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huh? free stuff is bad for sl? |
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
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05-25-2005 17:55
i think that's what i read...? what's that about?
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AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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05-25-2005 17:58
It's an oversimplification of a much more complex dynamic, and a favorite mantra of our most prolific malcontent (and minion). He postulates that the ill will some people feel towards land barons is actually a clash of civizations between people who believe everything should be free and those who see SL as a business opportunity. In short, it's a black and white view of something that's not black and white, and much ado about nothing.
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 My other hobby: www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight |
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Jillian Callahan
Rotary-winged Neko Girl
Join date: 24 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,766
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05-25-2005 18:05
Petit-fours should be free!
 My favorite example of what good freebies do for SL is Crystalshard's media stream controller script. She not only gave everyone a truly beautiful bit of base code to work with, she gave us a bar that had to be beat in order to have a saleable product, improving overall quality. Yay freebies!  _____________________
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Torley Linden
Enlightenment!
Join date: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 16,530
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05-25-2005 18:28
Free stuff is bad, huh? Then DOWN WITH THAT LINDEN FREE CONTENT! *raises giant watermelon pitchfork and charges towards the Linden Village* WHO'S COMING WITH ME???
Really though, free products are sacrificial in a sense. They may be available at no cost to the community, but the creator's sweat and blood may be marked all over the timeline -- it was most certainly their hard work for our enjoyment. _____________________
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Susie Boffin
Certified Nutcase
Join date: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 2,151
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05-25-2005 18:44
OMG StoneSelf I hope you didn't set off endless pages of insane babbling and metaphysicial mumbojumbo.
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Foulcault Mechanique
Father Cheesemonkey
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 557
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In some ways it is
05-25-2005 18:51
I think money is part of the problem BUT
If you look at it from this perspective: A recent known problem brought to us by the Lindens is the fact of how much "stuff" we have in our inventories. This "Stuff" also includes all those nice freebies we get. Unfortunatly as I found out when I first got here alot of this free stuff is doubles and triples of the same item just renamed or such. Alot of places use "free stuff" as a ply to get you to thier shop. Personally I reffer all new people to Fazzbinder's pub which actually has alot of freebies already in a small "keg". Just click and WHAM you get a nice fodler of all the items in yoru inventory from that keg. _____________________
Foulcault
"Keep telling yourself that and someday you just might believe it." "Every Technomage knows the 14 words that will make someone fall in love with you forever, but she only needed one. "Hello"" Galen from Babylon 5 Crusade I'm moving this over to Off-Topic for further Pez ruminations. |
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
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05-25-2005 18:53
OMG StoneSelf I hope you didn't set off endless pages of insane babbling and metaphysicial mumbojumbo. 18 out of 24 voters say no!  _____________________
AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
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Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
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05-25-2005 18:54
The tribe has spoken!
haha well SS, the poll was skewed - steered away from where it was obviously going by alt accounts  _____________________
The Second Life forums are living proof as to why it's illegal for people to have sex with farm animals.
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread |
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Prokofy Neva
Virtualtor
Join date: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 3,698
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05-25-2005 19:47
It's an oversimplification of a much more complex dynamic, and a favorite mantra of our most prolific malcontent (and minion). He postulates that the ill will some people feel towards land barons is actually a clash of civizations between people who believe everything should be free and those who see SL as a business opportunity. In short, it's a black and white view of something that's not black and white, and much ado about nothing. Um, I'm not your minion, A. B, you're oversimplifying and caricaturizing my views on this as you speak. There are indeed clashes of civilizations but they aren't all black and white. I've written a lot on this subject already, so I'm not sure why you all are rehearsing this right now. Free things are loss leaders. They're fine. But don't pretend they aren't about being a loss leader to get newbs into your store. And that's fine. Just don't cover that up with a patina of selflessness because it's...a loss-leader to get newbs into your store. Like the money trees, which are designed to glue newbs to your lot to make them generate dwell lol. Too much free stuff saps initiative and gluts the economy at the lower levels, where newbies could be making and selling cheap and simple items to each other. _____________________
Rent stalls and walls for $25-$50/week 25-50 prims from Ravenglass Rentals, the mall alternative.
