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What should your content creators do next?

Cristiano Midnight
Evil Snapshot Baron
Join date: 17 May 2003
Posts: 8,616
10-06-2005 10:37
From: Aimee Weber
I think Chip and I approach SL business (and I suspect RL business) the same way. I don't see a future resting on my laurals, but rather anticipating and adapting to the changing playing field.

It's good we comb through the TOS so we know exactly where we stand when we make our business decisions. If some people are scared off from opening a business in SL for fear Linden Lab will actually wontonly perform some of the worst case scenarios that the TOS technically allows them ... well more cake for Chip and I :D But not all my eggs are in the *PREEN* basket so if something bombs that wing of the Aimee empire I feel comfortable knowing I can just focus on the next great thing.


You have very nice laurels.
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Ricky Zamboni
Private citizen
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,080
10-06-2005 10:38
From: Chip Midnight
Well ya know... LL has supplied everyone with a default skin since the day SL opened for alpha testing. I found it lacking and made something better. I was the first to turn it into a business and made a small fortune at it. Other people upon seeing how it took off followed suit and now there are dozens of skin makers. Some of them copied my business model. Some of them came up with innovative new ones. Some of those ideas I've adopted myself. I don't see competition from LL as being any different from competition from other content creators. It's a given and I welcome it.

At some point, whenever LL gets around to updating avatar and appearance features you can bet they they will make better default skins that may very well borrow ideas from me and other skinners, or offer to buy from one or more skinners. More power to them. When that happens and I see what the drawbacks of then new skins are I'll make new products to address the new market. I don't have any allusions about the life expectancy of any product or service I might offer. I do it for the challenge first, the fun second, and the profit last.

So then, it wouldn't bother you if each of your skin uploads went directly into the public library as well as your own inventory in real-time? That may be the absurd limit of the life expectancy of your product, and LL competing with your content creation business, but can you think of a reason why it wouldn't happen if it became advantageous for LL from a business point of view? As has been pointed out in this thread, the TOS explicitly allows such a thing.
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Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 10:44
From: Ricky Zamboni
So then, it wouldn't bother you if each of your skin uploads went directly into the public library as well as your own inventory in real-time? That may be the absurd limit of the life expectancy of your product, and LL competing with your content creation business, but can you think of a reason why it wouldn't happen if it became advantageous for LL from a business point of view? As has been pointed out in this thread, the TOS explicitly allows such a thing.


Let's jump the gun and prevent another 40 pages of horse beating, and follow this to its logical conclusion.

Assuming we all think that Linden Labs will stop at nothing to make a buck, it is therefore extremely likely that LLab can, will, and shall at any time merely max out our credit cards and take our life savings. Because they're bastards.

QED.

LF
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Enabran Templar
Capitalist Pig
Join date: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 4,506
10-06-2005 10:46
From: Lordfly Digeridoo
Assuming we all think that Linden Labs will stop at nothing to make a buck, it is therefore extremely likely that LLab can, will, and shall at any time merely max out our credit cards and take our life savings. Because they're bastards.

QED.


You left out the part where they sell our contact information and other identity info for hundreds of thousands of dollars to spammers and fraudsters.
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From: Hiro Pendragon
Furthermore, as Second Life goes to the Metaverse, and this becomes an open platform, Linden Lab risks lawsuit in court and [attachment culling] will, I repeat WILL be reverse in court.


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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
10-06-2005 11:00
From: Ricky Zamboni
So then, it wouldn't bother you if each of your skin uploads went directly into the public library as well as your own inventory in real-time? That may be the absurd limit of the life expectancy of your product, and LL competing with your content creation business, but can you think of a reason why it wouldn't happen if it became advantageous for LL from a business point of view? As has been pointed out in this thread, the TOS explicitly allows such a thing.


