why are guns so hated?

First of all, what does that have to do with Second Life? This is a global community, your permit isn't even allowed in all your states. And it is certainly not allowed where I live. You might keep in mind that who ever you meet is not necessarily a American with liberal laws and attitudes about guns.

Second, Untill very recent land owners couldn't restrict the push effect of weapons, and i think that is the most hated effect of guns. Some pushed you a couple of sims, griefers literally shot the customers away. So there is reason for the hate. And even with the push restriction, shooting people is still a disturbance and would make people leave.

Third, their land, their rules.

That's valid and in the end up to each land owner/manager to decide. My partners and I decided to put the needs and feelings of our members before those of the people who may or may not become members. If they spread the word and it keeps others away so be it.

But we're not completely unfair. It's not as if I'm ejecting any person who lands with a weapon in hand right off the bat. I'm just being diligent. The person would be asked to put it away and if they refused THEN they'd be ejected. Honestly, I've found it's very rare for anyone to refuse and if someone does, I see that as a sign they may cause other problems.

To be fair of course our club sim is completely non commercial so we don't lose or gain any profit. For those who do, they may decide differently.

Then again, on the shopping sim I have the same rule, no weapons of any kind out in the open. Yet I have at least one vendor selling weapons. Would I ban some guy because he buys something from that vendor and pulls it out to look at it? No of course not. If he decided to test fire it in the mall, he would be asked to stop. If he continued THEN he would be banned.

Bane its like this for the most part people in the clubs are gun shy, most of us have been shot at in a club for no reason other than because they want to be total asses. I also work as security in a club and the rules say no guns because of prior grieing. Yet almost on a daily basis we have to tell somebody to remove the gun. If it was left to me I dont normally worry about the lone gun toteing person, I know with out a doubt if I really wanted to grief a place I would do something besides shoot the place up. And for the most part the griefers we have to deal with dont actually shoot anybody most of them just drop there particle attacks or dry hump people nekkied. Since the new push restrictions we have had one attempt to grief the club with orbit cages but it didnt work.

If you was to show up at the club with your holster on i might engage in a minor convo to get you talking and if you do I can normally judge what your intention are. If you totally ignore me and continue to wonder around the club then be prepared to have at the least 4 people Im you requesting you remove the guns. When they hire new people to learn the ropes I always suggest going to some of the gun makers shops and learning about the various guns in sl, also to learn about the various combat systems, that IMO are more of a threat than a gun. Because I can wonder into any club with my orbiter on and nobody will no the difference!

I wish we could go back and fix some of the things the griefers have done to cause this sense of insecurity but we cant. I dont judge a person because they have a gun/weapon on. I let them judge themselves by their response to me or any of the staff at the club. I have asked people to remove something simple as a multigadget and seen them get so upset that they leave!

I would like people to realize that freaking out over a gun and banning somebody for not removing there guns, when in most cases the people in charge arent payin attention to the fact it is just a holster not a actual gun in the persons hand. And at any given time there is atleast (5) five people wearing some sort of orbitor weapon that unless you are looking at there computer screen you wont know its there. I also wear a weapon on my AV that you will never see, not its not a gun, yet with it I can send you across the sim in no time flat(if push is on). I have been in so many clubs with this on and nobody has ever even attempted to tell me to remove it.

I understand the point of not wanting to be shot but with the current no push restrictions available guns right now are pretty much worthless. I see more grief from hoochie hair and genitals shouting how horny and aroused they are.(hoochie hair applies to both men and women) and anything that uses particle can be considered grief yet we dont yell at joeblow for all ninety of his bling attachments along with his shouting genitas.

So why are guns hated? because immature kids/adults feel the need to shoot at people in this world like they are playing a FPS.

But I think the better question is why do you hate guns but dont mind the lag created by all 900 active scripts with a listen channel lagging out the your client rendering rate!?

All valid points, and I agree too that the SL guns make people nervous. And furthermore, if an owner asks you to remove something, ya probably should.

Personally, I entered a club once and the owner asked me to remove my multigadget...
I left and never came back.

Well the multigadget does have a weapon in it.

Do you know why you was asked to remove the multigadget?..........



The three open listen channels put a load on hte servers and in turn creat lag. Plus back a few multigadget updates ago some griefers got creative and was using hte multigadget to grief clubs by puttin in particle bombs and self replicating prims and using the mutligadget as a rezz tool for them.

Yeah, I completely understand why they asked me to remove my multigadget. I also wanted to continue wearing it... so I left. I dont really prefer other people telling me to remove things, or that I'm causing a problem in a public place. #1 top priority is that SL should be fun to me. #2 is that I can be myself. I don't want to spend time abiding by other people's strict guidelines.. I'd rather just leave...

The one thing I find humorous is that some clubs actually strictly try to uphold a no particle, no animation, no primhair, no bling, etc... meanwhile their whole club is built out of a big box of laaaag

Let me ask this do you abide by guidelines set by people you DJ for? I mean I am also hte lead DJ at a club and I have some sorta strict guidelines the DJ's have to agree to before they go in air. Some are common sense while others arent, I understand you probably just freelance and work events you choose to DJ at but sometimes people might say i dont want this type of music played, or this artist played. What do you so int that situation?

Oh, definitely. I'm very professional, and either abide by all of the guidelines to be able to DJ, or respectfully refuse the gig. no harm. I wouldn't get all pissy declaring that I'm da man, and I get to do what I want as a DJ. Basically, the hirer lays out the guidelines and i make the choice if i'd rather follow them and DJ there, or leave and not DJ there

It's worth considering too that not everyone in SL is from the US.

