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My freebies are being sold without permission.

Ordinal Malaprop
really very ordinary
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,607
11-28-2005 16:19
One doesn't steal it. One breaches copyright and usage agreements. Regardless of the RIAA et al, the two are not at all the same thing.

But breaching those can certainly be bad.
Surreal Farber
Cat Herder
Join date: 5 Feb 2004
Posts: 2,059
11-28-2005 16:20
From: Kevn Klein
"Judge not, lest ye be judged" --- Jesus Christ ;)


"Thou shalt not steal" --- Jesus's Dad :D







couldn't resist.....
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Surreal

Phobos 3d Design - putting the hot in psychotic since 2004

Come see our whole line of clothing, animations and accessories in Chaos (37, 198, 43)
Mulch Ennui
15 Minutes are Over
Join date: 22 May 2005
Posts: 2,607
11-28-2005 16:21
How dare you accuse someone of stealing?
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I have of late--but wherefore I know not--lost all my mirth, that this goodly frame, the earth, seems to me a sterile promontory, this most excellent canopy, the air, look you, this brave o'erhanging firmament, this majestical roof fretted with golden fire, why, it appears no other thing to me than a foul and pestilent congregation of vapours.

http://forums.secondcitizen.com/
Debeenz Pavlova
Yes... but not with you
Join date: 1 Sep 2005
Posts: 88
11-28-2005 16:25
what saddens me about the whole reselling freebies issue is that people are now wary about making freebies, or putting out anything with full perms.

In the end it's the noobs who suffer... won't someone think of the noobs!!

illegal, not illegal, whatever. It is just plain wrong and just reading this thread leaves me with a little icky feeling... call me a socialist or whatever, there are other ways of earning your lindens than by taking other people's goodwill and contributions to the community and using them for your own gain. Call me a socialist or a communist I really don't give two craps.

Oh and I am borderline retarded at building and scripting but have made what may be one of SL's first turtles... his name is Benny, he's sitting on my lawn and I'm about to set him on full perms, if I see him for sale in anyone's store I will be very cross. (I'll also be very amused as benny is a crappily made little guy)

Peace out.
Juro Kothari
Like a dog on a bone
Join date: 4 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,418
11-28-2005 16:29
From: Kevn Klein
How does one steal a freebie?

You don't. It's free - as the original creator intended it to be.

What is getting people in a huff is when someone takes a freebie, makes little/no improvement (and no, changing the color, IMHO is not an improvement worth $100) and selling them.

It makes it worse when the person then turns around and says "I'm not reselling freebies" or some other nonsense.
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Jamie Bergman
SL's Largest Distributor
Join date: 17 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,752
11-28-2005 16:31
From: Fred Extraordinaire
you stole my old noobie nuke from when i first came to second-life, people can buy the real one on SLE and in the spacemonkey shop in jessie. as for the one you've been selling since before 1.3 you can keep it, it's highly outdated and the lindens have ignored my pvp reports against you, as they ignored winters reports when her bullet showed up in your shop weeks before she HAD to make it public domain, due to your bulk selling of her technology. so, lets lookat how your second-life add's up shall we? you dont spend hours making the creations you sell, you reap benefits from extortion and petty theivery .. so the question is...why are you still here?


Lies. All Lies. You Communist.

You're part of the offensive... story breaking at http://sleconomyblog.blogspot.com/
Fred Extraordinaire
Weapons Specialist
Join date: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 134
11-28-2005 16:32



thats the funniest thing i've seen today :D thanks for the laugh
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<3 LL :D
Kevn Klein
God is Love!
Join date: 5 Nov 2004
Posts: 3,422
11-28-2005 16:33
From: Weedy Herbst
Try copying music from the radio and selling it. How long do you think it would take the RIAA to file paper on you?


Firstly, because one, or several creators, want their creations to be given out free doesn't logically conclude all freebie creators want to control the after sale market of their freebies. The new owner has all rights contained in the permissions of the object. I'm sure LL will soon offer the extra permission to allow only free to copy. That should end the issue, allowing the creator to be specific.

Secondly, creators do gain from the exposure of their products. Some creators would prefer setting out a few high quality items with "resell" marked to allow a faster spreading of the product. If it can't be sold, very few people will waste the prim to make it avaliable to the very newbies the creators want to help. It would be nice if there could be a way to set a maximum future price, say $1L or $50L, whatever the creator wants to set.

When we make something public domain, we are saying take it, it's free to use as you see fit.
Jamie Bergman
SL's Largest Distributor
Join date: 17 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,752
11-28-2005 16:34
From: Weedy Herbst

Be grateful you didn't steal anything I created, because I would not think twice about having you sued.


OMG... too funny. I love empty threats.
Mulch Ennui
15 Minutes are Over
Join date: 22 May 2005
Posts: 2,607
11-28-2005 16:36
From: Fred Extraordinaire
thats the funniest thing i've seen today :D thanks for the laugh


i've purchased VERY GOOD weapons from you, Simmy and Varick. I did it all for you guys =)
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I have of late--but wherefore I know not--lost all my mirth, that this goodly frame, the earth, seems to me a sterile promontory, this most excellent canopy, the air, look you, this brave o'erhanging firmament, this majestical roof fretted with golden fire, why, it appears no other thing to me than a foul and pestilent congregation of vapours.

http://forums.secondcitizen.com/
Mulch Ennui
15 Minutes are Over
Join date: 22 May 2005
Posts: 2,607
11-28-2005 16:36
From: Jamie Bergman
OMG... too funny. I love empty threats.


almost as funny as empty heads...