That's not what they did to you, Ricky. They didn't take your code. They took your idea. When LL makes new skins they will undoubtedly be very similar to mine... because they're both skins(!). "Hey, knees were my idea!" How many ways are there to make an exchange? They're all rather similar. GOM had the best features. LL's exchange isn't as good and I'd still use GOM if you kept it going. If they had outright stolen from you rather than just borrowed ideas wouldn't their exchange be the same as yours and just as rich in features? It's not. Lots of other skinners do things the same way I do. Did they steal my ideas? Did they come up with them on their own for the same reasons I did? Did they evaluate the market to see what was working and follow suit? I'm sure it's all of the above. None of it is theft. Once you put an idea out there, it's out there and bound to influence people who follow. LL may very well be one of those "people." Should they not add new features if a resident thought of it first? People are already complaining that the pace of development and new features is too slow.
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Ricky Zamboni
Private citizen
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,080
10-06-2005 11:07
From: Lordfly Digeridoo
Let's jump the gun and prevent another 40 pages of horse beating, and follow this to its logical conclusion.

Assuming we all think that Linden Labs will stop at nothing to make a buck, it is therefore extremely likely that LLab can, will, and shall at any time merely max out our credit cards and take our life savings. Because they're bastards.

QED.

LF

Let's not throw out red herrings here.

Arbitrarily maxing out your credit card is not permitted by their TOS (although it has happened :eek: ). Arbitrarily expropriating your content, however, *is*. The question remains -- is that something you're prepared to come to terms with if it should happen? Can you think of a reason why it wouldn't happen if it became advantageous for LL from a business point of view?
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Aimee Weber
The one on the right
Join date: 30 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,286
10-06-2005 11:38
*slaps Cris' hand away from my "laurals"*

I understand the CYA purposes behind the aforementioned changes in the TOS. I also see the potential harm Linden Lab could do should it become profitable to screw us over in the name of profit. So the question every prosective business owner needs to ask themselves is:

"Can we trust Linden Lab, an established company that has been around for 5 years, and has 60,000 customers?"

We make these kinds of decisions all the time, for example:

"Should I trust my money with a couple of guys from the internet that seem to be making emotional business decisions?"
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Cienna Samiam
Bah.
Join date: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,316
10-06-2005 11:38
From: Ricky Zamboni
Let's not throw out red herrings here.

Arbitrarily maxing out your credit card is not permitted by their TOS (although it has happened :eek: ). Arbitrarily expropriating your content, however, *is*. The question remains -- is that something you're prepared to come to terms with if it should happen? Can you think of a reason why it wouldn't happen if it became advantageous for LL from a business point of view?


Forget about it. I think it is pretty clear that no one groks the loss of leverage they have suffered as a result of this ToS change. Nor will they until something happens to them and they discover in personal ways what that ToS means.

Aside to Ms. Troll -- the glaring error in the ToS at the moment being that I don't have to click through it to post here. So like, um, *cough* backatcha. :)
Cienna Samiam
Bah.
Join date: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,316
10-06-2005 11:47
From: Aimee Weber
*slaps Cris' hand away from my "laurals"*

I understand the CYA purposes behind the aforementioned changes in the TOS. I also see the potential harm Linden Lab could do should it become profitable to screw us over in the name of profit. So the question every prosective business owner needs to ask themselves is:

"Can we trust Linden Lab, an established company that has been around for 5 years, and has 60,000 customers?"

We make these kinds of decisions all the time, for example:

"Should I trust my money with a couple of guys from the internet that seem to be making emotional business decisions?"


The question for me was:

Can I trust a company who has repeatedly lost items, money, and entire sims worth of effort and never actually restored it or the value of it to the affected customer?

and

Can I trust a company who says they want to give me the support and care about the things that concern me, but when it comes down to it, are more concerned with covering their ass than making sure mine is comfortable?

So far, the answer is a simple 'no'.
Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 11:48
From: Ricky Zamboni
Arbitrarily expropriating your content, however, *is*. The question remains -- is that something you're prepared to come to terms with if it should happen? Can you think of a reason why it wouldn't happen if it became advantageous for LL from a business point of view?


This would be true if they copied and pasted your website into secondlife.com. But, they didn't. They took the idea.

Should REAL currency exchangers be yelling at you? After all, the very idea of currency exchange is nothing new. It's an idea, after all. And you seem to be claiming ownership on an idea.

You should also be yelling at Sony, who is using an "exchange" system for Everquest. Didn't you used to deal with EQ stuff? Did you talk to Sony? Did they offer you any sort of compensation?

