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Apple's Price Beats Dell and Hand-Assembled Computers

Fmeh Tagore
Just another fat guy
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 670
08-17-2006 12:02
From: Reitsuki Kojima
Not entierly. Even in a situation where the individual software is not optimized, two cores still has some advantages.

Now, dual-processors (As opposed to dual-cores), that's something else.

I didn't say it didn't have some advantages, just not games.
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:03
From: Dillon Morenz
Yes, sort of. SLI works by intelligently scaling geometry and fill rate performance for two GPUs. 3DMark typically reports a 1.9x GPU performance increase when you link a second SLI card to the first. SLI technology requires a PCI Express motherboard with two x16 physical connectors. Not being too familiar with Mac hardware, I don't know what that means for you.
I wonder if SLI would work when running in WinXP on Apple hardware. Hmm. I don't see why not.

~Ulrika~
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:04
From: Reitsuki Kojima
Except the "the hardware is affordable" bit.
Please see the parent post. It shows a one-for-one comparison with an Apple, Dell, and hand-assembled computer.

~Ulrika~
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Fmeh Tagore
Just another fat guy
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 670
08-17-2006 12:04
From: Nyoko Salome
"i saved a lotta money... but ended up with an effin' PC";)

"whuzwrong wit datt?? they are great for gammezzz"

"yeah, but i need to -work- on the damn thing... keeps locking up. and i've spent 6k alone this year for 'house-call' consultants..."

well, that's about half of the clients i've had, dealing with home PC networks... while the other half never noticed i was able to manage all the company macs by myself while doing my 'real' job at the same time...

"toys" ... toys are simple to understand and play with.
"expensive toys" ... work right under a variety of circumstances without calling in outside 'ms-certified consultants'... :)

If you spent $6000 on house call consultants, you need to learn how to use a computer. Maybe you -should- just stick with a mac where you don't have to know anything about computers.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
08-17-2006 12:05
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
I wonder if SLI would work when running in WinXP on Apple hardware. Hmm. I don't see why not.

~Ulrika~


The mobo is important in SLI.
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I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Fmeh Tagore
Just another fat guy
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 670
08-17-2006 12:06
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
Please see the parent post. It shows a one-for-one comparison with an Apple, Dell, and hand-assembled computer.

~Ulrika~

Stop repeating yourself! You've said this over and over again like a religious person using circular logic.

Let's go over this again: People can't afford $2,400. Period! Get it through your thick skull! Apple does not make a low end tower!

EDIT: Sorry for my rudeness, but you are REALLY starting to piss me off with your circular logic over and over again.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
08-17-2006 12:06
From: Fmeh Tagore
I didn't say it didn't have some advantages, just not games.


Even in games, from my understanding (I don't have mine just yet) - offloading other system tasks to the other core.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:08
From: Reitsuki Kojima
The mobo is important in SLI.
It uses an Intel chipset. I'll look into this and see if I can find anything out.

~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
Equino Faulkland
SLI + SL = Orgy in my eye
Join date: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 100
08-17-2006 12:11
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
I wonder if SLI would work when running in WinXP on Apple hardware. Hmm. I don't see why not.

~Ulrika~


welp my laptop came with it. :) oh its PC.
Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
08-17-2006 12:11
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
Please see the parent post. It shows a one-for-one comparison with an Apple, Dell, and hand-assembled computer.

~Ulrika~


I thought you were interested in the logic behind owning a system, not in random statistics. Your comparison is fine - but flawed. Dual Xeon processors? Nobody uses dual Xeon processors in the home market. It's stupid. The artical you linked even basicly says as much. Ditch those and the overpriced mobo they slot into, get a a C2D Conroe, buy yourself some real ram, and a videocard that isn't last years asswipings, you'll have a much better desktop system and half the price.

What you're doing is showing that one brand of dump-truck is cheaper than the other - when dump-trucks aren't required in the first place.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
08-17-2006 12:12
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
It uses an Intel chipset. I'll look into this and see if I can find anything out.

~Ulrika~


It's not the chipset, or the maker - nVidia mobo chipsets are the bees knees, if we're talking about chipsets. It just depends on how the motherboard is made - and I've never seen "Mac" and "SLI" in the same sentance, so I'm thinking no, they don't, but I could be wrong.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:13
From: Fmeh Tagore
Stop repeating yourself! You've said this over and over again like a religious person using circular logic.
I don't think you understand what circular logic is. Hint: it has nothing to do with repetition. :D

From: someone
Let's go over this again: People can't afford $2,400. Period! Get it through your thick skull! Apple does not make a low end tower!
Your statement is false. Hundreds of thousands of people (like me) can afford that price. In fact, Apple shipped approximately 600,000 G5 PowerMacs in 2005. Dell probably shipped 6,000,000 in that price range. Exactly who here has the thick skull? :D

~Ulrika~
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:14
From: Equino Faulkland
welp my laptop came with it. :) oh its PC.
How does a laptop come with SLI when it requires multiple video cards? Also, new Apples are PCs. They run WinXP now. :D

~Ulrika~
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Fmeh Tagore
Just another fat guy
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 670
08-17-2006 12:15
From: Reitsuki Kojima
I thought you were interested in the logic behind owning a system, not in random statistics. Your comparison is fine - but flawed. Xeon processors? Nobody uses Xeon processors in the home market. It's stupid. The artical you linked even basicly says as much. Ditch those and the overpriced mobo they slot into, buy yourself some real ram, and a videocard that isn't last years asswipings, you'll have a much better desktop system and half the price.

What you're doing is showing that one brand of dump-truck is cheaper than the other - when dump-trucks aren't required in the first place.


