Predictions, Please: Is it Gonna Take Some Suits to Stop the *hats?

You guys were griefing people. You are not innocent. Your little tool, meant to harm a few, got out of control and took down the entire grid. Lets not pretend you don't know what was going on ok?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH BS

Except I recall seeing private sim owners reporting that they found those balls in their sims. There goes this argument.

Also, I'd say that calling a tool designed to take out a sim "griefsomething" is pretty accurate.

I'm all for prosecution. There are people who have real business that rely on the grid. Some asshat comes in and DOS' the whole system, costs the Lindens money, costs business owners money and is a member of a group known to have griefed in the past. What would Amazon do, if someone DOS'd their commerce platform? What would Ebay do if someone DOS'd their commerce platform?... Prosecute.

If it was a mistake, have the lawyers work it out. They can even confiscate computers and run forensics to determine intent.

As a consultant it's hard enough to convince people to use Second Life as thier platform. Having griefers attacking the grid itself, without fear of prosecution really does make SL nothing more than a toy.

haha, okay. This is called plausible deniability, and it's used by W-hat folks all the time.

No seriously it wasn't me, it was the other guys.

No, it wasn't the W-hat group, it was the W-hatters group, there's a big difference!

No seriously it was my friend, but we didn't mean to.

No seriously but like he forgot to make it not grief everyone, just furries.

No seriously I mean just a few people.

I mean, seriously, just because it's called GrieferSphere RC3 doesn't mean it was a griefing tool, a sphere, or in release candidacy number three.

this crap reminds me of a recent penny arcade comic...

http://penny-arcade.com/view.php?date=2005-10-12&res=l

I'll leave the more intelligent members of our community to decipher the analogies.

LF

Yay, another "guilt by association" post! I am guilty for being a menber of a group! Should this mean that all the members of all the other groups i am in are also guilty? And all the members of the groups they are in?

This posts demonstrates i have out-thought you. backed into a corner you start throwing around "griefer!" and "guilty!" and "grief tools!", you still have provided no proof for ANY of your claims other that the name of the object, which was a joke, all you jhave done is thrown more baseless, proffless claims onto the table.

Seriously. You need to grow up. I wasn't even AWAKE at the time of the incident, and i have never actually griefed someone. The only warning I've ever received was because i accidentally left an object on debug mode and it shouted the names of people who came withing 50m of it. I am not a griefer. Your logic implies that everyone who is a member of w-hat is a griefer who has nothing in their brain but "kill the grid... kill the grid... kill the grid...". If i were a griefer, would i have run 100 laps at the Relay for Life? Would i have even survived since January, when i joined, with only a single warning?

I think my next post on the subject of the grid going down will be my last, my brain is starting to atrophy from trying to explain simple logic.

Let's cut the crap and evoke Godwin's Law already, because I can sense it coming later today anyway.

Hypothetical situation: You and your friends belong to the American Nazi Party. Your friends were out last night, lynching a convenience store owner.

The FBI comes by your house and arrests you.

Fair? Maybe not. But you (hypothetical you, not you specifically) belong to the same group that lynched that convenience store clerk, so you're a prime suspect. On top of that, you hang out with those guys all the time. Plus, you had some incriminating evidence on your computer (used by your friends, no doubt), like maps of where the store owner lives, and such.

Are you guilty? Technically, no. Are you guilty by association? Yes.

The solution? change your association.

zomfg w-hats: serious business

LF

Wow this forum is depressing.. It's weird that you all actually think like this.

I just took a quick look around at all the goings on with this thing, and it's pretty clear to me this was an accident when something that was supposed to be a small-scale annoyance (like you all don't have pushing guns, bombs and things like that) got out of hand because of a very newbie scripter.

SL does not seem to be a world of understanding.. maybe if the community as a whole was less aggressive and more friendly towards all, groups like w-hat wouldn't really be a problem in this way. It seems like 99% of this comes from the majority of SL being uptight folks.

Can I get an amen?

The sad thing is, to the griefer's apologists, it was "just a game" that went down. As if, "it was just a few minutes of rain over your picnic party". Except they conveniently sweep under the rug the "invisible" part... That part is, the Red Alert Scramble at the LL headquarters. I feel sorry for the poor souls that maintain the SL grid. We shall never really know how much this "silly accident" costed (and I don't mean money) them.

hahahahhhahahhahhahahahhahhhahahhahahhhahahahhahahaahhahahahaha

*BREATHES*

hahhahahhhhahahahahhaaahhhhahahahahhahahhahahahahahhahahahahahaha

More likely - a bit of asshattery got outta control really quickly in the hands of someone who's kung fu wasn't quite as strong as they thought...

Seriously - a self replicating object called 'greifersphere' and I'm supposed to think it was intended to rez flowers and give you a hug or some shit?

I think if you put your dick in the drawer you can't complain if someone slams it.