If Linden Labs took all of my prefabs and said "hey, Lordfly, we're going to be using your prefabs for First Land plots", first I'd say "cool", and then I would do what any other business person would do: continue innovating. Why? Because the prefabs all over the place is free fucking advertising, with my name on it. Obviously it's a quality product, so obviously I get good buzz over it. Ergo, I profit.

You see what LLab has; it's nothign compared to what GOM was. You could have continued competing. But you didn't, you folded up like a house of cards, which is exactly WHY the Lindens wanted to get a currency exchange (which is vitally important to the SL economy) under their roof in the first place. Had you folded earlier (say during one of the several unfortunate fraud incidents), the economy would have gone batshit loony.

Furthermore, you two have seemed to have hinted that you weren't making money on this endeavor anyways in the last few months. So it's a hobby that the host company took under their wing, because it's important to them, letting you guys pursue other endeavors. What's the problem?

They didn't steal anything from you. They looked at your idea and modified it for their own uses, AFTER you didn't want to play ball with them.
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Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 11:51
From: Cienna Samiam
Forget about it. I think it is pretty clear that no one groks the loss of leverage they have suffered as a result of this ToS change. Nor will they until something happens to them and they discover in personal ways what that ToS means.


What leverage am I losing? If the Lindens take my prefab homes and scatter them all over First Land plots, I'd be doing one of two things:

1) Gloating over how a professional company is using my product for their own uses,

and

2) Advertising the Jesus out of it, getting more business for myself and enriching my college fund in the process.

If the US Government comes up to you and says "hey, we need to make a highway overpass. Eminent domain, bizatches. here's your check", you have to make lemonade of the situation. That is, move somewhere else and consider it a chance to start over.

From: someone

Aside to Ms. Troll -- the glaring error in the ToS at the moment being that I don't have to click through it to post here. So like, um, *cough* backatcha. :)


So you're just going to sit on these forums and steam about a community you no longer want to participate in? Why? It's like yelling about the mistreatment of residents by a homeowner's association, except you're doing it across the street and behind the fence.

I'm going to quote Enabran's sig, because it's very appropriate for this situation:

"A businessman doesn't make excuses, he makes a profit".

LF
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Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 11:54
Furthermore, let's even go the next step and say that the Lindens tell Ben and Ryan to make prefabs to put on First Land plots, instead of using my homes (i mean, "stealing" them).

What do I do then?

Uh, ensure my homes are better than theirs and continue selling them, obviously. Premium housing is better than "free, public" housing any day, in most people's minds.

No matter how you look at this situation, LLAb really did nothing wrong.

LF
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LordJason Kiesler
imperfection inventor.
Join date: 30 May 2004
Posts: 215
10-06-2005 11:54
Again..
(just to get back on track, you know, the reason(s) for this thread)

1. LL has a new exchange service, if it was right or wrong.
LL has made it a point to add a lot of information about there exchange service to there TOS.
LL has made NO effort to add any gurentees about there exchange service to the TOS.
We are left with "By even using this service you agree that you can not hold us accountable for anything, even if we lose $9999.00 of youe money on our service"

2. There is no and has been no return value on llGiveMoney,
This is eather complete lazyness and disregard for there customers, (or) intended as a roadblock.

3. Where are the fruts from the $3,000,000 investment?

4. if targeting new residents, and making it easier for them is the goal then why are people under 45 days old restricted to..
"purchasing no more than US$20 worth of L$ per day and US$40 worth of L$ per month"
Thats a pretty damn tight restriction even if it is because the system is new.

5. They couldnt keep scripts safe, Whats to stop someone from sending false information to an unsuspecting persons viewer (if they ever actually put the exchange system IN the viewer)?

6. And lastly "if they wanted to" they could take anything that you have created and get away with doing with it as they please, and you have given them permission to do so.

Where are our rights? What should we do next?
Aimee Weber
The one on the right
Join date: 30 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,286
10-06-2005 11:55
From: Cienna Samiam
The question for me was:

Can I trust a company who has repeatedly lost items, money, and entire sims worth of effort and never actually restored it or the value of it to the affected customer?

and

Can I trust a company who says they want to give me the support and care about the things that concern me, but when it comes down to it, are more concerned with covering their ass than making sure mine is comfortable?

So far, the answer is a simple 'no'.


Fair enough. For me the answer is yes so *PREEN* will go on. I'm ready to swallow the losses if my risk comes crashing down on me.

