anti-griefer / security groups in SL

I logged in the other day to find a couple having cybersex, in open chat, in a house they'd set up in the middle of the Stratics Sandbox. That is public land.

They were given two minutes to clear up and get the hell outta there. That is not what sandboxes are for. Apparently one of them had a house, but they just got a bit... carried away in the heat of the moment.

There is no excuse for such behaviour. Who knows how many genuine users had gone elsewhere because of that and/or little room left to build

Broccoli

I have to admit to thinking that's pretty damned funny

I thought it was Funny Too, If someone did that on My Land, I'd Boot, and ban them. I'd Laugh, But i'd still Boot and Ban them. The one has Little to do with the Other.

I have a Good sense of Humor, but i also have a sense of propriety.

Well over a year ago, there was a Faily well known griefer. Not one of the sorts who Crashes sims, or shoots people but he did Dress in Embarassing Fashion, and Follow people about Teasing them in Various ways. He tried it with me, and i Teased right Back. I was Polite to him, But if he Joked, I Joked back. after a while, If i asked him to Give me a moment because i was dealing with something, He would. He Listened to me simply because i Did take the Joke. Now it wouldn't be the same had he Not shown me a Little respect, Or if he Had Attacked me in some way. But he didn't. We were able to come to Some kind of Peace because i wasn't Immediately Hostile to him. He got Banned of course, and i haven't seen him since, But i Do remember him, and think well of him. He Respected Limits. Knowing when a Joke is No longer a Joke.

I wish every person who styled themselves a griefer had as much Class, But that is the thing about Class. It's Rare.

I think it Highly Unlikely you will run into another like Him.

Angel.

You people do realize that this stuff is not real, right?

I'm not really standing on the roof of someone's house or flying around in a helicopter. It's all pretend.

Despite us being an actual SL combat group, the Federation's literally went on hunts for greifers in the sandboxes. Of course, we tend to not do much to them because people would just report us...*sigh*

And before you post, Kalel, yes, Tom's Federation did greif Cordova, but not really. They were more like an anti greifer, hell, I don't know. As soon as I joined we left the sandboxes in a jiffy.

Now, since I figure some people enjoy stories, and I'm kinda bored at the moment, let's see some of the most memorable anti-greifing times....

Area: Weapons Testing Sandbox
Greifers: 2, not working together.

I was showing my friend this large, premade outpost type building when out of nowhere, hundreds of little panels called "BATRAPE", which had Batman on them and played a retarded sound, swarm me. So then I see the owner fly by (In a beggining AV...what a coincedink.) and stop him (No caging, either.).

I tell him to stop what he's doing before I snap at him and completely go balls out on him, and another guy basically just said "Oh F*ck you" (Censored, cause I don't cuss on forums. I get a weird feeling I'll get suspended for cussing on it.) and the greifer left. I explained to the guy what happened, and hhe went off on me, basically saying "If you don't like getting greifed, GTFO of SL." and started spamming freebie C4 around me, causing MAJOR lag, etc. He hasn't logged on ever again.

Area: Weapons Testing Sandbox
Grefers: 1

Basically, I was chasing a "Famous" greifer with a friend, so I could simply ask them why they do what they do, what they get from it, etc..

We both had self protection with us, but it was mainly for show. (Greifer hunting with shotguns, priceless. We never fired, by the by.)

We spotted the greifer, and instantly started a pursuit (Still not firing) and eventually stopped her. When asked why she does what she does, she caged us in a cage that must somehow be made by basically hacking (But I could be wrong, as I'm a moron in scripting.) that prevented us from getting out of it while riding a non physical vehicle. She still is around the same sandbox, and she's the only one with these big, black traps that'll keep you in the center of them no matter what you do besides TP to another sim.

Wait, you HAD to? If it wasn't on your land, then I don't belive you have the right to cover it. If you were a staff member of the group who owned the land, then you should have had return rights.

It all comes down to jurisdiction.

Obviously, the final word on all these matters is Linden Labs, yet they themselves proclaim themselves not to be the police. Landowners are empowered to do pretty much whatever they like on their own lands, and get away with it. That's their right as given to them by Linden Labs. Linden Labs is the source of their authority.

