The King is Dead

Colette if you are going to keep posting to this thread, I'm going to have to ask you to buy some bonds.

Since when do you need to be the victim of a Scam Artist to call someone a Scam Artist.

Based on the usual sl stock value formula (return on investment in 12 months) they're worth 0,12 L$ each.

So it would seem fair that the debt conversion of 50mill L$ would be converted to 416million bonds, however i suspect that would make it impossible for the bond manager to pay 0,01 L$ in dividents. Ithink we have a problem, either way the bonds will either be unprofitable to pay any divident at all, or the price will go through the floor, or both. Converting them by the imaginary value of 1 L$ each (while 7 day average is 0.19 L$), that's just interresting Afterall, it's an interresting virtual world, full of variety and disorder almost like RL.

Ok, last Question;

Does this WSE Make money by Commissions on Transactions?

Angel.

I've been paying commissions on the stocks I'm selling

Hmmm .. thats a GOOD question.

Do you realize that everything in the whois database is public information? That anyone can get it free by going to one of the many whois websites on the net?

Yes they do. I believe it's 3%.

Yes, of course. On SELL orders only. 3% of the L$ value of the transaction.

I suspect with the amount of money at stake, at some point a jury may get to decided if there was "no crime committed".

gah so everyone selling these Junk Bonds gets to pay WSE (and Nick P) for the privledge.

And you don't need a web browser to get it. (someone mentioned having it show up in one's browser history.)

so he`s making money from ppl`s panic not to mention buying the shares back (with what money, isn`t he broke) at an all time low

yeah i misread her post i thought i was being chastized for posting public information now i'm not so sure..

anyhow for those that dont know about this public information now its there. /shrug

or in a linux shell type: whois ginkofinancial

now the blame isn`t urs as people can fetch it for them selfs if they want to

This statement is absolutely worthless without an audit trail.

Thank you Justin.

Ok, Let me preface this by saying NO wrongdoing has been proven on the part of Nicholas Portocarrero or the other Ginko, or WSE Officers, so everything i say here is Speculation.

I'll walk through it slowly so people can Follow the ethical reasoning here.

~You Invest in an on line investment scheme.
~Later, when you attempt to cash out you find there is no money.
~Others find the same realization, and Enquiries are made of the Investment company officers
~No satisfactory answers, and no repayment is Forthcoming
~You, and others now STRONGLY suspect your money has been Misappropriated.
~Pressure is brought to bear on the Investment Company Including suggestions of Legal Intervention.
~The Investment company, by way of appeasement suggests moving the Debt to ANOTHER Company, ALSO owned by them and ALSO suspected of Questionable business practices.
~The Purpose of this Transfer is this, The Investment company will Not give you back your money, Instead, they will call your Investments Bonds, and allow you to SELL your Portion of the Bad dept to some OTHER Poor Unsuspecting Rube.

The idea here is, YOU become complicit in this Investment company's wrongdoings buy ASSISTING them to Steal from Other people Just so You can get YOUR money back.
On Top of that, the Investment company CONTINUES to profit from their Misdeeds by Charging Further Commissions by brokering the transfer of shares the Vendors Know, or Strongly suspect are Utterly, and completely WORTHLESS.

On Top of that, In Order to Get your money back You have to find buyers who are unaware of the past histories of Both companies AND the existing Dispute and either keep your Mouth Shut about your suspicions Or Misinform them in order to Sell off your shares.

The investment company continues to be a Theif, and that's bad, but what is worse is,By taking part in this sceme Now Not only are YOU a theif as well, you are ALSO a hypocryte.

All Purely hypothetical of course.

Does this scenario raise ANY Moral, Ethical, or Legal Alarm bells with any of the Investors at all??

Angel.

Wonder what Little Nick P told his Momma when she found the cookie Jar empty and crumbs leading to his room...


"But Mom! Its complicated."

Is kinda of Interesting since Nick P suggested that people who thought Ginko was a Ponzi Scheme should request him to delete their account balance so they wouldnt be assisting in suspected Fraud.

This is what bothers me now the "crime" which of course nick says doesn't exist is being perpetuated by people who are desperate to get their lost investment back so they will in fact now ad to the mountain of problems and rip other people off in an effort to get the money they were ripped off for

I'm not trying to derail this thread but this is what happened with the "business in a box" concept. People started sellling either stolen or free content and maybe some other low quality stuff for large amounts of lindens 30k ish or more even at time. The guy opens the box realizes he has been ripped off but wants to recouperate his losses. He can't sell the actual merchandise in a store so he pulls the same stunt for a smaller amount of money and makes his money back and possibly a profit. Then of course the people who bought this from him repeat the process trying to recoup their loss and sell it but for less still in an attempt to make the money they lost back. New players ripping off other new players and it just escalates.

Now this is happening with these bonds. They have no value because we have no proof that they ahve value we have a failed "bank" err whatever its called this week that says they have value but a large number of people pretty much realize they have been ripped off and on top of it something illegal might be happening, but in their desperation they sell their "perpetual bonds" then the next guy finds he has somethign that is worthless and he tries to sell it down the line. Each person is ripping the next person off in order to get back what they lost.

Looks the same to me only they are doing it with something completely intangible and more mysterious either way selling an item that has no value in an effort to get back what you lost is not something that is even justifiable. What people should be doing is finding a way to get back what was taken from them and not just dump it on the shoulders of some other poor unsuspecting sap.

yes i was trying to figure out what was idiotic or irrespsonsible about getting information which anyone can pull up in a minute or less if they know how because its on a public database..

Two questions, the first a matter of objective fact (I hope)

1. Back @ #91, Nic P seems to deny that Ginko paid US$100K salaries. But in some thread somewhere, somebody (John Horner, maybe?) seemed to have definitive info about salaries paid out by Ginko that I remember as being over US$100K in at least one instance. Perhaps I'm just confused, but... is there somewhere this is established, one way or another, not subject to dispute?

2. Back @ #164, Domaiv Decosta points out: "Seems to me that genko are trying to resolve this. They could have just disapeared, and with LL policy of privacy and not getting involved with resident desputes regarding money, there would be no comeback on genko." And that's what has me puzzled, too. Now, I'm under no illusion that this was anything but a fairly simple swindle from the beginning, and can't imagine that there's any possible way anybody associated with Ginko can redeem themselves and have a future of any kind in SL finances. So, why not just take (the rest of) the money and run?

Because he's trying to do the right thing? Because he's trying to make people believe he's trying to do the right thing? Neither is plausible, at least to me.

It seems simply delusional to think that converting deposits to GPB paper at par value is somehow better for depositors than just giving everybody 20 cents on their invested dollar--it's not like this is reducing the damage Ginko has done to its investors. And it's not like this will materially affect any prosecution. So why even bother? Why didn't Nic simply close his SL account and disappear?

I was under the impression it was definitely over 100k .. he might have taken exception to my use fo "friends" i dunno

Why Disapear? Hes done better. Hes making a TON of his debt vanish. And even getting some new investors in on this new Bond deal.

If he disapears he needs to start over , all he needs to do at the moment is Ponzi Float himself back into Business.

Like any criminal out there they have their addiction. Stealing and scamming is truly addicting for many criminal types. They will stay till they are satisfied they have gotten away with as much as they can before they disappear without a trace and pop up somewhere else to pull this all over again with another group of people. In short "he's not quite done with us yet"

Now you've got me thinking again.

Maybe they were going to just run with the money, but have realised they could squeeze out a few more $L with comision through WSE