*whistles*
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I have of late--but wherefore I know not--lost all my mirth, that this goodly frame, the earth, seems to me a sterile promontory, this most excellent canopy, the air, look you, this brave o'erhanging firmament, this majestical roof fretted with golden fire, why, it appears no other thing to me than a foul and pestilent congregation of vapours.

http://forums.secondcitizen.com/
Jamie Bergman
SL's Largest Distributor
Join date: 17 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,752
11-28-2005 16:38
From: Mulch Ennui
almost as funny as empty heads...

*whistles*


You guys are so much fun!! Thats why I love this place :D
Fred Extraordinaire
Weapons Specialist
Join date: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 134
Ignorant evil
11-28-2005 16:41
sadly my nuke was not a free product at the time it showed up at jamie's shop, i must ask you jamie, is capitalism truly about stealing and selling things you dont have the knowledge to make yourself? is communism about us hardworking people wanting you to stop taking credit for our work? these are pollitical terms and have no comparison to the bussiness fraud you have been pulling since you came here. pack up your alts and go away...
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<3 LL :D
Juro Kothari
Like a dog on a bone
Join date: 4 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,418
11-28-2005 16:42
From: Kevn Klein

When we make something public domain, we are saying take it, it's free to use as you see fit.

Oh yes! So complete morons with NO talent and huge egos can change the color using the oh-so complex color picker and slap a $100 price on the items and post it for sale?

LL needs to fix this by adding some form of a permission that keeps the item free for life, if the creator so wishes.
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Jamie Bergman
SL's Largest Distributor
Join date: 17 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,752
11-28-2005 16:43
From: Fred Extraordinaire
sadly my nuke was not a free product at the time it showed up at jamie's shop, i must ask you jamie, is capitalism truly about stealing and selling things you dont have the knowledge to make yourself? is communism about us hardworking people wanting you to stop taking credit for our work? these are pollitical terms and have no comparison to the bussiness fraud you have been pulling since you came here. pack up your alts and go away...


Now you are going way over the line, sir. I am no fraud, I am no politician, and I certainly am no thief.

Why people are trying to kick me out of SL for modifying items that exist in the public domain is beyond me.

Do you really think I went around and "stole" everything I put in my shop? Please.
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
11-28-2005 16:44
It's copyright theft.

I don't see anywhere in the TOS that the permission system supercedes our IP rights.
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Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
Juro Kothari
Like a dog on a bone
Join date: 4 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,418
11-28-2005 16:46
From: Jamie Bergman

Do you really think I went around and "stole" everything I put in my shop? Please.

I don't think you stole them. You can't steal 'free' items. I think you lack ethics, but that's just my opinion.
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Fred Extraordinaire
Weapons Specialist
Join date: 29 Jun 2004
Posts: 134
11-28-2005 16:48
that was just my reaction to your 'blog' where you consider us all communists for attempting to protect our further work from showing up at your shop...stolen or not a lot of things that shouldnt be there are, in fact, there.
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<3 LL :D
Weedy Herbst
Too many parameters
Join date: 5 Aug 2004
Posts: 2,255
11-28-2005 16:49
From: Jamie Bergman
OMG... too funny. I love empty threats.


It's no bullshit. I have a Seattle attorney with standing in the 9th Circuit and in the United States Appellate Court, which incidentally is located in San Francisco.

I can show you a thing or two about law.
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blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
11-28-2005 16:50
From: Juro Kothari
I don't think you stole them. You can't steal 'free' items. I think you lack ethics, but that's just my opinion.


You absolutely can steal free items.

There's lots of content that's free all over the web, but to republish it would be IP theft.
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
Numa Herbst
SHI-SHAAA!!
Join date: 13 Jun 2005
Posts: 99
11-28-2005 16:51
From: Jamie Bergman
You're hilarious :D I like you.


Thanks! If you thought that reversal of logic was a hoot, get a load of this! It's old and not nearly creative as Much's stuff (he's the MAN!), but it's a perennial favorite.
Juro Kothari
Like a dog on a bone
Join date: 4 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,418
11-28-2005 16:52
From: blaze Spinnaker
You absolutely can steal free items.

There's lots of content that's free all over the web, but to republish it would be IP theft.

Yes, blaze, you're correct - but I was referring to stealing of freebies within SL.
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DogSpot Boxer
vortex thruster
Join date: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 671
11-28-2005 16:52
Heed the word of SL's Top Economic Mind!!!!

So let it be written, so let it be done!


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Dogspot Boxer
Charter Member Of The Socially Inept Club

Our Motto:

We may be inept, but at least we're social
Mulch Ennui
15 Minutes are Over
Join date: 22 May 2005
Posts: 2,607
11-28-2005 16:54
From: Numa Herbst
Thanks! If you thought that reversal of logic was a hoot, get a load of this! It's old and not nearly creative as Much's stuff (he's the MAN!), but it's a perennial favorite.


aww ur making me blush

its the result of too many drugs in my youth, too much free time, and not enough in world talent =(

really, I should be pittied

your pic r0xx0rs
_____________________
I have of late--but wherefore I know not--lost all my mirth, that this goodly frame, the earth, seems to me a sterile promontory, this most excellent canopy, the air, look you, this brave o'erhanging firmament, this majestical roof fretted with golden fire, why, it appears no other thing to me than a foul and pestilent congregation of vapours.

http://forums.secondcitizen.com/
blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
11-28-2005 16:55
From: Juro Kothari

Yes, blaze, you're correct - but I was referring to stealing of freebies within SL.


So, if I uploaded a copyright image and set it to sale for free, then anyone can go an resell it?

I don't think so...
_____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :

"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches."
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