But if I'm successful (or Chip, or Cris is successful) what I dread will be the inevitable jeers that will come from those who decided Linden Lab was too untrusthworthy for them to risk a business. They will never say "she took a chance and it paid off while I sat on the sidelines"
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
10-06-2005 11:56
From: LordJason Kiesler
Where are our rights? What should we do next?


Make stuff.
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Dnate Mars
Lost
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,309
10-06-2005 12:00
From: Lordfly Digeridoo
This would be true if they copied and pasted your website into secondlife.com. But, they didn't. They took the idea.

Should REAL currency exchangers be yelling at you? After all, the very idea of currency exchange is nothing new. It's an idea, after all. And you seem to be claiming ownership on an idea.

You should also be yelling at Sony, who is using an "exchange" system for Everquest. Didn't you used to deal with EQ stuff? Did you talk to Sony? Did they offer you any sort of compensation?

If Linden Labs took all of my prefabs and said "hey, Lordfly, we're going to be using your prefabs for First Land plots", first I'd say "cool", and then I would do what any other business person would do: continue innovating. Why? Because the prefabs all over the place is free fucking advertising, with my name on it. Obviously it's a quality product, so obviously I get good buzz over it. Ergo, I profit.

You see what LLab has; it's nothign compared to what GOM was. You could have continued competing. But you didn't, you folded up like a house of cards, which is exactly WHY the Lindens wanted to get a currency exchange (which is vitally important to the SL economy) under their roof in the first place. Had you folded earlier (say during one of the several unfortunate fraud incidents), the economy would have gone batshit loony.

Furthermore, you two have seemed to have hinted that you weren't making money on this endeavor anyways in the last few months. So it's a hobby that the host company took under their wing, because it's important to them, letting you guys pursue other endeavors. What's the problem?

They didn't steal anything from you. They looked at your idea and modified it for their own uses, AFTER you didn't want to play ball with them.

This is not about GOM, never has. Just because Ricky is posting, everyone just jumps in and assumes he is directly talking about GOM. Just leave GOM out of it, and lets talk about what it does say. LL can, accourding to the TOS, take what they want from you when then want. It seems to me that it would fly in the face of the IP rights they say you have, but then I am not a lawyer. Would LL do it is a different topic all together, but the fact remains, they can legally do it.

I do trust LL, that is why I am still here, it does make me uneasy, but I hope it is just lawyer talk for cover all your bases. It is up to the player to deside what he or she should or should not do. It is really not my place to question other and the choses they make.
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From: Cristiano Midnight
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Ricky Zamboni
Private citizen
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,080
10-06-2005 12:00
From: Lordfly Digeridoo
Furthermore, let's even go the next step and say that the Lindens tell Ben and Ryan to make prefabs to put on First Land plots, instead of using my homes (i mean, "stealing" them).

What do I do then?

Uh, ensure my homes are better than theirs and continue selling them, obviously. Premium housing is better than "free, public" housing any day, in most people's minds.

No matter how you look at this situation, LLAb really did nothing wrong.

LF

I think you're kind of missing the point. This thread isn't about what did or didn't happen between GOM and LL (and, for the record, I personally feel that taking this as an opportunity to concentrate our efforts on the trading platform will allow us to re-launch with a much stronger service). This is about how the clauses in the TOS explicitly allow LL to expropriate your content for their own purposes.

Sure, you can innovate to ensure your homes are better than theirs. And, if they so desire, the second you do all the first land homes include your latest upgrades. The TOS allows them to do that. I'm not talking about Ben and Ryan making versions of your prefabs. I mean prim-for-prim, texture-for-texture copies. That's what you agreed to when you clicked through the license.
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Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 12:03
From: LordJason Kiesler
Again..
(just to get back on track, you know, the reason(s) for this thread)

1. LL has a new exchange service, if it was right or wrong.
LL has made it a point to add a lot of information about there exchange service to there TOS.

From: someone

LL has made NO effort to add any gurentees about there exchange service to the TOS.
We are left with "By even using this service you agree that you can not hold us accountable for anything, even if we lose $9999.00 of youe money on our service"


So you can't sue them. IF you don't agree, don't use their currency exchange. GOM was the same way, as is Anshe Chung, as is IGE. It's a risk. It's business.


