do you see an indication that LL cares about the small content creators? :(
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