Government Comes to SL

Not to worry, Ace. I don't actually hold an elected position within the government.

~Ulrika~

Old thread, so I picked an old post to respond to!



Hey, they're having fun, leave them alone.

Gotta spend your time doing something in SL, right?

I think it's pretty neat, I'm not sure it's a good idea functionally/practically and so on, but as long as the group avoids pissing everyone off and doesn't act high and mighty it could be fun. I guess it could work if all the participants are voluntary.

Dictator Ulrika???

hehe

As long as this government is only effective on private sims, I have no problem with government. If it ever starts getting shoved in my face and someone attempts to force thier government on the rest of us, then I would have to take a stand against it.

Ulirka, I am to lazy to read through any of these long long threads so I will admit, any opinion I give will be uneducated. I only know I am against people trying to dictate any part of my second life to me. It's been stated to me that this governement is not about that at all.

Please clearify, what exactly do you govern besides the rights to use your land? WHat are the benefits of adding such a complicated dimension to SL?

I'm with Beau on this. I actually agree with Hiro too but I'm cool with this being in the General Forum.

If a group wants to form a little student council type "government" that makes them feel good and keeps them occupied then great. But living in the dictatorship that we do, it really would be a futile endeavor to take this beyond what is more or less going to be a virtual homeowners association.

Normally, I try to avoid replying to resurrected threads but you asked so nicely.

In order to understand what we're doing, I first have to discuss governments and organizations. From there I'll show you where our project fits in, how it's different, and hopefully answer a lot of unasked questions in the process.

In SL there already is a formal government. It's a corporatist oligarchy (government by the few whose members are selected and ordered in a corporate fashion). From the definition of a government it, of course, has the power to make and enforce laws in our territory (SL). The laws are described in a legal document (ToS) and enforced by controlling access to property (temporary and permanent banning). (Note that LL is not a dictatorship as we often hear in the forums. A dictatorship is a type of autocracy, which is government by a single person.)

Within this government citizens form organizations to achieve goals that an individual cannot and the Lindens will not. These organizations usually become members of the SL two-tier group system yet take many forms, such as corporations (authoritarian hierarchies), cooperatives (a group of equals), councils (a small group of elites), mobs, and so on. The purpose of these organizations can be to make money (corporations), explore shared interests (skydivers), supplement the existing LL government (themed builds), and so on.

As you can see, complexity already exists in SL. What makes us different is that we are trying to implement this complexity in a different place. Instead of supplementing the existing LL government as an organization (themed build), we want to replace it with a better government that we can take part in (democracy). In order to do this, we have to become a true government, an entity that has the power to make and enforce laws in our territory. How do we do it? The same way LL does -- by controlling access to property. This is the difference between playing a government and being a government.

Beyond the fundamental goal of creating a better government within SL, it is also an enjoyable process to engage in. We have all learned much about government, law, and politics and the sociology, mathematics, and philosophy behind it. We've been able to inject our own ideologies into the project (democracy, flat tier fees, covenants), to see if they work as well in reality as imagined. So far so good.


As an aside, it's interesting to note that the project has evolved considerably. It started as an organization with many different forms:

1. Organization -- two project leads: Kendra Bancroft and Ulrika Zugzwang.
   
2. Organization -- A provisional trial government: Talen Morgan, Pendari Lorentz, Kendra, and Ulrika.
   
3. Quasigovernment -- A government with a constitution and three ruling bodies but without land-bound citizens. (This is what we have now.)
   
4. Government -- A true government with land-owning citizens (Phase II).
   

Within 4 to 6 weeks we will begin the second phase of our governmental project. We will move to a private sim and sell land deeds with covenants. The covenants (legal agreements attached to deeds) will be used to define citizenship and bind users to the land. Between the covenants and laws passed by the government, we will implement a government in the same fashion that LL does but will be controlled by us.

If you're interested in Phase II of the project, stay tuned (or send me an email).

~Ulrika~

hitches up a tractor to a dead horse in the barn, dragging it outside, grasping a stick and commencing to beat it

Heh, I'm sorry Toy but I couldn't resist in light of recent verbal altercations.

Unless you own the servers and the entire infrastructure behind your private sim, all you are doing is playing at being a government. In the end Linden Lab still owns all the capital.



The essence of democratic government is the sovereignty of the majority's will... that is to say trading one master for another.

As it stands now, LL allows us to be 'sovereign' over the territory we have contracted for our use (land we 'own'). Player-run government is simply another layer placed between that contract with LL and us. LL would have to be fools to turn over their entire product to the tyranny of the masses (democracy).

Go ahead and play at government in your own sim all you want. The minute player-run government gets extended beyond the borders of the project and imposed upon others is the minute SL is no longer a place for people that care about their own freedom.

Thanks, but no thanks.

-Ghoti

Right. We are the kingdom of us on our own land, be that individual or with a group. I have been saying this all along. Group governments theming sims is nothing new, despite the attempts to tout it as such. It's just another group with some land, which is why I do not fear it in the least. All the shiny drafts and slogans are just bells and whistles. Gibson, Kissling, Tabor, Luskwood, Darklife, Slate, etc, all have had or do have group run zoning and government. They did it without all the illustrious grandstanding and overcomplicated writs, and most importantly, without trying to convince everyone else that they were right, and knew what the future of SL requires to survive.

This horse has not only been beaten to death, the barn has been burned down, the ground it was on trampled, and sunk into the ocean.

Can we get a Linden to close this tired-overcooked thread and put us all out of our misery?


- Newfie

"What government is the best? That which teaches us to govern ourselves."

It's a good quote... here's a few more:

"The impersonal hand of government can never replace the helping hand of a neighbor." ~ Hubert H. Humphrey (1911-197

"The best view of government is in the rearview mirror as you're driving away from it." ~ Ronald Reagan (1911-2004)

About the chances of player-run government actually working for very long:

"Trying to make things work in government is sometimes like trying to sew a button on a custard pie." ~ Hyman Rickover (1900-1986)

And one of my favorites:

"Anarchy may not be the best form of government, but it's better than no government at all." ~ unknown

-Ghoti

[edited for spelling]

<blows dust off this thread and looks closer>

I think this thread needs to be locked. The information is no longer relevant.

And if you'd like more info on the current status of this project, there is an entire forum about it here:

/103/1.html

<quietly puts thread back into its shoebox and places a nice pile of leaves over it>

If you'd like to discuss Government in SL, please visit this new thread on the topic:

/120/92/40412/1.html