If retardo-the-great gets a lil ban action I won't lose sleep over it.... I wouldn't go slamming a whole group for it though, just open the draw a lil wider - only a matter of time till someone else puts their cock in it.

Siggy, you're just jealous you didn't think of it first

Well you may have been in bed but you certainly seem well informed. You seem quite certain that the name of the item was a joke.

Here's the thing. You joined a group that's well known for griefing. I mean its not like this is a secret. Not only is this group known for griefing -- they are known for it in different games. There are people that have seen them on the SA forums bragging about this. So I'm not having the pity for you even if you, personally, are innocent of any griefing anytime anywhere. You may not have known what you were getting into when you joined, but you certainly do now. And yes, you tend to get known by the company you keep. It may not be fair, or even logical, but that is the way the world works.

Regardless, this wasn't an accident in that neither the name nor the intent was meant as a harmless thing. The SCOPE of the incident might be accidental -- but the initial intent was not.

Three or four hours of their time, most of which was restarting grid servers, from what i gather from this thread

I doubt that anyone just "happens" to be in a group. I also tend to believe that the group a player voluntarily joins says something about the player. If a group's focus is negative (i.e., has a history of ongoing griefing), I'd expect a truly "innocent" player to leave and create as much distance as possible between himself and members of that group.

hehe you obviously never saw my foray into 'self rezzing jengo towers' - was a day of sandbox crashes I'd sooner forget

"Amusing grief" cleans up after itself - you rely on the 'no harm, no foul' school of thought that if you did no *real* harm then its all shits and giggles and you don't get AR'ed..

Splody Cow is a good example of that... sim gets lagged to high heaven for a minute or two and when the particle clouds settle theres no crap left behind - we all have a giggle and get on with life.

Oh thats ok. That happens every time someone with one of those fucking particle poofs teleports out too. Well, except the giggling. Now if they exploded into chunks too... (make that for me, Siggy!?)

Oh yes, it was nothing. So there you are, enjoying your WEEKEND, from your work week which is pretty much 60+ hours at this point because you've got a major release coming out the next day and you want to be well-rested and ready to deal with it come that time, and some asshat decides to uh, what did you call it? oh yes, a joke. Some asshat decides to pull a joke and it takes down the entire grid. All of a sudden you have to stop what you were doing, haul yourself into the office and reboot everything. Other people have to start looking at logs to find out who did this and happened.

But hey - what the hell. You were in bed. YOU weren't being dragged into the office on a Sunday. So it was only three or four hours. No big deal. Riiiiiight.

This same cadre of people that lurk around the oh so cleverly built 'Fetus Farm' north of Sylvina have been harrassing the phoenix spa and environs for weeks now, and I'm tired of excuses. The guy who did it was in Sylvina when that sim went down, and popped back into world right next to me in a flurry of racist stereotype pixellated chicken drumsticks when it came back up. The owner of the land he was on minutes before the attack had been in a little war all day long banning and sweeping him from the land.

So sorry we ain't buying what you're selling.

No way was it an attack against a single sim gone wrong. The griefshperes were replicating all over the grid. They, or some sort of generating seed, must must have been planted. That would imply intent of damage on a large scale.

Thats a pretty cool idea! 'Splody Siggy!' something to work on when SL comes back up!

You've never BEEN in a server room, have you ?

That's very appropos LF.

I think you know how I feel about this. Suffice it to say I had a similiar inworld experience to yours with them (was invited over to "try and find some common ground". Let's see, there was an iRC prim relay spamming dozens and dozens of racial and homophobic epithets, shooting, bombing, and negrating. One of the group's leaders was present - so this was hardly a "fringe" or "rogue" element incident. I reported the incident, and received an email back from Michael Linden stating that they couldn't take action on the iRC relayed chat - because it was a relay. W-Hat surely new of this loophole.

The reason I was annoyed with them in the first place is because of a couple of in-world incidents, not the least of which in which the entered my friend's home on cubes and started griefing (shooting and talking smack) a friend and I, accusing us of all sorts of things (sexual deviancy, etc.), just because we were sitting there talking.

Now, as you have stated and we are currently observing, they will throw out a myriad of bullshit excuses, claim that they are victims, and on and on and on. The "I am not even in that group but you guys are wrong in coloring them as a group" point guards will come out on their high horses (I have reason to believe that these folks are indeed group members, placed strategically for just such incidents - they just don't "officially" join the group for obvious reasons). A bevy of people with one post will come out of the woodwork and make all kinds of insipid, vapid little remarks. Then they will form a new group, and we will be back here in a few weeks watching the cycle repeat itself.

One might ask - if they are really not up to no good - why do they need to keep reinventing themselves under new group names every few weeks or months?

I find the timing to be quite suspect.

Ya think?

I've seen this exact strategy performed to perfection on forums of an MORPG (*cough*lineage2*cough*)

Sav