From: someone

2. There is no and has been no return value on llGiveMoney,
This is eather complete lazyness and disregard for there customers, (or) intended as a roadblock.


Conspiracy theories aside it's probably several thousand lines of spaghetti code that Cory/Phoenix/Andrew haven't had the time to go through.

From: someone

3. Where are the fruts from the $3,000,000 investment?


I dunno, version 1.7, version 2.0 R&D, more developers, bug fixes, more sims?

From: someone

4. if targeting new residents, and making it easier for them is the goal then why are people under 45 days old restricted to..
"purchasing no more than US$20 worth of L$ per day and US$40 worth of L$ per month"
Thats a pretty damn tight restriction even if it is because the system is new.


So they don't get hit with chargebacks from stolen credit cards? Will you front the risk to let people buy thousands of dollars worth of Linden dollars, even if you've never met them, have no history with them, and have no idea of their background information? Again, GOM did the same thing; limits on new people.

From: someone

5. They couldnt keep scripts safe, Whats to stop someone from sending false information to an unsuspecting persons viewer (if they ever actually put the exchange system IN the viewer)?


Nothing. THat's why it's a risk. That's why they have safeguards in the system. That's why they have these clauses in the ToS so angry customers can't start pelting them with lawsuits every ten minutes.

Which would you rather have, litigation or SL development? Your choice.

From: someone

6. And lastly "if they wanted to" they could take anything that you have created and get away with doing with it as they please, and you have given them permission to do so.

Where are our rights? What should we do next?


As a consumer, you always, always, ALWAYS have the following rights:

1) Agreeing to a ToS and continuing to use the service,

or

2) Not agreeing and not connecting to the service.

You're on private property, and thus have no rights except that which the business gives you.

Yes, they can take your shit for no reason. So can any other company on the face of the earth. Visa can ruin your credit history at the push of a button. The US government can wipe your social security number off the face of the earth. You can become an un-person in 30 seconds flat.

And yet, daily, billions of business deals go on.

If you don't agree with LLab's "new" ToS, feel free to not connect and develop a new, shiny service that is better than SL in every conceivable way. Except don't you dare ever put any sort of legal safeguard in your ToS, because that'd be evil.

EVIL!

LF
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
10-06-2005 12:07
From: LordJason Kiesler
4. if targeting new residents, and making it easier for them is the goal then why are people under 45 days old restricted to..
"purchasing no more than US$20 worth of L$ per day and US$40 worth of L$ per month"
Thats a pretty damn tight restriction even if it is because the system is new.


Maybe to throw a bone to the 3rd party exchanges? Cut down on chargebacks? Keep uncle Jim from gambling away his electric lung fund? Nothing is perfect, nor will SL ever be. It will never live up to everyone's individual expectations. Their decisions will never be viewed universally as the right thing to do. You can choose to look at everything in the worst possible light as supporting evidence for dire predictions and conspiracy theories, or you can take it as it comes, constantly evaluating the shifting landscape, and position yourself accordingly. You can view the TOS as the opening salvo in LL's demonic posession, or you can view it as a sensible way for a small company to prevent its entire user base from suing them out of existence should an earthquake or fire destroy the asset server. Honestly I will never understand the desire people seem to have to always imagine the worst case scenario and act as if it's fact. If and when I feel that SL is no longer a viable place to be for whatever reason, I'll find somewhere else to be. I won't act as if LL betrayed me by not molding SL to my exact specifications to facilitate my edification.
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Dnate Mars
Lost
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,309
10-06-2005 12:08
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

Yes, they can take your shit for no reason. So can any other company on the face of the earth. Visa can ruin your credit history at the push of a button.

Can you show me where in the CA with Visa they are legally allowed to do this? And the part that says you can't sue them for their mistakes?
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From: Cristiano Midnight
This forum is weird.
Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 12:08
From: Ricky Zamboni

Sure, you can innovate to ensure your homes are better than theirs. And, if they so desire, the second you do all the first land homes include your latest upgrades. The TOS allows them to do that. I'm not talking about Ben and Ryan making versions of your prefabs. I mean prim-for-prim, texture-for-texture copies. That's what you agreed to when you clicked through the license.