That means we're not all accustomed to or comfortable with the notion that ordinary people wander around with guns and might be willing to use them. Guns look threatening. Many people don't like that.

Cause they usually come with a griefer attached to them.

Guns are worn very frequently by people who aren't griefers. Nor are guns particularly serious weapons compared to the really nasty and often invisible ones.

Anyway, as the OP holstered his guns away when asked to put them away, the club made an extremely assinine call. They have the right to do whatever they like, of course, but people also have a right to take note and avoid them. I'd personally like to know the name of the club, if you don't mind messaging it in-game or in a PM here.

The problem, I think, is that many guns now are equipped with a "quick draw" that effectively means that having them holstered is no different to holding them. I'm not claiming the OPs were like this (wasn't even there) but you can't expect the club owner to have to check. No weapons means No Weapons... holstered or otherwise.

I agree that invisible weapons can be much worse... but there's the comfort thing. Many of us are from outside the US, and seeing guns worn casually is not fun. Invis weapons don't have that effect on people. Of course, once they're used... then one griefer's just the same as another.

*goes back to sleep now*

I still dont understand what it has to do with a US user??? Americans in RL don't find gun weilding a common practice, and usually freaks people out.

Maybe it's a misconception... (probably via hollywood), but the rest of us kinda see US folk as all sleeping with a gun under the pillow. OK, I know it's not going to be accurate, but you seem a lot more comfortable with the concept than the rest of us.

There are countries in europe where anyone can own a fully automatic submachine gun. And yes they do buy them.

And there is Isreal where every 100,000th household has a nuke.

I'd never sleep with a gun under my pillow. Not only do I have kids who sometimes crawl into bed with me after a nightmare, but I live in a place called Windy Point - I would wind up shooting out the windows every time they rattled here.

Just to let everyone know, my club, the GYC, is also a No Guns allowed place.
This also goes for swords, baseballbats, lightsabers.. (yeah it's a raveclub but those are NOT GLOWSTICKS!)you name it. If it looks like any form of weapon, it's not allowed.

So if you do want to come and visit, please wear a nice outfit that doesn't require you to have 'decorative' weaponry.

My theory is: Guns are made for killing. In SL, guns are made for combat sims, or griefing. My club is not a combat sim. I cannot tell if it's decorative on you, or if you are going to whip it out and start shooting. Neither can any of my guests at first glance, so I don't allow them. As Devlin pointed out, in 90% of the cases where a gun came to our club, it has had a griefer attached to it. As a gay furry club, yes, we do attract a lot of negative attention.

Last time I had to argue with someone weilding an AK47 in our club, half of the people in there left. And it wasn't out of sympathy with the person arguing the gun was harmless and he wouldn't start shooting. So no exceptions, no weapons.

Make love, Not war.


PS: hasn't history proven by now that weapons usually bring DEATH and WAR?

PS2: I like guns. I love them. Would have a howitzer in my backyard if it were allowed... But other then cardboard targets, I hate what they are used for. So don't start calling me a gun hating hippie (I'm a gun loving hippie) or point out that I sometimes also have been seen with a .45 strapped to my upper leg, it's true yes. But I do remove it when required or prefered. Case of respect to the owner of the sim/club/place/home whatever.

PS3: Make Love Not War!!!!

Nah, that's Canada

LOL!
I have never in my life owned a gun. Never needed one. I dont hunt, am not a police officer and dont ride a horse and wear a cowboy hat. I am not an anti-gun person as agree or not it is a right to bear arms. Just saying that so you can see two US citizens in a row that dont sleep with a gun under the pillow.

I own a gun - a rifle - because we live in an area where we have actually had big cats and bears wandering around, as well as a couple packs of feral dogs. I've got three kids - I need something a little more significant than my slingshot in that situation.

Around where I am the only bear we see is the one "in the big blue house" when my youngest two are watching PBS or something.
Just dont start sleeping with that rifle under your pillow.. that could make for a heck of a crick in your neck.

No kidding!

The thing about US and non US attitudes towards guns I find interesting. Personally I've never seen a gun in public other than those worn by police and such.

On the other hand I'm not only in the US... I'm a Texan. There's no permit or registration for guns here, no limit to how many you can purchase, only the federal background check, ect. Texas is the defacto gun toting State. ;p As for the CCW, it's actually illegal to NOT conceal a carried handgun. (Rifles on the other hand aren't restricted... oddly enough, and CCW doesn't apply to them.) The situation is not entirely unlike SL, though. It's illegal to carry on any private property if the owner says no guns allowed. (Most businesses have it posted.)

Personally I've never owned a gun, but I'd love one.

As for people being disturbed by the sight of a gun in SL... I can understand that there are places (even in the US) where guns are not looked upon with any kind of affection, but I think it's a bit much to go extending that into a virtual world. You're only looking at colored pixels on a screen after all. I tend to think that the sight of a weapon in SL (aside from possible griefer connotations, ect) should be no more disturbing than on TV or in a movie. /shrug

Still, private property is private property. If the owner says remove all your clothing or leave then you choose between the two. ;p If an owner decides to permanently ban ever 23rd person to enter their club because they hate the number 23 then they can.

And to contradict myself one final time, I don't see why the club owner had to immediately ban the OP when he holstered the guns. Obviously the OP thought holstered was enough, the owner could just have said that it wasn't and he probably would have removed them. Then, mebbe he just didn't like the OP. ;p

I live in Florida, heck we have the stand your ground law. Friendliest gun state in the US.