That leaves the matter in the hands of the citizens, which many presume to mean that they can just create some group to go run down griefers and do what they please to them. Unfortunately, this is usually done without any clear source of authority, and usually they have noone's support but their own. That respect has to be earned, one citizen at a time.

The only way a group like that can work is if they have the public trust, and the public suport, of the people they're trying to defend. That's why the Green Lanterns group works, and why the Justice League works. There are a few others, but not many.

Power to make change in SL comes only when a group of people get together to delegate that power to somebody else, so that those designated persons speak with the voices of the accord. This accord is hard to come by, and cannot be acquired simply by the declaration of one's good intention. The road to hell is paved with that.

There's a distinction between power of community and power to enforce. Unless you're a Linden, your power to "enforce" is probably implemented via ToS violations.

Edit Below:
Power to enforce WHAT? That's another important question.

That's always Been the reasoning of the griefers. "It's a game so i can do whatever i want".
Yes, it's a Game, and No None of it is real, But Guess what? You are Still Interfering with OTHER peoples enjoyment of the Game environment. Real or Not, doesn't Matter, You're still going to get Booted, and Banned, and if you Keep it up for Too Long, then suspended or Barred from SL entirely isn't out of the question. Yes, it's a Game, but the Game Has Rules.

Angel.

I love it when some all knowing person informs us that Second Life isn't real. Are we all dreaming this or perhaps we are all dead? Do we pay unreal money to be here? Are computers real or just a hallucination?

Oh,and by the way, I have a no weapons policy on my land which means everyone with a weapon gets booted equally whether they are part of a fake police force or not. And I die laughing every time I see some flailing avatar go zooming into the air.

I feel there are places for Police Forces and Anti-Griefer groups in Second Life. I think they should even get paid for their protective services. However, I feel the place for them is on land that their presence is approved of by the owner of that land. I don't think policing of public areas is a good idea. Also, I feel that these protective groups should be granted land rights by approving land owners. This is the most effective way to get rid of the griefers....freeze, eject, ban; then, file an abuse report. While I will admit weapons, cages, and toys of torment would be much more fun for running off a griefer... but that just opens you up to a TOS violation. I would hate to see people with good intentions get banned because a griefer filled out an abuse report. I would recommend pagers on the protected land that would alert the police force if the owner is not online. Signs could be posted so visitors know they can page someone in case of problems. Also, to prevent abuse by the police force itself the land owner should probably screen the people in these groups thoroughly. It prob wouldn't hurt to have a comments box visitors can drop a notecard in to tell the owner how well the police force is doing and register complaints.

If you'd like to show me which rules I'm breaking by visiting someone's land and making sarcastic comments, I'll be happy to check them out.

When you visit my land, I have no rules. I'd prefer if you didn't shoot me with guns. But hey, whatevs, right? No big whoop. My land is +build, +script, +push, and -whininess.

If anyone's griefing, it's you:

1. Intolerance
Combating intolerance is a cornerstone of Second Life's Community Standards. Actions that marginalize, belittle, or defame individuals or groups inhibit the satisfying exchange of ideas and diminish the Second Life community as whole.

People who wear fake guns as affectations are expressing their personality. They are not wearing fake guns to insult you in any way. I understand if you ask them not to do it on your land. But orbiting them for fun smacks of base griefing. You are a sad bully.

You asked, I answered:



On Suzie Boffins Weapons Policy;
It's her sim, and therefore, Her rules, But i Have seen it done BETTER on other Sims. I agree that people Do wear weapons in SL as much as a Fashion statement as for defence. I am for the most Part Not without my Katana, it Goes with the rest of my Clothing BUT Beyond having a Draw script, and animation it is an Unscripted Prop. Be that as it May, the Other Sims i spoke of with weapons restrictions specificly forbid BRANDISHING your weapon. Having it in hand as preperation for use.
One issue Suzie's policy does Not address is the rather Large preponderance of Invisible weapons available. If asked, Of course i would take off my sword, I have done Many times, but while you are Paying attention to the sword you See, it's the PsiTEC weapons Platform you Cannot see that holds the REAL power. I am NOT disarmed. Suzies Policy, while Giving the appearance of being Proactive, and Making a Strong statement on her disapproval of weapons is More likely to Punish the Innocent while Ignoring the ones MOST likely to cause grief. They are Well aware you will pay a Lot of negative attention to someone bristling with Pistols, so if they are Intent on doing No Good, thier toys will be Concealed.
Again i say, Her Sim, Her rules, and Should i ever go there All my weapons, Visible and Invisible will be in my Inventory because i am a Person of some Integrity. BUT, Not everyone is.