I also agree to let them charge my credit card. If i trust them with that, then I also trust them not to abuse this "newfound" power.

This is really standard legal boilerplate, folks. We're going around in circles.

1)I say it's not a big deal.

2) Three people say "BUT IT SAYS IT RIGHT HERE SEEEEEEEEEE (insert quote of ToS)"

GOTO first statement.

And round and round we go.

Bottom line is, if you don't trust Llab, don't use their service. Nice seeing you. :)

And feel free to drop me your stuff too, since you won't be using it anymore.

LF
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Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
10-06-2005 12:10
From: Dnate Mars
Can you show me where in the CA with Visa they are legally allowed to do this? And the part that says you can't sue them for their mistakes?


Visa is a multi-national company that has more assets than you can possibly even imagine. They can VERY easily ruin your credit, accidentally or not, and sweep the process/records under the rug. Legal or not, they can do it, and most likely will get away with it. They have more lawyers than you, more money than you, and are more powerful than you.

But we're digressing. Let's go round and round about the ToS again.
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Dnate Mars
Lost
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
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10-06-2005 12:19
From: Lordfly Digeridoo
Visa is a multi-national company that has more assets than you can possibly even imagine. They can VERY easily ruin your credit, accidentally or not, and sweep the process/records under the rug. Legal or not, they can do it, and most likely will get away with it. They have more lawyers than you, more money than you, and are more powerful than you.

But we're digressing. Let's go round and round about the ToS again.

AH! But the TOS here says that they can do this legally. There is a HUGE differance between being able to sweep it under the rug, and being able to point and laugh at you.

I would not be so sure about your last statement....
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From: Cristiano Midnight
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LordJason Kiesler
imperfection inventor.
Join date: 30 May 2004
Posts: 215
10-06-2005 12:21
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

Conspiracy theories aside it's probably several thousand lines of spaghetti code that Cory/Phoenix/Andrew haven't had the time to go through.

Havnt had time for that, Havnt had time for llName2Key, havnt had time for a Linux client, havnt had time for physics upgrade,
BUT they have had time for Chat bubbles!

From: Lordfly Digeridoo

I dunno, version 1.7, version 2.0 R&D, more developers, bug fixes, more sims?

I have not preformed a true gauging of this but,
It appears that Bug fixing, "Development", etc is going no faster now than it did before. But hey we do have more sims, Great lets just keep adding sims at such a quick rate, that maybe they will all work together to become selfe aware and Write there own Physics code.
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

Nothing. THat's why it's a risk. That's why they have safeguards in the system. That's why they have these clauses in the ToS so angry customers can't start pelting them with lawsuits every ten minutes.

Fine, so where is the other side?
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

As a consumer, you always, always, ALWAYS have the following rights:

1) Agreeing to a ToS and continuing to use the service,

or

2) Not agreeing and not connecting to the service.

You're on private property, and thus have no rights except that which the business gives you.

And If the business wants customers it is usually good to give them some.
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

Yes, they can take your shit for no reason. So can any other company on the face of the earth. Visa can ruin your credit history at the push of a button. The US government can wipe your social security number off the face of the earth. You can become an un-person in 30 seconds flat.

And yet, daily, billions of business deals go on.

So that makes it right? Your saying we should not hold LL to a higher standard?
But In the real world I can still sue if visa ruins my credit history for an unjust cause.
From: Lordfly Digeridoo

If you don't agree with LLab's "new" ToS, feel free to not connect and develop a new, shiny service that is better than SL in every conceivable way. Except don't you dare ever put any sort of legal safeguard in your ToS, because that'd be evil.

EVIL!

LF


Please lets not just add unneccasary sarcasm to this,
but the same thing goes the other way, If this is not an issue for you then dont bother posting here. This thread is for people who consider this an issue.
Dnate Mars
Lost
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,309
10-06-2005 12:25
From: LordJason Kiesler

I have not preformed a true gauging of this but,
It appears that Bug fixing, "Development", etc is going no faster now than it did before. But hey we do have more sims, Great lets just keep adding sims at such a quick rate, that maybe they will all work together to become selfe aware and Write there own Physics code.

Think of the time savings in the long run!
_____________________
Visit my website: www.dnatemars.com
From: Cristiano Midnight
This forum is weird.
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