Thank you for wording it with some more tact than I have left. Religious mac people seem to be saying that same message over and over again, and they seem to forget what it is that people besides themselves get computers for. I've completely run out of patience for people who say, "compare this expensive computer with this expensive computer--see, this one's less expensive" and they say it over and over and over and over again as if people didn't hear it the first 20 times.
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Fmeh Tagore
Just another fat guy
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 670
08-17-2006 12:16
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
I don't think you understand what circular logic is. Hint: it has nothing to do with repetition. :D

Your statement is false. Hundreds of thousands of people (like me) can afford that price. In fact, Apple shipped approximately 600,000 G5 PowerMacs in 2005. Dell probably shipped 6,000,000 in that price range. Exactly who here has the thick skull? :D

~Ulrika~

Circular logic is going back to the same argument over and over again even though it didn't prove anything the first time. It's like someone going back to, "Because the bible says so" argument over and over again. There's a hole in the bucket dear Liza.

That's fine, you can afford it, you're rich and can dump 2k on something without blinking an eye. People like me and millions of others cannot.
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Equino Faulkland
SLI + SL = Orgy in my eye
Join date: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 100
08-17-2006 12:18
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
How does a laptop come with SLI when it requires multiple video cards? Also, new Apples are PCs. They run WinXP now. :D

~Ulrika~

yup. my laptop has two video cards. two Geforce 7900GTX's. :)
Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
08-17-2006 12:19
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
How does a laptop come with SLI when it requires multiple video cards? Also, new Apples are PCs. They run WinXP now. :D

~Ulrika~


There's no conceptual reason why a laptop can't have two video cards. I can show you a laptop with paired 512 meg video cards in SLI quite easily.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:22
From: Reitsuki Kojima
I thought you were interested in the logic behind owning a system, not in random statistics.
I'm not interested in the "logic" and the link in the parent post provides no statistics, let alone those which are random. It's simply a straight-forward comparison of cost as compared to a G5, Dell, and hand-assembled computer with equivalent parts. :shrug:

From: someone
Dual Xeon processors? Nobody uses dual Xeon processors in the home market. It's stupid. The artical you linked even basicly says as much. Ditch those ...
We could ditch and replace but then we wouldn't be comparing the same systems, which is the point of the article and this thread, now isn't it? :D

From: someone
What you're doing is showing that one brand of dump-truck is cheaper than the other - when dump-trucks aren't required in the first place.
You're making an error stating that this computer isn't required. Instead you should be stating that it isn't required for you. Given that there are at least 2 million workstation-class machines of all brands moved in the U.S. alone for home and professional use, I would say that they are very much "required". Mine arrives in two weeks. *augh*

~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
Equino Faulkland
SLI + SL = Orgy in my eye
Join date: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 100
08-17-2006 12:22
sure they're owned by dell now but... have any of Mac guys been to the wonderful world of alienware.com, or how about Voodoo? and of course theres always Falcon...
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:23
From: Equino Faulkland
yup. my laptop has two video cards. two Geforce 7900GTX's. :)
Freaky! Please post a link so I can check out the website where they're sold. I'm very interested in this. :)

~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:24
From: Reitsuki Kojima
There's no conceptual reason why a laptop can't have two video cards. I can show you a laptop with paired 512 meg video cards in SLI quite easily.
Link please! I didn't know such technology existed. I have a friend who would be very interested in this. :)

~Ulrika~
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Chik-chik-chika-ahh
Equino Faulkland
SLI + SL = Orgy in my eye
Join date: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 100
08-17-2006 12:25
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
Link please! I didn't know such technology existed. I have a friend who would be very interested in this. :)

~Ulrika~

www.alienware.com www.voodoopc.com
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:25
From: Equino Faulkland
sure they're owned by dell now but... have any of Mac guys been to the wonderful world of alienware.com, or how about Voodoo? and of course theres always Falcon...
I've seen a little bit. Their hardware is too white trash for me. I'm just not turned on by tricked out cases. I prefer something professional and elegant.

~Ulrika~
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
08-17-2006 12:26
From: Equino Faulkland
How about a link to the laptop, lazybones? :D

~Ulrika~
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
08-17-2006 12:27
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
I'm not interested in the "logic" and the link in the parent post provides no statistics, let alone those which are random. It's simply a straight-forward comparison of cost as compared to a G5, Dell, and hand-assembled computer with equivalent parts. :shrug:


Actually, it's ALL statistics. Part specs and prices. No data whatsoever.

If you're not interested in logic, what's the point? Price comparisons with no logic behind them are stupid. "This land is cheaper than this land!" "What do you need the land for?" "Doesn't matter! This land is cheaper!".

From: Ulrika Zugzwang
We could ditch and replace but then we wouldn't be comparing the same systems, which is the point of the article and this thread, now isn't it? :D


It is the point of the artical, and in doing so the artical looses any point whatsoever. I thought you cared about intelectual debate, however, Ulrika, so I assumed you actually cared about, you know, logic n stuff.

From: Ulrika Zugzwang
You're making an error stating that this computer isn't required. Instead you should be stating that it isn't required for you. Given that there are at least 2 million workstation-class machines of all brands moved in the U.S. alone for home and professional use, I would say that they are very much "required". Mine arrives in two weeks. *augh*


And if you *need* a workstation-class computer, knock yourself out. The vast majority of the computer market does NOT, however, including no doubt a ton of people who buy that system anyhow because it's what Mac is willing to sell them.

Like I said before - if you need a dumptruck, go ahead and buy that dumptruck. But don't start a thread about how dumptruck brand X is better than Y in a forum about offroading, which is what you just did.
_____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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