Japanese saying: "The Wise Cat always hides it's Claws."

Angel.

Yes I HAD to. It was a public sandbox where commercial activity is a violation of the use rules. I had the right to cover it just as much as I have the right to cover anything for sale in the sandboxes, or at the freebie bazaar. You aren't allowed to sell/do commercial activity there, and I used a nonviolent means, within TOS to prevent further breaking of those rules.

If they aren't Lindens they can't put tip jars, gambling, or anything commercial including advertising in the sandboxes.



My land has a weapon ban. Unless you are one of the few friends we have allowed to wear weapons on the land, if you don't remove it promptly, you will be ejected and banned. Regardless of why they are wearing guns, its not allowed on my property.

If a Linden was on my land with a rifle, I would ask them to remove the weapon. It is less a matter of who it is, but more a matter of being free from unauthorized weapons on my land. Besides the Lindens well enough 'armed' without the rifle - this is only a metaphor.

The section of the rules you quoted talk about harassing other users. The scenario I described didn't say anything about stalking or harassment, did it?

I guess that depends on your definition of harassment. If having an unknown person land on your property falls under your definition of harassment, then you're a manic paranoid. You can feel free to erect a wall of mean red words around your land that will keep everyone out. Then you will be free to have a little cry all by yourself on your well-protected land.

Not over my dead SL body..... (not I approve this kind protective groups anyway)

Morwen.

Same goes for my land.... I will ask friendly... I will ask again more direct.. after that not listening to my request is eject & ban.

Morwen.

I build over those too. Usually the perpetrators are long gone anyway.



As mentioned previously, what about PsiTecs? Do people need to remove those as well? I bet you've never asked someone to take one off, because you don't consider them a real weapon. So essentially what you are banning is collections of prims in the shape of a gun.

I don't understand the "I don't allow guns" mentality. Fake guns are exactly the same as fake jewelry. They're there to adorn an avatar, not for shooting people. What if I want to be the Lone Ranger?

If you really want to remove weapons, make people take everything off. Strip right down to their skin. Don't forget to do a body cavity search. They might have a grenade crammed up there.



You so wouldn't tell a Linden to remove their gun. They would go all crazy on you and chop you in half like a ninja.

The protective forces I need already have land rights. My family and the Lindens.

The police greifers can stay away.

It is called respect for others.

You know, the concept you should have learned at about age 6.

Yes psitec too. Even Force Prophecies if they use it for combat uses.

I would indeed tell a Linden to remove a gun, and its not like jewelry, I don't care if you want to be the Lone Ranger. Do it elsewhere or do it unarmed. Don't assume on how I feel about what is and isn't, or what I consider real weapons.

Obviously you lack understanding of a Lindens understanding and restraint. If they did that they could be sanctioned from their RL job.

It can be the same thing. For example, participants in the Banlink system (http://slbanlink.com) share information about griefers, so that if you grief in one person's land and get banned, that ban applies to all the lands subscribing to that person's ban list. It's a trusted peer system, and it works. This is the power of community coming together to enforce the will of the community to ban/eject the little thugs that make life unpleasant for the rest of us.

All this is, of course, completely within the ToS.

Kalel, you're the only group I'd trust to watch my land, if I let any in game group aside from family and Lindens do it. Not just from posts here (actually none from posts here) but from in game experience and research. Nice satellite btw.

I was just saying an Anti-Grief group can be an option for certain land owners. It's not for everyone. Generally the Lindens will not interfere with private sims, even if someone is bogging it down with lots of scripts in an attempt to crash it. They are busy people and the land owners themselves cannot be online 24/7.