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Susie Boffin
Certified Nutcase
Join date: 15 Sep 2004
Posts: 2,151
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05-25-2005 19:50
All I want to do is make pies and give them away for free.
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Foulcault Mechanique
Father Cheesemonkey
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 557
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05-25-2005 19:53
All I want to do is make pies and give them away for free. NO PIES FOR YOU! _____________________
Foulcault
"Keep telling yourself that and someday you just might believe it." "Every Technomage knows the 14 words that will make someone fall in love with you forever, but she only needed one. "Hello"" Galen from Babylon 5 Crusade I'm moving this over to Off-Topic for further Pez ruminations. |
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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05-25-2005 19:53
Um, I'm not your minion, A. B, you're oversimplifying and caricaturizing my views on this as you speak. There are indeed clashes of civilizations but they aren't all black and white. A. I was talking about your minion B. Peel away the layers of ovely verbose epics you've written on the subject and it's a concept that is a very black and white oversimplification (as is claiming that all freebies are loss leaders). No need to rehash it. _____________________
My other hobby: www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight |
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Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
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05-25-2005 19:59
I musta screwed up - all my free stuff is at the free stuff store....
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The Second Life forums are living proof as to why it's illegal for people to have sex with farm animals.
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread |
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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05-25-2005 20:01
I musta screwed up - all my free stuff is at the free stuff store.... LOL Siggy. You're not very good at this loss leader stuff I guess _____________________
My other hobby: www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight |
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
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05-25-2005 20:03
Free things are loss leaders. not all free things are loss leaders. it isn't all about money. _____________________
AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
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05-25-2005 20:06
Free things are loss leaders. They're fine. But don't pretend they aren't about being a loss leader to get newbs into your store. And that's fine. Just don't cover that up with a patina of selflessness because it's...a loss-leader to get newbs into your store. Like the money trees, which are designed to glue newbs to your lot to make them generate dwell lol. Too much free stuff saps initiative and gluts the economy at the lower levels, where newbies could be making and selling cheap and simple items to each other. _____________________
AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
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Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
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05-25-2005 20:06
LOL Siggy. You're not very good at this loss leader stuff I guess Bah , I heard the economicon was all invented by H.P. Lovecraft anwyays... _____________________
The Second Life forums are living proof as to why it's illegal for people to have sex with farm animals.
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread |
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Malachi Petunia
Gentle Miscreant
Join date: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 3,414
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05-25-2005 20:32
Like the money trees, which are designed to glue newbs to your lot to make them generate dwell lol. I'm Feted so I don't give a flying fuck about dwell lol. I hosted a tree lol. I expected and had a net loss from it lol. I hosted it anyway. _____________________
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Osprey Therian
I want capslocklock
Join date: 6 Jul 2004
Posts: 5,049
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05-25-2005 20:38
When I first arrived I picked up the free things that interested me and tore them apart to see how they worked. That and clicking on everything to see how many prims and what contents were inside helped me learn how to make things. I like to figure things out on my own, and the free things were very useful.
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Stromko Perkins
Registered User
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 87
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05-25-2005 20:52
I love free stuff!
I'm of the opinion that 99% of newbies aren't willing to invest enough actual USD's to buy enough L$'s that they can afford the basic staples. Freebies make Secondlife more friendly, it makes it the anti-There, and it is a bulwark against mindless greed and cynicism. There's a fair amount of overpriced $@*! in SL, stuff that people stole off the internet or the free scripts board and sell off for many thousands of Lindendollars. Thank heavens there's other people that will spend 40 L$ uploading textures and then turn around and give the fruits of their time and energy for nothing. |
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
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05-26-2005 11:10
pro free stuff:
1) raises the bar on creativity 2) players create free stuff to build community 3) can use free stuff to learn how to build 4) free stuff makes sl friendlier 5) free stuff is not like there 6) free stuff is against greed 7) free stuff lets people know there are generous people in sl  free stuff gives new residents something to consider before spending moneypro-con free stuff: 1) philosophical differences 2) linden free stuff 3) player's effort put into free stuff 4) free stuff is a loss leader 5) free stuff is part of the sl market system con free stuff: 1) free stuff is bad for business 2) free stuff clutters inventory 3) free stuff as loss leader is getting loyal newbies 4) free stuff can be 'dumping' - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dumping _____________________
AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
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Cindy Claveau
Gignowanasanafonicon
Join date: 16 May 2005
Posts: 2,008
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05-26-2005 11:43
Aside from agreeing with Stoneself's entire list of pro-freestuff, I have a question:
Too much free stuff saps initiative and gluts the economy at the lower levels, where newbies could be making and selling cheap and simple items to each other. Ok, fair enough. I'm a newb. Only been in SL about a week or so. But I have YET to see where any of my meager talents in scripting or 3D design could generate income making "cheap and simple items". From what I see so far, it's going to take me at least a month to get up to speed on the gritty of LSL scripting syntax alone. One, most of the "cheap and simple stuff" is already out there, usually overpriced at stores, NOT given away for free. Two, not every newcomer to SL is experienced with Java or Photoshop or Poser. I'd even venture to guess that the majority of people who've come to SL in the last 6 months have never touched any of those programs (I'm willing to be disillusioned on that assertion but only with some hard statistics, it's a gut feeling I get from meeting SLers in world). So again, where are these 'cheap and simple items' we newbs are supposed to be able to make and sell to each other? I'd love to know, because as it stands it seems to me there are three ways to generate income in SL when you're new: (1) Come in heavy with scripting/3D design expertise; (2) Buy $L from Anshe or GOM; (3) Strip and/or cyber for money, if your Av is female and if you can manage to do so in the already-glutted Adult industry market in SL. (Note: 3 is sarcasm, I honestly don't think it's a reliable way to profit. I only added it because I know some women who think they can seriously augment their RL incomes in the SL sex industry - color me skeptical) What's option 4? I'm genuinely curious. Then I can spread the word to my fellow newbs so we can actually buy houses and land and clothing in SL like the rest of you. Meanwhile, I'll be over here in the corner plugging away with my copy of Poser, trying to get that damned blouse to conform. Cindy _____________________
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blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
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05-26-2005 11:51
It's an oversimplification of a much more complex dynamic, and a favorite mantra of our most prolific malcontent (and minion). Hey Chip, how about getting that big chip off your shoulder? _____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :
"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches." |
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blaze Spinnaker
1/2 Serious
Join date: 12 Aug 2004
Posts: 5,898
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05-26-2005 11:54
Free stuff, in some ways, can be used as a type of 'dumping'.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dumping Classically, dumping is a subset of what is known as predatory pricing. Dumping in this sense is the act of selling a product at a loss now in order to drive competitors out of business, with the goal of raising prices when they do in order to recoup the investment. It is illegal in the same way that many other anticompetitive behaviours are. However, in practice, it is enforced far less than other antitrust actions. In international trade law however, dumping is defined as the act of a manufacturer in one country exporting its product to another country at an export price below the domestic price (normal value) in the manufacturer's own country. _____________________
Taken from The last paragraph on pg. 16 of Cory Ondrejka's paper "Changing Realities: User Creation, Communication, and Innovation in Digital Worlds :
"User-created content takes the idea of leveraging player opinions a step further by allowing them to effectively prototype new ideas and features. Developers can then measure which new concepts most improve the products and incorporate them into the game in future patches." |
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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05-26-2005 11:56
Hey Chip, how about getting that big chip off your shoulder? har har. I just call em like I see em Blaze. It's the ideas that made me dislike the person, not the other way around. And wouldn't your post qualify as a pointless personal attack? Why yes, yes it would _____________________
My other hobby: www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight |